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Keep checking this thread for Bauer updates and all I'm getting is hearty helpings of Mazara. No thank you.

STOP 👏 TALKING 👏 ABOUT 👏 NOMAR 👏 MAZARA 👏 IN 👏 THE 👏 TREVOR 👏 BAUER 👏 UPDATE 👏 THREAD 👏. Factoring in the eye test, he's still below average. Let's move on, yes?

Man, fool me once shame on you, fool me twice... This is still Mazara talk??? Holy moly.

I'm still trying to figure out why they eliminated the curveball from Lopez's repertoire. Because it worked with giolito is not a good reason but that's the only one I can come up with. It clearly didnt work out with Lopez. It was his best pitch when he came up with the Nats. I'd like to see if he can bounce back employing it before giving up on him.

Couple things: 1. Are you related to Mazara? I ask this because overall, he kinda sucks. 2. With respect to the bolded, if you don't like DRS, look at the Inside Edge numbers. Mazara gets to exactly NONE of the "unlikely" chances (10% - 40% types). This illustrates that he has no range. His arm is mediocre as well. 3. In sum, he's a poor-fielding corner OF who needs a platoon partner, a defensive sub late in games, and a pinch runner. There are plenty of players with fewer flaws that are available for less money.

Things have been quiet on the manager search lately and this makes me believe that Hahn is operating in a stealth manner and talking to Ozzie about the opening. Anyone else think this may be in the case and we may get a surprising announcement sometime this week? I know this would make Chance the Rapper happy!

Random article that lists us as one of the top five destinations for Bauer. Obviously this means nothing, but it’s better than arguing against a delusional Mazara fanboy. https://www.radio.com/sports/mlb/gallery/trevor-bauers-top-5-potential-landing-spots-in-free-agency#chicago-white-sox-ckgmga8570061u4pc0d1ngpfm

Meatball status confirmed - I think we can all move on here and refocus our thoughts on Bauer again.

They sure as hell aren't just looking at batting average and home runs.

Yeah, they just say everyone is a candid except Ozzie to throw everyone off. ozzie has to be the choice, assuming Terry Bevington doesn’t want to come back.

This is...not a blog?

No. /Thread.

Maybe you should take a look at the stats. If you run a fangraphs on RF for 2017 to 2020 Nomar Mazara doesn't rank in the top 50. In fact he ranked 53rd. Even if you narrow to oWAR only, he still isn't in the top 50. Hell Daniel Palka ranks ahead of him at #77, as does Charlie Tilson at #87, and Ryan Cordell at #100. In fact Nomar Mazara comes in 2nd to last at 112 of 113 offensively during that time frame. Even if you rerun it without his disaster of a 2020, Mazara comes in at 58 of 113. EDIT: Even if you want to look at the traditional stats, Marara has never hit .275. .266 is his career high. He has carried and OBP in the .320 range. He's hitting a homer about every 30 PAs, so it isn't even like he has been selling out for the long ball or something. He is a decidedly mediorce player with a ton of potential the Sox were hoping would break out. It didn't happen, and he isn't getting an arbitration offer. You can bookmark this post if you like even.

I would be highly disappointed if they brought in another project. There is no time for that at this point, your contention window is open now.

What is unequivocally creepy is speculating on adultery involving Jerry Reinsdorf or anyone else.

Manfred is such a giant bag of shit. I'm not going to rant on about this but I can't stand these damned rule changes that eliminate portions of the game which have evolved naturally within the proper context and spirit of the game. Example, the 3 batters rule. You give a manager 25 players to roster and he is likely going to pick 2 specialists, a lefty and a righty. If you give him 5 or 6 less players then he won't, but with 25 or 26, you allow him to specialize and devote specialist players to specialized roles that are important enough to designate as being so special and worthwhile. The lefty and righty specialist evolved naturally out of good competitive spirit. But of course everything about being a commissioner is about revenue and specifically appealing to a seemingly increasingly idiotic generation of people with constantly decreasing attention spans. So of course the desire is to cater to these people because they have money. But I don't give a shit about these people. They're bandwagoners anyway, and for hardcore fans like me, I think the long length of the game and the long length of the season has a lot of appeal. I like to work while having the games on, or put the game on the radio in the car. It's a nice chunk of my day that is made more enjoyable by baseball, and I'm not going to b**** about the length of it. I think a lot of people are like that. Eliminating the shift or trying to is trying again to eliminate another element that evolved naturally within the spirit of the game. Put a bunt down you stupid oaf if you don't like it. Oh you can't bunt? Ok fuck you then, hit the ball on the ground to the 3B playing SS. Grab some bench. That's excellent baseball and IMO isn't doing anything different than before. People just record more information now and use it better but they could have spent all of the 1940s shifting if they wanted to. Eliminating cheating is great. Improving accuracy of the umps by replacing them is great. Making the game more fair for all teams is great. A pitch clock is a great thing. I would love for technology to be added that allowed the pitcher and catcher to communicate wirelessly by their own signals, but ONLY the pitcher and catcher, because adding the dugout into the game allows for micromanaging of everything and really ruins the spirit of the game of pitcher and catcher vs. hitter. But adding tech to the game to make it more fair is great. A pitch clock is great, but must be reasonable. The pitch clock should be longer during the AB. E.g. for the first 5 pitches it is X seconds between pitches, then for pitches 5-8 it is X+2 seconds allowance, and pitches 9-11 it is X+4, and pitches 12+ it is X+6 or something, to allow for extra thought to exist in moments of greater need for strategic thought. But simply b****ing about the length of the game just because a bunch of dumb bandwagoner fans don't like and a bunch of people generally with the attention span of a fly can't handle it is really ruining the game for pitiful benefits. Think about these Yankees vs. Red Sox games that take like 4 hours because the lineups are stacked and every hitter is a tough out and every pitcher has to make a great pitch in like every AB. When you stack a lineup full of great hitters then you are doing a great job as a FO. And as a hitter, if you can survive deep into counts routinely, that makes you a great hitter. As a P, it is one thing to fiddle with your hat and your ass for about half a minute off the rubber before getting back on it but also in the spirit of the game, the P should have the ability to set himself up mentally to make a tough pitch in a tough situation. Really, these long games are often the result of some of the best of the best of the game playing each other. This is a good thing. I wish Manfred was a fly on the wall and I could just swat him. He doesn't care about the game at all. As far as the man on second rule, I actually don't hate it as much as I thought it would, but I would prefer a normal 10th, a man on 1st in the 11th, 2nd in the 12th, and a man on 3rd in 13th and beyond, or something like that, if the rule is going to stick. And in this case I do not believe it harms the spirit of the game because it's about keeping players healthy and members of the pitching staff available for future games. And I believe it should only apply in the regular season and should not apply in any game 163 or playoff game situations. But anyway fuck Manfred with a rusty flag pole.

Manfred's job should be endangered.

You are moving the goalposts over and over again, and have been proven wrong with every single claim here. At this point get off your butt and actually show your work. I am bored with proving you wrong, while you have zero evidence of anything you say.

And if they were, who in the word actually thinks a .265 BA with 20 HRs to be that good?

Do you ever look up what you are talking about? From 2016 to 19, Mazara ranked 20th in HRs by a RF. He ranked 29th in BA. He ranked 39th in OBP. Even cherry picking the best portion of his career, and his best stats,he is a replacement level RF. He is a decidedly mediocre player. Your argument is faulty. Nothing of what you thought is actually true.

This times a billion.

IMO Ozzie is definitely a dark horse candidate. They are downplaying the chances of him being the manager wayyy too much. I just don't buy it. I think it's possible the Sox want to keep it under wraps until the world series ends, then it'll be a big surprise.

I think there are many more fans than just me that want to give us the best chance at a World Series title in 2021 (or whenever the next season is played)

Abreu wins the MVP on Thursday, November 12.

If Quintana is our big rotation upgrade then I think we’re in big trouble next year and I say that even if that means we get Springer. I do like the McHugh idea depending on what else we do, but not sure the front office would sign him after he called them out for service time manipulation. Also, there is zero chance they are moving Grandal in some crazy attempt to bring back McCann. I’m generally curious why you think this, although I’m guessing it’s due to Stone’s comments on Twitter.

No. /Thread

I know they said that initially but they haven't referenced him since the day Ricky was dismissed. It leads me to believe that something is happening on the down low. We can be hopeful!

I can’t believe a thread is being started on this. No, Ozzie Guillen is not going to be the new manager. Hahn has already put this to rest in the presser and also mentioned that there may be some candidates managing or coaching in the series. They also have to wait until after the series is over to interview Hinch. That’s why it has been quiet. Nothing is going to get leaked or announced yet on who the new manager is going to be. Let’s move on from the Ozzie Guillen talk.

Ok. I understand your view. But your view is either misinformed, or ill-informed. With respect to the bolded, there are two readily available defensive metrics that take into account what you are complaining about: Inside Edge Fielding Stats Here, they attempt to classify defensive plays as "Routine," "Likely," "Even," "Unlikely," "Remote," and "Impossible." Range Runs, which measures how many balls an outfielder gets to. Needless to say, Mazara has been below average on both measures. These metrics directly measure an OFer's range/ability to get to balls. With respect to the underlined, WAR directly measures whether or not a player has been average or not at his position. Here again, the metric shows that Mazara has been a below average player. That aside, no team would trade away an average starting RFer for Walker.

If you want a treat, go take a look at the statistics of the American league starting right fielders for the last four years. It is pathetic over-all. YOu may think that 20HR, 75RBI, and .275 BA is bad but it really is in the top 3rd of Al right fielders. Think about it. Who are the excellent AL right fielders right now? Hell, last year, the best one went to the Dodgers in Mookie Betts. It really is position which is a very weak one. And right field, my friend, is not a position that you can just plug anybody into. The guy has got to have some speed. He has to have a strong throwing arm. And he plays in what historically been considered a power position. What is also funny is your statement that I somehow think that he is "as good as you make him out to be". All I have said is that he is an average major league right fielder. That is all. But clearly, there are a bunch of you guys who view him differently. That's okay but your opinion isn't supported with facts. He has been an average four year power hitting right fielder and is still 26 years old

I told you. I do not care a whit about defensive stats for outfielders. If you want to give them credence go for it. To begin with, stats do not even begin to be able to measure the ground which an outfielder has to cover typically, the kind of shifts that his team employs, the ability of his center fielder, etc. This takes watching the player which in this case I do a lot of. With infielders it is different. There, defensive stats do matter but even there you need to take some of them with a grain of salt based on the way the team positions its defensive players. In his four previous years in baseball, Mazara was beyond any doubt a decent average major league right fielder all around. Not a star but average. He averaged 20 home runs and about 75 RBIs a season while hitting in the .260s. That is decent production for anyone let alone a 26 year old player with 4 years of major league baseball under his belt. You say he sucks. I say that you are wrong. As far as being anti-vaxx or Covid hoaxing, you're probably wrong about that also.

Nope. One year in his short career he hit 20 HRs and drove in over 100 RBIs. IN 2019, out of about 35 guys in the Al who played right field at all, only 7 hit more home runs(19) or drove in more runs than he did( 68). And he hit .268 which was better than 2/3rds of them did. The guy was a legit all around right fielder. He did have some trouble with left handed pitchers and did get platooned a bit. So what? lot of young players have that done in their early careers.

I don't want to be paying Mazara 6 million for what we have seen, but like you, it won't bother me to see him play when healthy. When we don't pick up his option...he should be available on a 3 million type of deal. His defense was satisfactory and he was coming around with the bat. As you point out...Moncada didn't look so well last year either. Both guys recovering and obviously weakened considerably. If we pour every extra dime into pitching (both starting & relief) that will suit me just fine. There are no right fielders available that strike me as can't miss for moderate money...and Engel seems to contribute whenever he gets a chance to play. Times like now I am glad we don't have Harper. Plenty of money to go get the Bauer's of the World.

We haven’t had a pitcher use a curve aside from Gio who was way too established with it. I hope our pitching coach staff is better at coaching a wider array of pitches aside from fastball, change up, cutter

There's the greatest Jeremy Reed fan ever known! I've popped through without logging in on occasion, and I've been lurking with greater frequency with the excitement of this last season. Despite all the changes in social media/interaction, I love seeing this place still running strong, and it's been great seeing all the old regulars in action throughout everything.

Remember this prediction. They will change the strategy on Covid once Harris/Biden take over. Things are not going to be better in January IMO so there will be a complete and unilateral nation-wide shutdown where the rules and regulations are so strict it'll make your head spin. Quarantine of the entire USA folks. What that does to the economy? Well, we're gonna find out. But if the covid numbers remain bad on inauguration day, you wait. The quarantine is comin'

Ever see some of Mazara's home runs? He hits them "FAR". If you guys want to research outfield and hitting data points, more power to you. I watch the player himself and make my own assessment. IF all things were equal and Mazara didn't get Strep Throat and lose weight and strength, do you think that he wouldn't have hit somewhere in the area of 20 home runs last year in a regular season. If you do, I'd have to disagree with you based on our ball park and better line-up than the Rangers had.

I broke down the White Sox signings during the 2019-2020 international period. They spent the least amount of $$ in baseball and that has to change. I discussed their penny pinching ways here: https://www.futuresox.com/2020/10/24/2019-2020-white-sox-international-review/

Missing most of the last two years is concerning, but if his medicals checked out I'd be interested in Kluber as the second pitcher added to the staff. He has playoff experience, regular season track record, and could be another valuable asset for the young arms to learn from. He'll turn 35 in April so he's no spring chicken, but maybe a 1 year deal with a team option could fly for him?

I think after Bauer, he's the best pitcher available in free agency. Strikeouts are great and all, but they aren't exactly efficient and aren't as great as home run suppression. Stroman keeps the ball on the ground. He has the lowest launch angle against of any pitcher in the majors, which keeps the ball in the park and induces double play balls. He's never allowed more than 0.9 hr/9 in any season. He's never had a FIP above 3.9. He's a bull dog on the mound, kind of a starter version of Colome. Put him together with a good defense and good offense he'd win a lot of games

😋For all you kids watching out there: Look the ball into your glove. Otherwise, talk about a train going off the tracks, this thread passes all the tests. I now know that if it weren't for Eddie, the games would be on free for all and we'd be drinking Falstaff from a free tap in our dens. And Falstaff was great before people decided they preferred the taste of tan water.

Whole family got the flu shot today (love how easy they have made it - literally we just pull up in the car, hop out for < 5 minutes and we are done (don't even have to park the car). Hopefully this years shot is pretty effective against the flu - would be a really good year for that to be the case and for it to be a mild mild flu season.

By signing Keuchel and not kidnapping Wheeler with the highest ransom?

No offense guys - but the world would be a better place if we stopped just blanketly calling people with different political viewpoints idiots. Makes no one better & not productive. Unless you literally think we should live in a world where you can't be friends with someone who has different viewpoints. Personally - I think that is a boring world and I don't believe things are black and white. Different people have different views and I need to respect that - as long as those views aren't fundamental extremist type of positions. And no - I don't think every person who voted for Trump is an extremist - some certainly are, but many had there reasons and the fact that they voted for that individual does not make them a horrible person. We will never get ourselves back as a country if we continue to have so many people who have basically put themselves in an echo chamber (it is literally the exact opposite of diversity and is scary). Tony - I am not saying that is you - but this country is way too polarized and I hate absolute statements like this. The reality is, there were a lot of people who voted for Trump back in 2016 because well, they figured they had been stuck in their situation forever and maybe that situation had gotten worse and over decades they never saw it get better (Democrat, Republican...didn't matter). So you know what - they decided they wanted to take a shot and go anti-establishment, because you know what, why not, nothing else had helped them (in their own perceived world). I don't get why people can't empathize and respect that and instead just assume every single person who voted for Trump is a steaming pile of dog, poop. Some absolutely are - but that is the human race and those people exist on both sides of the voting spectrum.

This is a really good list. I’d add Jack McKeon at #5 and call it a day.

Laughable. JR and EE were the architects of the pay per view scheme both locally and nationally, steal what you can now scheme be it television or raping taxpayers across the country to pay for their capital expenses. Also destroyed interest by cancelling the 1994 season .When you cut out long term interest and erode your customer base for short term greed, you get flaccid interest in baseball that endless erectile dysfunction and gambling ads cannot remedy. It's how a two team baseball city became a one team city, and how the NFL pwned MLB and continues to pull away like Secretariat.

Last thing I'll post on this. Here's a link from another source that speaks to his elite spin rates, his high GB rates, and his ability to regularly go 6IP in most of his outings. They express why I favor Stroman as part of a 2 FA SP solution this offseason better than I can: Trashstros fans post about Stroman

Oh, I hear you. I happen to think that adding ~340ish or so IP of ~4 to ~4.25 FIP to this rotation is exactly what this team needs. I would love to add Bauer and his ~180ish or so IP of ~3ish FIP, but then we'd all have to vomit on Lopez's and Cease's starts all year long. And, we'd also probably have to go without re-siging colome, and have to live with a black hole in RF as well. While I share your reservations about "B-level" FAs, looking at Stroman & Q, they're younger, and better than, say Gio Gonzalez. And if signing these two can ALSO allow re-signing Colome and a cromulent, 100 wrc+, +1 or more DRS, ~2.0ish fWAR everyday RFer, I think I'd take it over Bauer and ONLY Bauer signed this offseason.

I think this is fair, but unfortunately for his circumstances I think that 17mill is unlikely for Odorizzi this year. He gambled and lost. Overall it seems like nobody likes stroman that much, nobody hates stroman, either. He's a bit like Keuchel in more than one way there (though some really hated keuchel.) Last year I really didn't want to soak up salary on B pieces. One difference is I am a full believer that we have a big core now, and we need players we can rely on next year. But after this offseason I don't think we'll really have the flexibility to jump on an A/A+ piece if they become available in the coming years and that's a bummer. But I'd take the fact that our core is what I expected over y'know, what happened to the phils.