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QUOTE (balfanman @ Oct 3, 2016 -> 02:16 PM)
It wouldn't take that much to improve over Navaro. Personally, and I don't know who exactly is available, but I think a 2nd base improvement is the way to go. I'm not impressed with Lawrie and have decided that Saladino is a better utility guy.

 

Yeah, Navarro had a hot bat for a short while early on, and then sucked. He's also horrible at pitch-framing.

 

I don't understand the push to replace Lawrie. He's under team control for another year, he's cheap, he's decent defensively, and he's about 2 WAR. If the Sox could land a 3 WAR second baseman, then great, but I don't foresee that happening. It's also less critical when the Sox have a decent get-me-by player in Saladino and a solid utility guy in Sanchez.

 

The best bets for improving offensive output are the corner OF and DH positions. Even a mediocre CF who can hit, such as Cespedes or Fowler, would be a huge improvement over what we had this year.

 

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QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Oct 3, 2016 -> 02:33 PM)
Take it for what it's worth, Matt Abadacola on the Score says he has sources inside that say the preference is to move Sale over Quintana. If a team were to overpay obviously.

 

That makes sense, especially since Sale is the power pitcher than many covet, he's something of a clubhouse cancer, and he's under team control for one season less than Q.

 

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QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Oct 3, 2016 -> 02:33 PM)
Take it for what it's worth, but Matt Abadacola on the Score says he has sources inside that say the preference is to move Sale over Quintana. If a team were to overpay obviously. Again, take it for what it's worth.

 

Crazier, under control for less years, not worlds better and would get more in a trade. It'd make sense.

 

I still say if you sell either everyone other than Rodon and Anderson is on the table from the MLB roster.

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QUOTE (Black_Jack29 @ Oct 3, 2016 -> 02:35 PM)
Yeah, Navarro had a hot bat for a short while early on, and then sucked. He's also horrible at pitch-framing.

 

Even a mediocre CF who can hit, such as Cespedes or Fowler, would be a huge improvement over what we had this year.

 

See, we do agree on a couple things at least! :cheers

 

Now getting Cespedes or Fowler may prove to be difficult.

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QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Oct 3, 2016 -> 08:41 PM)
Crazier, under control for less years, not worlds better and would get more in a trade. It'd make sense.

 

I still say if you sell either everyone other than Rodon and Anderson is on the table from the MLB roster.

 

Rodon should absolutely be a trade chip if you are unloading everyone

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I'm fine with whatever criticism this club get. It's completely warranted but I'm good with this hire and I'm eager to see this team's "plan" moving forward. I am curious to see any new coaches being hired. I just dream about Omar Vizquel being hired and working with Tim year in year out. That's my choice for bench coaches I mentioned before. I'm ok with keeping coop because our pitching is solid year in year out. I'm still trying to think about hitting coach names. Maybe Raul Ibanez?

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I'm ok with Lawrie, but I'm ok with all the pieces individually. As a whole though, they don't fit. So in some respects, I think you're going to have to take steps back to vastly improve another position. Or as others say, plug a hole by creating maybe another one.

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QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Oct 3, 2016 -> 02:33 PM)
Take it for what it's worth, but Matt Abbatacola on the Score says he has sources inside that say the preference is to move Sale over Quintana. If a team were to overpay obviously. Again, take it for what it's worth.

 

I see this being the case too and it makes the most sense. I think they try to spin him to Boston for a package like Moncada, Benintendi, Swihart, and something in hope of plugging a couple holes while staying competitive.

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QUOTE (balfanman @ Oct 3, 2016 -> 01:47 PM)
See, we do agree on a couple things at least! :cheers

 

Now getting Cespedes or Fowler may prove to be difficult.

 

Indeed. Reddick is more likely, IMO, though they need to shoot higher than him if they're going for it in 2017.

 

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QUOTE (fathom @ Oct 3, 2016 -> 01:54 PM)
Rodon should absolutely be a trade chip if you are unloading everyone

 

No, he's one of the guys that you sign to an extension ASAP and build around.

 

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QUOTE (fathom @ Oct 3, 2016 -> 02:54 PM)
Rodon should absolutely be a trade chip if you are unloading everyone

 

5 years of control...let him develop more the next season or two. Plus someone has to be in the rotation. Trading him now is stupid.

 

Edit: I also have zero faith in him taking a team friendly extension based on who his agent is. He's on track to be a free agent at what, 28?

Edited by soxfan2014

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QUOTE (Black_Jack29 @ Oct 3, 2016 -> 08:57 PM)
No, he's one of the guys that you sign to an extension ASAP and build around.

 

Boras client, doubtful he signs an extension

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QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Oct 3, 2016 -> 08:57 PM)
5 years of control...let him develop more the next season or two. Plus someone has to be in the rotation. Trading him now is stupid.

 

That's the thing, if you trade Sale/Q, then you aren't winning for a few years and it doesn't matter if you have 5 James Shields in your rotation. The idea of rebuilding while trying to compete is simply foolish IMO

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QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Oct 3, 2016 -> 01:41 PM)
Crazier, under control for less years, not worlds better and would get more in a trade. It'd make sense.

 

I still say if you sell either everyone other than Rodon and Anderson is on the table from the MLB roster.

I could see it if you could get some team to give ya what you want for him and you get a bundle of near ready prospects or ready prospects and some near ready guys. I still say Boston makes the most sense. I really want a full rebuild though. I'm just not sure sure if you only traded Sale, would it make us that much closer to contention? I mean if Boston gave up JBJr, Benintendi, Kopech, Devers and Vasquez is that enough? I'd take that and move on from Sale.

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QUOTE (fathom @ Oct 3, 2016 -> 01:59 PM)
Boras client, doubtful he signs an extension

No chance he does unless he gets TJ surgery and the Sox offer a big enough contract after he healed.

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QUOTE (fathom @ Oct 3, 2016 -> 03:00 PM)
That's the thing, if you trade Sale/Q, then you aren't winning for a few years and it doesn't matter if you have 5 James Shields in your rotation. The idea of rebuilding while trying to compete is simply foolish IMO

 

Rodon isn't a free agent until 2022. If the Sox decide to rebuild this season, they should be competitive by 2019 or 2020.

Edited by Black_Jack29

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QUOTE (Black_Jack29 @ Oct 3, 2016 -> 02:40 PM)
That makes sense, especially since Sale is the power pitcher than many covet, he's something of a clubhouse cancer, and he's under team control for one season less than Q.

 

I really, really, really don't think the Sox players view Chris as a clubhouse cancer.

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QUOTE (ChiSox59 @ Oct 3, 2016 -> 09:03 PM)
I really, really, really don't think the Sox players view Chris as a clubhouse cancer.

 

Maybe the players don't, but what about management?

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QUOTE (fathom @ Oct 3, 2016 -> 02:54 PM)
Rodon should absolutely be a trade chip if you are unloading everyone

 

Rodon is they type of guy you'd be hoping to get in deals. Trading him makes no sense. He has FIVE years of control left.

 

Sale - 3 years

Q - 4 years

Rodon - 5 years

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QUOTE (ChiSox59 @ Oct 3, 2016 -> 03:03 PM)
I really, really, really don't think the Sox players view Chris as a clubhouse cancer.

 

I'm sure that some of the players like him, but I'd guess that some probably don't and that the grownups in the organization (coaching staff, front office, etc.) didn't appreciate the crap that he pulled this year.

 

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QUOTE (fathom @ Oct 3, 2016 -> 03:04 PM)
Maybe the players don't, but what about management?

 

Who gives a s*** what the suits think? He's not a clubhouse cancer in the traditional sense if the guys in the clubhouse like him.

 

He may be a pain in KW's ass, but that doesn't make him a cancer.

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QUOTE (ChiSox59 @ Oct 3, 2016 -> 03:06 PM)
Who gives a s*** what the suits think? He's not a clubhouse cancer in the traditional sense if the guys in the clubhouse like him.

 

Are you sure that everyone in the clubhouse likes him? Would you like him causing a media sh*tstorm for your team and destroying your jersey with scissors?

 

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QUOTE (Black_Jack29 @ Oct 3, 2016 -> 03:10 PM)
Are you sure that everyone in the clubhouse likes him? Would you like him causing a media sh*tstorm TWICE for your team and destroying your jersey with scissors?

 

Fixed that for ya haha

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If we decided on a full rebuild, I'm confident they could get the promising young bats back and have the pitching to make up for it in the coming years. The team is really starting to draft better overall. We have the 12th pick, so it's a chance at another top young player along with another draft class overall.

 

 

I just don't want to see anymore half-assed efforts anymore and with such a poor free agent class, we need to move our top pitchers for young prospects. We could reshape the team with Sale and Q alone.

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