greg775 Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 QUOTE (steveno89 @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 11:00 PM) I will say for a fact that Machado will not get $500 million over 10 years...that is totally absurd. Right now the highest paid player in the mlb is Clayton Kershaw @ $33 million per year. Right now Harper/Machado are expected to land contracts in the $350-400 million range. To be fair I said between 300 and 500 million. Certainly the Yanks, Dodgers, Red Sox, Angels, Cubs will be willing to outbid each other and give him a huge deal. We're not going to outbid the big boys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 I haven't seen anyone say this yet so I will - if RH does trade for Machado and the player leaves as a free agent, that would count in my eyes as his 6th "fireable offense". That's how big of a mistake that would be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrathofhahn Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 (edited) QUOTE (Jack Parkman @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 05:57 PM) One can only hope that Angelos and JR are good chums and Angelos saves JR from his own inept FO. Hearing what I have today, I have lost an incredible amount of faith in the FO to see the rebuild through and do it right. They are trying a shortcut. If they don't think they can compete with other markets for Machado's services on the open market, then they should cross him out as an option and move the f*** on to other options, because bringing him here, I'm 99% sure will change nothing. If anything they should be selling off Abreu and Garcia figure out what they have for next year when it comes to prospects figure out a bullpen (move guys in and out) and get things squared away for next year. That's when the next wave of talent will happen and when it will pay to have a clean payroll The idea that Machado is going to want to play for the sox or harper or whomever after playing a bunch of meaningless games for a team destined to miss the WC is just fantastical thinking. He'll accept the best offer. The best way to be able to persuade him is by using the surplus value of the players you would have to use to trade for him and direct that money into a FA offer. Edited December 14, 2017 by wrathofhahn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 QUOTE (wrathofhahn @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 05:04 PM) If anything they should be selling off Abreu and Garcia figure out what they have for next year when it comes to prospects figure out a bullpen (move guys in and out) and get things squared away for next year. That's when the next wave of talent will happen Really. They're wasting time with "pie in the sky" ideas and should be focusing on transactions that actually help the talent pool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxbadger Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 05:04 PM) I haven't seen anyone say this yet so I will - if RH does trade for Machado and the player leaves as a free agent, that would count in my eyes as his 6th "fireable offense". That's how big of a mistake that would be. Depends on the deal, but if he gave up nothing who cares. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 (edited) QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 07:04 PM) I haven't seen anyone say this yet so I will - if RH does trade for Machado and the player leaves as a free agent, that would count in my eyes as his 6th "fireable offense". That's how big of a mistake that would be. well sure but the worst case scenario isn't that, it's that they can't recoup at the deadline what they traded in the offseason. If Machado isn't signing there's zero chance they let him just walk. I mean, if Hahn trades Kopech and Eloy for Machado you fire him too, but that's not going to happen. Edited December 14, 2017 by chitownsportsfan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 QUOTE (Jack Parkman @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 05:57 PM) One can only hope that Angelos and JR are good chums and Angelos saves JR from his own inept FO. Hearing what I have today, I have lost an incredible amount of faith in the FO to see the rebuild through and do it right. They are trying a shortcut. If they don't think they can compete with other markets for Machado's services on the open market, then they should cross him out as an option and move the f*** on to other options, because bringing him here, I'm 99% sure will change nothing. Lol...you don’t even know what we’re offering. And you’re acting like 6-7 WAR players grow on trees. We miss out on Machado our chances to add a legit superstar are greatly reduced. There’s a reason the front office is being proactive here and it’s not because they’re trying a shortcut. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 QUOTE (Jack Parkman @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 04:57 PM) One can only hope that Angelos and JR are good chums and Angelos saves JR from his own inept FO. Hearing what I have today, I have lost an incredible amount of faith in the FO to see the rebuild through and do it right. They are trying a shortcut. If they don't think they can compete with other markets for Machado's services on the open market, then they should cross him out as an option and move the f*** on to other options, because bringing him here, I'm 99% sure will change nothing. I mean, we have absolutely zero idea what has been discussed, if the Sox are being used to drive up bargaining, which players were offered, how serious any of this is. Losing faith in the front office due to winter meeting speculation is laughable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 06:04 PM) I haven't seen anyone say this yet so I will - if RH does trade for Machado and the player leaves as a free agent, that would count in my eyes as his 6th "fireable offense". That's how big of a mistake that would be. What are the other five? James Shields is obviously one of them. What else are you including? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenSox Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 (edited) QUOTE (wrathofhahn @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 05:04 PM) If anything they should be selling off Abreu and Garcia figure out what they have for next year when it comes to prospects figure out a bullpen (move guys in and out) and get things squared away for next year. That's when the next wave of talent will happen Of course. The best way to get Machado is to a) amass the most talent you can between now and then (instead of depleting it) and b) (dare I suggest) OFFER Him more money than the other suitors. Edited December 14, 2017 by GreenSox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 QUOTE (greg775 @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 05:01 PM) To be fair I said between 300 and 500 million. Certainly the Yanks, Dodgers, Red Sox, Angels, Cubs will be willing to outbid each other and give him a huge deal. We're not going to outbid the big boys. Ironically, every team you list not named White Sox is pushing close to the payroll tax threshold which will limit their flexibility to fit Machado's new salary into their future team payrolls. Meanwhile, the White Sox are way way under the luxury tax threshold and have plenty of space to work with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sleepy Harold Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 Bob Nightengale @BNightengale 43s The Baltimore #Orioles ready to trade Manny Machado - but fear a back channel to the Bronx. The #Whitesox offer not nearly as strong as rumored usatoday.com/story/sports/m… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 QUOTE (Sleepy Harold @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 06:10 PM) Bob Nightengale @BNightengale 43s The Baltimore #Orioles ready to trade Manny Machado - but fear a back channel to the Bronx. The #Whitesox offer not nearly as strong as rumored usatoday.com/story/sports/m… Wut Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxnfins Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 QUOTE (Sleepy Harold @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 05:10 PM) Bob Nightengale @BNightengale 43s The Baltimore #Orioles ready to trade Manny Machado - but fear a back channel to the Bronx. The #Whitesox offer not nearly as strong as rumored usatoday.com/story/sports/m… Boom! Nightengale with he whammy. No one knows what’s going on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 QUOTE (Quin @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 05:11 PM) Wut Fear of getting dealt to Yanks from another team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yesterday333 Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 Haha watching this thread is good entertainment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeGone7 Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 This is not a smart deal. Let's face it. People need to contain their excitement over having him and recognize there is a very real & extremely high-risk here. You cannot deal elite prospects for that in our position. Sure, if it pans out and he signs an extension, we'll all be happy. No question. But you're a heavy underdog in that bet today. To me, this has Miggy written all over it. Baltimore is using us (and a former beat writer) to drive up the other offers. Other teams have to respect the Sox farm (and aggressiveness in the front office) and they probably did not expect us to enter the sweepstakes when making their offers. We won't really know until the names/offers are leaked. Until that time, it's all speculation, and that helps one team - the Orioles. Now maybe the offers really do suck and we have the strongest. That'd be great. I just don't foresee that to include a Kopech level talent. Fulmer, Adams, Dunning, etc? Sure. Giolito, Lopez & Hansen? Meh. I'll stomach it but I wouldn't want to deal any of the three for a rental. Maybe his agent has informed the Sox he is open to an extension and given him an idea of what they'll be asking for. Idk. None of us do. But we have a path we are following. Seems odd to disrupt it with this level of risk associated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 06:08 PM) I mean, we have absolutely zero idea what has been discussed, if the Sox are being used to drive up bargaining, which players were offered, how serious any of this is. Losing faith in the front office due to winter meeting speculation is laughable They don’t call him Jack “HoT TaKe” Parkman for nothing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGajewski18 Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 QUOTE (Quin @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 05:11 PM) Wut No Kopech and no Giolito is my guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 06:09 PM) What are the other five? James Shields is obviously one of them. What else are you including? I'm just going with the "2013, 2015, 2016" offseasons in general and "Robin Ventura's contract extension" as my list of 5. Trading for Machado and then having him walk would rival any of those. It would be totally unacceptable in every imaginable way. So, whatever they have to give up for him, I'm only ok with it once the extension is done. Until then, it's a disaster in the making and every day that goes by makes it more of a risk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sockin Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 New Nightengale article says the Sox do NOT have nearly a strong of an offer that has been rumored. He says their offer does not include any top prospects and is based on the value that they would have him for one year. https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/mlb/c...rade/953798001/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 05:08 PM) I mean, we have absolutely zero idea what has been discussed, if the Sox are being used to drive up bargaining, which players were offered, how serious any of this is. Losing faith in the front office due to winter meeting speculation is laughable If there is any truth to these rumors, I disagree. I would feel much better if as soon as the 72 hr window non-existence tweet came out, then Hahn pulled his offer and there was a report that they were out on Machado. Zero reason to give up ANYTHING without an extension in place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 06:08 PM) I mean, we have absolutely zero idea what has been discussed, if the Sox are being used to drive up bargaining, which players were offered, how serious any of this is. Losing faith in the front office due to winter meeting speculation is laughable I wouldn't lose faith if it were announced as done with no extension associated with it...but I'd be ****ing nervous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxbadger Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 05:12 PM) Fear of getting dealt to Yanks from another team. Yep, fear that the Sox trade for Machado and then he is flipped to Yankees for their prospects. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 It would be great if Sox screwed over Baltimore. Every other team would be pleased Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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