steveno89
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Posts posted by steveno89
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18 minutes ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said:
Not a Porter fan? Walcott and Porter would be outstanding
I like Porter a lot. Talented arm, but there is considerable reliever risk with him as well.
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2 hours ago, ChiSox59 said:
Something like Woo + Montes + Clase doable? Montes is pretty intriguing. I feel like the Sox would prefer an OF closer to the majors. Gabriel Gonzaelez just feels like more of what we have so I'd prefer he not be a major part of the trade. I would certainly take him over Clase in the proposed deal, but that feels pretty heavy with the Woo headliner.
I doubt the Mariners would consider trading him, but Colt Emerson would absolutely be who I would target in a trade.
He could break out in a big way in 2024.
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3 minutes ago, Bob Sacamano said:
If Mayo can’t stick at 3B, I don’t really love the fit. Unless he can play an average OF defense.
Mayo would be a tremendous get as headliner from the Orioles. Big Pop and arm. Should be able to play passable third base, or possibly RF.
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12 hours ago, Frobby said:
From an MLBTR chat today;
Up in the air
Who says no? Westburg, Stowers, Pham, and Wagner for Cease or
Mark P
That's a pretty good offer, even if the White Sox are reportedly/seemingly looking to add pitching. They'd probably want a higher-tier pitching prospect than Pham.
That simply is not close to getting a deal done
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13 minutes ago, poppysox said:
If the Cubs are successful in resigning Bellinger...Pete Crow-Armstrong will be blocked as is Madrigal. My belief is we need to find blocked players that are major league ready at our two weakest positions. I like Madrigal more than most here, but the concept of blocked players is my interest in posting. The two position players I mention plus a #3/4 potential SP and perhaps a RP with potential would be a very satisfactory return for Cease.
Nick Madrigal does absolutely nothing for the White Sox moving forward and has little, if any, trade value. Hard pass.
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1 hour ago, WestEddy said:
Something called The Wrightway Sports Network wrote an article just throwing names against the wall. He seems to be focused on guys who already have pitched in the bigs and started their clocks. I don't know the Pirates' system, but some of the names thrown around (by some podcast nobody) seem to be big leaguers (Connor Joe?), who I can't imagine Getz being interested in.
https://twsn.net/2023/12/the-pittsburgh-pirates-need-to-trade-for-dylan-ceaseNone of those packages would get a Cease deal done^
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13 minutes ago, SoCalChiSox said:
I too am accepting that it will be ATL and that I'll hate the return. It's sad that Getz is putting his pig headed belief in Limp Dick Ball ahead of the good of the team but whatever. IMO, even if BAL gave him the package he wanted he still wouldn't do it, he's just using them to drive up the price for an all pitching deal elsewhere. Even if Elias wasn't prospect hoarding, I'm increasingly of the belief that BAL is out.
I'm not going to twist myself into a pretzel to believe it's a good return. I'm not going to call chicken s%*# chicken salad. f*** Atlanta, f*** the Royals and f*** Chris Getz.
Not necessarily in that order.
Although ATL makes sense as a suitor, I do not see them being the trade destination at the end of the day unless the Sox are hell bent on adding pitching
Cincinnati, Cubs, Red Sox, Dodgers, Giants, Braves, Cardinals, Orioles, Phillies, Twins, Blue Jays, Yankees could all make degrees of sense
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37 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:
O's have to give to get. They aren't going to have roster space for all these dudes, and at some point they need to supplement their roster, especially on the pitching side. I am not taking anything but an A+ offer from anyone else until the O's meet my price.
100%. Screw the Orioles unless we are getting two of Mayo/Cowser/Kerjstad/Basallo plus more
I see too many posts by fans suggesting what I consider to be really light return packages for Cease
Although it makes sense to deal him, the Sox can refuse to trade him unless they get exactly what they want in return.
I rightfully want a king's ransom. Why should we be considering less than the Luis Castillo trade when Cease has two full seasons of control?
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8 minutes ago, Quin said:
We're gonna keep pitching O's, Dodgers, and Braves packages, maybe with a dash of Reds, Red Sox or Padres, and it'll be the Mets or something.
I was thinking the same thing. What if it ends up being a surprise club that steps up with an offer after lurking for awhile?
Although unlikely, the Twins could be a potential sleeper suitor? They have the prospects to get a deal done.
Yankees? Rangers? Phillies? Blue Jays? Mets? Cardinals?
Astros do not have the farm to get a deal done
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2 minutes ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said:
I'd have tried to get an opt out if he could have.
Glasnow is electric when healthy, but a five year deal seems extremely risky for him on the wrong side of 30
Nice when you have a huge budget
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19 minutes ago, SoCalChiSox said:
I know they aren't going to deal Robert but if we went all in we could get a haul from BOS for Robert and Cease.
SP Bello
RF Anthony
CF Rafaela
C Teel
2B Yorke
I would not accept that offer from Boston either
It is not realistic for Robert and Cease to be dealt in the same trade, I am not sure there is a farm in the MLB that would A) Have what the Sox would want and B) Be willing to absolutely gut their farm
You essentially have to keep Robert for another season or two, no chance you could get fair value in return for four years of prime control.
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13 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:
I think that $40M surplus value is too low. IMO, he’s a 4 win pitcher and worst case scenario you’re looking at (8 x $9M) - $20M = $52M. Throw in the strong possibility of a QO compensation pick when he leaves and the general scarcity of quality SP and I think you’re looking at $60M easily in expected surplus value.
I also agree that the Baseball trade values website is low on Cease's surplus value in this environment. Often it greatly overestimates how valuable a prospect is vs. a proven MLB talent. So many prospects bust and deliver little, if any, value. Short of injury, you largely know that Cease will give you really solid 30+ starts for two seasons with #1/2 starter upside.
When Seth Lugo ate age 34 is getting 3/$45 million, Cease's age 28 and 29 seasons for 2/$25 million plus potential qualifying offer compensation is a steal
Yamamoto/Snell/Montgomery are all going to cash in on massive deals
I laugh when I see Orioles fans thinking Joey Ortiz and Cade Povich can headline a deal
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43 minutes ago, SCCWS said:
In any deal. I want a quality SP in first or 2nd pick. I like Teel as a 2nd but then I want a pitcher as the headliner. Having said that, not sure Boston has a SP headliner.
Yordanny Monegro RHP would be a must for me as a third or fourth piece in a Case to Boston deal
He is coming off a terrific season
Him and Perales are the best arms in the Red sox system
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53 minutes ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said:
Yeah, if you're dealing with the Red Sox, their only headliner is Anthony imo. Anthony and Teel would be really nice.
Would love to see SD and BOS involved in the Cease bidding
Either could create a nice package
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1 hour ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said:
I bet once Yamamoto signs, Cease rumors will pickup as I would think many teams would be scared to give what Snell is asking for
Yamamoto, Snell and Montgomery are highly likely to get enormous contracts in this market
Even the second and third tier of free agent SP is going to get paid handsomely
Sox just need to continue to be patient and let the dominos fall
If I am a club trying to win the World Series, Cease is extremely appealing for such reasonable money that allows us to spend elsewhere
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4 minutes ago, SoCalChiSox said:
This is a very good point.
Bob has historically been used to leak stuff that our FO wants out there.
I really really don't want ATL to be the trading partner so I hope you're right and it's a strategic leak to scare LAD.
On the other hand, the fact that we are leaking to scare LAD and not BAL suggests Elias is still being a dickless coward and maybe the FO has given up on trying to persuade him.
I really think a few of Yamamoto, Snell and Montgomery need to sign before we see the Cease market really heat up
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26 minutes ago, fathom said:
In a world where Lugo gets 45 million, Cease’s value continues to climb
This rings really true^
Seth Lugo entering his age 34 season parlayed a solid 2023 into a 3/$45 million deal
Cease's age 28 and 29 seasons are available for essentially 2/$25 million, a massive bargain compared to what other free agents will end up costing in terms of money, years and draft picks/pool money
He is a player a club could trade for and still retain financial flexibility to go out and make more moves vs. one year of Glasnow at $25 million
Yamamoto, Snell, Imanaga, Stroman, Montgomery are out there, but each will require major or substantial commitments.
Giolito, Wacha, Flaherty, Yariel Rodriguez, Clevinger, Lorenzen, Manaea, Mahle, Montas, Severino, etc. are still out there too
Such depth is holding up the trade market for sure
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16 minutes ago, GreenSox said:
The Sox rebuild failed because they had zero prospect depth. In a touch of irony, perhaps that explains the reluctance of the Orioles and Reds: "We don't want to be like you."
I think this ends up with the Dodgers who have prospects at the "use them or let them rot on the vine" stage. Maybe the Braves, Mets or Padres. A more mature team.
I think there is plenty of interest in Cease out there, we just need to be patient
The main issue is that there are still quite a few free agent options in Yamamoto, Stroman, Wacha, Montgomery, Snell, etc. that are holding up the market a bit. Until more of those players sign, teams may not feel the pressure to up their trade offers.
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49 minutes ago, Bob Sacamano said:
From the Dodgers, who says no?:
1. C/1B Dalton Rushing (MLB Top 100: 43, Dodgers: 1)
2. SP Nick Frasso (65, 3), or ( Gavin Stone (79, 5) or another young arm that graduated from prospect status with 6+ years of control
3. SS Trey Sweeney (UR, 18) Left-handed hitting IF
4. OF Chris Newell (UR, 24) Left-handing hitting OF
Feels too light for the Sox IMO
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18 minutes ago, Texsox said:
I'm always in favor of numbers over potential with young players.
Not sure I would be a fan if the Sox opted for a quantity over quality package for Cease
He is your best chance to return potential premium pieces outside of dealing Robert
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3 minutes ago, SoCalChiSox said:
I wonder if as @CaliSoxFanViaSWside mentioned the Sox don't want Busch because he's bat only and maybe they want Lux (we were rumored to want him before) to play 2B for now since Busch doesn't have the glove for it and also as insurance in case Montgomery has to move to 3B soon and this is LAD way of getting a prospect with a 2024 ETA to quickly backfill Lux's spot in a trade?
If LAD offered Lux (2B/SS), Pages (RF) and a SP, I feel Getz would accept it.
Lux and Pages each come with injury concerns that would make that a pretty questionable deal
Lux only has three remaining seasons of control as well
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6 minutes ago, CWSpalehoseCWS said:
His bat has disappeared.
Brutal season offensively for Cartaya in AA. Still only 22, he is a reasonable bet to bounce back and is still young for level.
Some of the luster certainly wears off after posting a wRC+ of 71 in AA though. I think he may be viewed as too risky to headline a major trade right now.
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1 hour ago, Eminor3rd said:
He's better than Daisuke was. You're right to point out that we don't know what he is going forward, but this is the best combo of stuff and polish that's probably ever come over from NPB.
I do not doubt that he is a better "prospect" than Matsuzaka was at the time, but the numbers are pretty similar
Some club will assuredly back up the truck and give him an eight or nine year mega deal due to excellent performance in Japan and only being 25 years old. It is such a risky signing because you just do not know how a player will perform when moving overseas. A big market club likely does not care though.
Interesting to question if fans would hypothetically rather sign Snell or Yamamoto?
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23 minutes ago, SoCalChiSox said:
I dont think Cohen will allow himself to be outbid here. Hopefully it gets done soon so the pitching market can start moving.
8 hours ago, ChiSox59 said:Woof. I am sure he’s a nice pitcher but $300M? Yikes
I am no scout, but Yamamoto's Japanese league numbers are really similar to Daisuke Matsuzaka's
Giving $300 million to a player who has never thrown a pitch in the MLB seems like playing with fire
He already has nearly 1000 professional innings pitched by age 25, there has to be some concern with how a listed 5'10", 175 lb frame will hold up moving forward as a starter
Grade the Cease trade
in Pale Hose Talk
Posted
The glass half full fan in me wants to vote "B", but experience tells me this is a C grade trade for the Sox
Does it have potential to work out if Thorpe/Iriarte/Zavala pan out? Of course, but I am not sure how likely that is with the White Sox
Thorpe dominated lower minor league hitters as a polished college right hander with a plus-plus changeup, but the 90-93 MPH fastball may not threaten MLB hitters enough. I also do not love his upright delivery, similar to Rodon, that may lead to shoulder and/or elbow issues down the line. He profiles as a #4, but with more ceiling if he can somehow find 94-96 MPH fastball velocity.
Iriarte is the guy to dream on, with a potential three plus pitch mix. The control and command would need to take a full grade forward for him to stick as a starter. He reminds me of Reynaldo Lopez, with a bit less velocity. I pray for a starter, but far more likely he winds up in the bullpen.
Zavala could be the prize of this trade, although he is quite a ways away from the majors. Impressive numbers at age 18/19 in low A, but will need to see him hit at the high A level before having an idea of what he could become. Dream of a MLB regular, but who knows?
This is a serviceable package, although fans surely were hoping for at least one truly premium prospect in return for Cease. Getz could not risk carrying him into the regular season, where an injury or poor performance could sink his value.