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Showing content with the highest reputation on 10/16/2020 in all areas

  1. Hawk and TLR share that idea of TWTW trait a little too much....it couldn’t be because they are both past their times could it....shocker right there. If you are in the hawk, TLR and Dusty Baker let’s manage straight from the gut instinct it’s a hard pass for me with anyone with that mentality at that age. You have to have a good understanding of advanced stats and have that gut feeling from time to time. I feel like some of these stats for these older managers is the equivalent to teaching your grandparents how to use a computer or smartphone.
    5 points
  2. It's so hard. On one hand you have a survey of baseball executives and Hahns peers who do this job for a living, understanding his job in intimate detail. On the other hand this guy on the internet thinks we should hold 2013 against Hahn.
    4 points
  3. The Sox were showing us what a full season would look like when the season ended. It wasn't 95 wins.
    4 points
  4. Another person talking about "logic" who clearly doesn't understand it. You're suggesting our mindset should be to stay with the expectations on paper before the beginning of the season and ignore how things have actually been going accordingly? That's one of the most obtuse things I've ever heard in my life. So once they win some arbitrary amount of games we might have expected before the season we should just stop expecting wins and stop TRYING to win? Please don't talk about logic and fallacies because this post is such a bizarre violation of common sense it's staggering. We actually were in line to win the division. Our manager arguably cost us that, as well as good seeding. Who gives a fuck what people expected at the beginning of the season? Good Lord...
    4 points
  5. Robert doesn't really strike me as an analytical player. It really seems like he has no plan at the plate half the time. You'd think he'd lay off sliders 5 feet off the plate more if he was looking at how pitchers were attacking him. If he's trying to improve on that aspect, then that's great for him and this franchise. If he can just have good at bats 2/3 of the time, he's going to be extremely dangerous.
    3 points
  6. the fuck would he have to be bitter about? Good lord this dude quit on the team. The revisionist history around the end of his tenure is pointless. He's never managing in Chicago again and 99% he'll never manage anywhere again.
    3 points
  7. Ok, so the only thing we know for certain is that it won't be Hasler.
    3 points
  8. No, not really. A 2/3 IMO.
    3 points
  9. 3 points
  10. So your argument is that Forman is better because he destroyed the really good team he inherented? Yeah, I think you need to quit digging the hole you are already in. The comp was bad, but it got worse after you "explained " it. That is impressive. The gigantic hole in this is the last few years were full of losses on purpose. They rebuild to acquire tons of young talent. They did EXACTLY what they set out to do.
    3 points
  11. 3 teams had playoff runs because of his contributions. What a guy
    3 points
  12. It is definitely LaRussa's job if he wants it.
    2 points
  13. To me it seemed like he swung through more fastballs in the zone than sliders off the plate in the second half of the season.
    2 points
  14. I know that most of you guys don’t trust what Not Steve Cishek throws out there anymore but thought I would share.
    2 points
  15. Unless Hinch has a guy that he can’t live without, I can’t imagine the list is longer than Matt Zaleski and Everett Teaford.
    2 points
  16. This right here is the problem. Stop arguing this argument right now. The thread is off the rails and you guys are arguing pedantic bullshit. It's over
    2 points
  17. So, was Renteria about to win manager of the year until he got let go?
    2 points
  18. My point is we shouldn't get over confident over this season. The record was very good but in a real season this team wins between 86 and 90 games imo, not the 96 they were on pace to do.
    2 points
  19. Yes, that they only played the Centrals (which, despite 7 playoff teams won a total of 2 playoff games) plus the Sox' poor record against those 7 playoff teams, leaves the true quality of this team an open question. On the Larussa matter, it's hard to reconcile front-office dissatisfaction with Renteria and Cooper not following analytics with looking at LaRussa for manager.
    2 points
  20. I love when someone thinks they're arguing intelligently but can only "prove" arguments using unproveable subjective claims, and can only "disprove" arguments using logical fallacies.
    2 points
  21. No, they are not. It's very simple, statistics aren't even necessary. You make bad decisions consistently, you will have bad results. You make good decisions consistently, you will have good results. A good result after a bad decision is fortunate but not commendable. A bad result after a good decision is of no fault. Renteria made abysmal decision after abysmal decision, game after game. As a result, we lost the division and 6 spots in seeding in a week. It is absolutely reasonable to pin that on Renteria because win or lose, he made constant bad decisions and therefore is to blame. By your rationale the manager is never at fault It's really very simple. This is 100% objective.
    2 points
  22. You didn't read what I said at all. There's no way for me to extrapolate what would have happened had Renteria not made bad decisions. Telling me I don't understand statistics because I can't extrapolate them from thin air is laughable to say the very least. The point was that putting your team in the best position to win is what dictates fault or not. If you put your team in a good position and they lose, it's not your fault. Again I ASK: do you understand this? If you seriously want to ask me for exact examples of Renteria failing to do that then we can be here all day.
    2 points
  23. Yes... so only the bad stretches show you what the future of a season looks like. The 20 of 25 stretch wasn't real, only the poor stretch was. SMH
    2 points
  24. If it's absurd, then please explain exactly to the tee what Renteria contributed. Because if my position is absurd, you will absolutely be able to give concrete examples. For all we know, Renteria lost the faith and admiration of all the players in the last couple weeks. Your logic seems to be that the manager absolutely must be credited with numerous wins but must not be blamed for numerous losses. You saying Renteria didn't cost them three to four losses is absolutely absurd because it's very clear that he cost them much more than that many. Sorry, but you're just wrong. Again, that Cleveland series is all anyone needs to disprove your ridiculousness. But there's far more examples than just those. I'm not sure if blind loyalty in delusion is your problem or just a lack of comprehension but you're way off base to say the very least.
    2 points
  25. He’s also the second in all time losses. https://www.baseball-reference.com/managers/ Jerry Reinsdorf is literally the only human being on Earth who believes Tony LaRussa’s coaching days are not over. Give me Norman Dale, please.
    2 points
  26. Could be your take, but regardless of Gar’s qualifications, he left with a winning overall record during his tenure, something Rick Hahn will almost assuredly never be able to accomplish due to his abominable first seven years. Time will tell whether Hahn will ever have a team advance in the playoffs. Still haven’t seen a valid reason why an executive of a 16 team playoff wild card team bounced immediately is worthy of “executive of the year” honours. Any credit for improvement should be weighed by the fact he was responsible for digging the gargantuan hole in the first place.
    2 points
  27. No, what's absurd is you thinking a team outperforming expectations has nothing to do with the manager at all and the ONLY impact a manager has on a teams success are the "negative" decisions you think he makes in a couple games; decisions that are at worst marginally worse, meaning sometimes they might even work out over the other one. This is where every single person making the same argument you've made lose there point. You want to give the players all the credit for their performance and record. The thing holding back this well oiled underrated monster is the coach... its illogical. The reason some of these guys prospered, developed and succeeded may have been due to the support and personality renteria had; the patience. The majority of a managerial impact is made off the field, before games, in the clubhouse, watching film.. it's not made in the 7th inning with a bullpen move. This is where the argument loses itself. Renteria was obviously a part of the reason the team performed well and developed. His shortcoming was when the stage got big, it became too big for him. He wasn't prepared for situations and he over managed. Bad combination. What he didn't do is cost the White Sox 3 or 4 wins, as so many here want to argue. Everything counts, not just the stuff that makes you irrationally angry as a couch coach. So yes, I've been called a defender for merely being rational. Renteria wasn't the right guy for the job. He also didn't cost them 3-4 wins.
    2 points
  28. He deserves it. 1.) His team made the playoffs which proves the Hahn-led rebuild is not a bust and will pay dividends. 2.) Some of the player he's acquired are bonafide superstar candidates (Robert, Moncada, Eloy, Kopech, TA, Vaughn) as well as a stud catcher (Grandal) and long-term solution at second base (Madrigal). Also he signed Abreu when he coulda let him walk or dump him. Sure he whiffed at the deadline. Sure his pitching staff was not championship caliber. So what? For now, he deserves that award.
    2 points
  29. I’d take a droid manager over Ricky. LaRussa here didn’t really say he’d the the analytics into account. Just gave a blanket statement that there’s too much analytics and not enough quantifying the analytics of what’s in a guys noggin, his heart, and most importantly in his guts. Had a little “only I have the secret and power to win the correct way” feeling to his words. And that he can win more games with any team doing it his correct way. Ease back on the ego trip a little bit there Tony. Seems like the game has passed him by. I wouldn’t mind him managing another team and eating my popcorn watching how that shit goes.
    2 points
  30. In other words, finally realizing the team’s place as the major market team that it is. Sign me up for that!
    2 points
  31. Oh Hell No. Bring me somebody from Tampa Bay, Cleveland, Houston or the LA Dodgers. Time to go new school. And I wouldn't stop there. The Sox need a complete marketing overhaul. I want the Sox to develop a global brand. Once they get new ownership I want them to go seriously after that entertainment $$. Relocated to the South Loop like they should have done when the late, great visionary Harold Washington first offered it. Give those tourists a choice of a 5 min cab ride or dealing with the madness of Clark and Addison. I want the Sox to be the preferred destination for attending Chicago MLB. It's game on.
    2 points
  32. It should go to the Rays GM. If I were Sox GM I would fake trade negotiations with the Rays just to see which guys on my farm they liked the most, then I would call off talks and keep those players, whatever their names were.
    2 points
  33. Very nice but I would have rather had a few more hits against the A's as I am sure he would prefer too.
    2 points
  34. If Tony La Russa is the next manager of the White Sox, Rick Hahn should resign immediately.
    1 point
  35. 1 point
  36. 1 point
  37. Hey Look at Ray Ray run and Konerko Fan, why don’t you exchange numbers so you can argue in peace. I keep coming back to this thread for news and all I find is you two chickens clucking.
    1 point
  38. The good news is because the white sox won a playoff game that proves they were better than all the other Central teams regardless of the regular season so they are fine.
    1 point
  39. This is non-sense, the winner of the world series this year should be able to hang its flag high as anyone, but the turnout of a bunch of 3-game series is random as hell.
    1 point
  40. It's worth nothing. It was barely a 1/3 of a regular season.
    1 point
  41. Those are both subjective claims. Since there are no generally accepted standards or methods that would prove a subjective claim conclusively true or false, this means, even though the claims may involve facts, they are not provable. Your argument ("the losses are on him") is supported by subjective (non provable) claims and therefore cannot be proven as true.
    1 point
  42. How much of gausmans trend in the right direction is a result of playing at oracle park this year? His FIP and xFIP were miniscule at home, but closer to his career average of around 4 on the road. Dont get me wrong, i like him, but hes a #3/4 pitcher. stroman just scares me cause of his build. I know thats been the concern about him his whole career and hes been great, but it just worries me how he’ll hold up going forward. bauer is the safest bet to be an ace going forward. With the exception of 2019, hes steadily gotten better every year. Nola, woodruff, marquez, or castillo. Eloy wouldnt be enough to get any of them straight up though IMO.
    1 point
  43. I expect nothing more of the white sox pitchers than to throw strikes and not break any laws. Anything else they do, including getting their rocks off by trolling on twitter, couldnt care less about. also, i dont buy this argument that bauer is somehow responsible for the actions of other people. Its similar to people blaming moises alous reaction for the treatment bartman got. If you cant handle a few death threats in the dms on twitter, than twitters not for you. This is obviously tongue in cheek. But honestly, like 99% of death threats arent legitimate threats. God ive lost count of the number of “death threats” ive gotten for cheesing fifa in online games.
    1 point
  44. Our manager literally might have cost us the division and we went from seed 1 to seed 7 in a week largely attributed to abysmal managing. I don't know what you're trying to say. I've seen your unfailing optimism and I appreciate it, but there's a time for realism. Realism is, managers make a big difference and ours cost us big time. You make way too many excuses and your narrative that managing isn't important is a blatant disregard of common knowledge.
    1 point
  45. I mean Abreu said he was gonna sign back here himself so I wouldn’t consider it
    1 point
  46. God that makes me miss the steroid era - what a great time for baseball.....
    1 point
  47. Who wants to guess when the first time he throws the players under the bus will be?
    1 point
  48. Hard PASS on Mr. Tony LaRussa. If the association with cheating and A.J. Hinch bothers you, consider the fact that LaRussa presided over the Oakland A’s in the late ‘80s and all of their roiders who bashed their way to their multiple championships. The same thing repeated itself during his time with the Cardinals with McGuire in tow. LaRussa was in the know about the abundance of steroid use happening on those teams, and obviously he was fine with it. And I’m sure he has no regrets because today, he is a member of the Hall of Fame. I know cheating has manifested itself in many different ways in baseball over the years, and perhaps it’s not right to be selective on when to frown on certain types of cheating. But I don’t know, for me, I’d prefer to bypass candidates with this known association with cheating and just find someone else who doesn’t. That and any candidate like LaRussa who has found a way to piss off Hawk Harrelson, Harry Caray, and Jimmy Piersall along the way is no friend of mine!
    1 point
  49. Higher than white definitely but really Vaughn has not much leverage here. He is 23 next year, if the Sox keep him down 2 weeks he is 30 at free agency which is not great for a first baseman. That is very different from a 20 yo centerfielder like acuna was when he signed.
    1 point
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