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There is no prototype for how Covid affects each person medium-long term

But could you imagine how popular the Sox would become with teen girls if they made this trade?

I'd bet a fairly large sum of money that Vaughn is up before the Super 2 deadline.

All the Vaughn trade talk 0n here was ridiculous. Hahn wasn’t going to trade another potential great hitter after the Tatis debacle. I think he signs an extension before game one. Hope it happens

You'd be correct if the trade made sense, at all, at the time. Unfortunately James Shields was a bad idea even then. He was one year into his joke of a free agent deal, already 35 years old and coming off a year where he pitched over 200 innings and somehow only produced 0.8 fWAR. At the time of the deal, he had an ERA over 4 in the best pitcher's park of the last two decades. I HATED that trade the moment it was made, and I had no idea who Tatis was. It was the type of trade that, for a team trying to contend, wasn't even worth the roster spot they gave him LET ALONE any kind of lottery ticket going the other way.

That'd be a huge problem if Rick is afraid to trade away a guy because the Tatis deal was botched. I don't think that's the case but if it is, not good. It was a debacle. Every single statistic that was available would tell you Shields was regressing big time and that he was basically done. Obviously Tatis has ended up about 8 billion times better than anyone could have possibly imagined but trading anybody with any talent for Shields at that point was an awful, awful idea.

I mean, we could have just taken on Shields entire contract and not thrown in an athletic LatAm signee.

I think we already have the pieces. I hope you like 105 wins cuz that’s what you’re about to see. This team would piss all over 2005

Craig Biggio

Reports indicate Sheets has been adjusting to OF nicely. Wouldn't it be great if he turned into a legit corner OF'er ?

Lopez was just sent to the IL with whiplash.

I think they thought he was BPA. Lots of folks at the time hyped him as the best/smartest college player they'd ever seen. I don't think they drafted based on need - IIRC Moncada was still thought of as our primary 2b at the time, and it's not like our outfield was "full." He was above Kelenic in every mock I saw.

Nobody drafts for need and nobody knows BPA because then you would always sign him (except for pool money play). I think they saw madrigal as the best combination of ceiling and floor. Obviously he wasn't the highest ceiling guy but maybe they saw his 50th percentile outcome as the best.

That's not happening this time around. The Sox want a championship and need him to DH and spell Abreu at 1B the first two months of the season. They also need Vaughn to get his feet wet so that by around July or August, he can be established and ready for the stretch run.

Off lopez.

I expect Jose to be the opening day 1B and I expect Vaughn to be in the minors until Super 2 passes.

I made one of these for a school science fair as a kid using quart milk cartons and 4 small mirrors. I forget how old I was . Probably 10 or so but I don't remember if it actually worked because I couldn't line up the mirrors properly or cut them down to size to get the angles right to make it work . It worked in theory but the execution was lacking .

That seems premature. He didn’t even know he had it, like most people.

And I just have to repeat....The Tatis trade was not a debacle...it was putting a lottery ticket in a birthday card for someone at work and it turns out to be the winning powerball. You sure look stupid after the fact but at the time it was a lark.

Unless Vaughn ends up being capable at 3B or RF, he'd have to put up a ridiculous OPS at a 1B/DH to have anywhere near the value of Tatis. At this point it's too late to find another DH for this season, but earlier in the offseason, I'd have been willing to part with him for a top tier SP with 3+ years of control.

I'd still much rather trade him but even I have admitted that this LaVine is faaaar different than the one I've seen in a Bulls uniform and I mean on both ends of the floor. His efficiency, defense, etc. have all been outstanding. I've given credit where credit has been due for him in case you missed it. I still don't like the shit he does at times on the court but I can not get on what he's done this season as a scorer. I've never questioned LaVine's work ethic.

Nah, I don't think so. The Cubs knew what they were giving up, they got a WAY better player back, and while Eloy is already good, he hasn't reached Tatis level yet. Our deal was a prospect who, if we knew how good he was, would never have been in any trade at all, for a player in Shields that every team (and publication, tbh) knew was garbage except the White Sox, and the prospect has now blossomed into someone who has already put up 6.5 fWAR in 143 games. I appreciate the attempt at positivity, though.

‘Meh’ would have been a massive upgrade from Shields

Because it's a very stupid idea that can directly kill people when there isn't highly effective treatment available.

Absolutely. While his efficiency probably can't get any better, his turnovers would go way down with a true point guard on the roster

*Every* scouting report you'll find on Madrigal had him as plus defender and base-runner. If you extrapolate Madrigal's FG defensive metrics out to a full season, he's like a -35 run defender. Which backs up what we saw. He was terrible. But that seems very unlikely to continue, for me. There was concern about pitchers being able to knock the bat out of his hands, which didn't happen. Everything we saw from him at the place suggests his approach should play.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/02/24/sports/baseball/thinking-fast-and-slow-book.html?referringSource=articleShare

Sounds like Jose had a very mild case. Thankfully.

Moncada was supposed to have very weak symptoms if at all also, but then it turned into long-COVID/brain fog for him over time. He hit .299 with an .843 OPS for the first 16 games of last year, including an 8 game hit streak, and then hit .188 over his next 36 games. There's literally no way to predict what the end result will be in any person, we've seen enough of this damn virus to understand that. Hopefully Jose has no internal damage and never really has anything to worry about, but you can be certain that's the case in like June.

Tatis was not on anyones top 25 list of international prospects that year. Look over the last fifty years at the players outside the top 25 international players and how many made the major leauges...then look at the ones that went on to be the best player in baseball. Heres the list: Fernando Tatis, Jr. If he were signed this year he wouldn't be in our top 50 prospects. If by design you mean the White Sox went to the padres and said "you can take any one prospect outside our top 50"...It was a reasonable upside bet for them. But it was really just horrible luck.

I don't recall coming across this, but a great piece regarding Katz' work with Rodon. I have confidence at least a few pitchers will make big leaps this season, and be much improved to start 2022. I'm hoping the Sox could get big improvements from a Rodon, Cease and or Lopez this year. https://chicago.suntimes.com/white-sox/2021/2/21/22294283/white-sox-have-ideas-for-left-hander-carlos-rodon

I'll have to disagree with the lottery ticket analogy. Lottery tickets are not scouted by a highly respected guy and signed and then traded for because the other team values the skill set and the position he plays. Lottery tickets are a complete unknown, baseball players are not. You do not target specific lottery tickets because they are all the same. Lottery tickets are complete luck so you can't look stupid. Once again luck is the residue of design. The Padres luck was by design.

I'm 42 and healthy (also had a very mild case of COVID in November) and I would absolutely have no issue taking J&J and allowing higher risk to get one of the others. Hopefully we reach the point soon where that is an option.

I never said is Tatis. I said it was ridiculous to even talk him getting traded in any realistic trade. Hahn would never do it after the Tatis debacle

*Too Stop the act. It's old and transparent. The more you say this the more obvious it is you just can't handle the argument in the first place. Only reason to respond with garbage like this is to be an asshole. You're weak. (And what I'm saying is pretty well established, anyway)

For 5 seconds you had me badger...I literally hit reply as my brain was going "are you crazy"...than it hit me...you are so totally sane and funny!!!

Much more at the link.

Man the best thing would be if after a month and the team is 20-10 or something, and we start hearing quotes from guys leaking out saying how much they love the new winning culture and playing for TLR.

I find you to be one of the reasoned voices on here...so I guess I'm surprised at your seeming anger at the off season. Lynn was the best pitcher that changed hands in the AL this offseason...Hendricks is a great upgrade...Tony LaRussa is almost certainly going to be better than Ricky. Eaton is a pro. Cespedes and Vera seem like exciting young additions. Vaughn instead of EE...Katz instead of Coop. And we are keeping a tight budget to go buy someone at the trade deadline...like I mentioned a second ago...how about Chris Sale??

Gio was a fleece. Eloy was a big fleece as the Cubs got meh out of Q. Ceas3 may end up a big fleece as well. The difference is that Eloy sucks at defense so you lose a lot of HOF value. Shields was also completely worthless before we got him. Q may have been meh with the Cubs, but he did contribute to playoff teams.

Got my first shot today. There was something eerie about it and I do not mean in a political anti-vaxxer sense but more of the thought of maybe realizing I may have avoided this for all this time and there is an end in site.

Some of us come here to get updates about Spring Training.

Stfu about TLR. Not every thread needs to turn into a TLR bitchfest.

Giolito primed for another standout season (mlb.com) This is exciting. “It’s like a 12-6 curveball, but it just goes down,” Giolito said. “It comes out of my hand almost like a slider variant. It’s hard to give it a real true name like curveball or slider. But the whole idea of it is it comes out on my fastball plane and then just goes down kind of later, whereas my slider is a little more right to left with that downward action. This one is more like out of the hand fastball plane, straight down late So...like a straight, slow, sinker maybe? With hard break on it?

The Padres’ made moves to attempt to beat the best team in baseball. The White Sox made moves to hopefully one year pass Minnesota in the worst division in baseball. Hahn may blow smoke up fans asses with talk of “multiple World Series championships”. It’s easy to talk the talk, time to bring in the pieces to walk the walk.

I could do both, if you ever elucidate a good argument for doing so. Message me, this is OT.

The whole idea behind "cancel culture" is dumb. The same people who are screaming this in response to things like being a racist and committing treason against the nation are the same ones who cancelled Colin Kaepernik and the Dixie Chicks. They had noooooo problem costing people their incomes then, so what changed? The party of "personal responsibility" and "fuck your feelings" is the party losing their minds here. Maybe they should take a hardy helping of their own advice? And please no one on Soxtalk give me the "Freedom of Speech" line or i really will lose it.

Someone needs to tell Lucas the truth that he is not good at naming things before this gets out of hand.

Can't wait in a few years when Gio is throwing a knuckler and the frisbee.