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White Sox have shown interest in Machado

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QUOTE (SonofaRoache @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 01:16 AM)
You can't be serious...

Hahn became GM after 2012 season. Started the rebuild after 2016 season. That is 4 years.

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QUOTE (SonofaRoache @ Dec 13, 2017 -> 10:55 PM)
He isn't Machado. Shark wasn't nearly the level of player Machado is and he wasn't worthy of re-signing after his one year here.

You know how many people thought Samardzija was a great candidate to resign with the Sox ? This board had a ton of posters just like you with Machado thinking Samardzija would not test free agency. The fact that Machado is way better than Samardzija makes it even more likely he becomes a FA.Even if he thinks Chicago is great, Hahn is great, the players are great the field is great , the fans are great and the Sox will be serious contenders for a World Series he will still become a free agent.

 

If the Sox truly want him get him as a Free agent at least that way there's another year of development and Kopech and Jimenez are on the Sox at mid season they keep ABreu and Avi and both have good years and the young starting pitchers continue to grow and our other top prospects put up some good numbers. The Sox may be even more attractive in a years time but right now the Sox need to let th rebuild continue to grow.

 

Can you imagine getting Machado for a year than Hahn trades Abreu and Avi not to mention whatever he gave up for Machado ? How the heck would that look to Machado ? It would be like 1 step forward and 3 steps back.

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QUOTE (Tony @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 02:16 AM)
A less than a year into the "rebuild", there are serious rumors about trading top prospects for one year rentals.

 

You want to be honest? The Sox had Chris Sale, Jose Quintana, Jose Abreu and Adam Eaton all in their prime, on the same team, and couldn't really come close to building a winner around them. The only reason this rebuild has gone over well with us is the lack of excitement around perennial losing teams every single season. This has been a TERRIBLE decade of White Sox baseball.

 

They've had a good 12 months in hitting the reset button. But I don't want to hear anything about "They've earned my trust."

 

The Front Office has a LONG way to go before they earn anything.

 

 

Well we don't even know if that's true yet or not. And what if we do re-sign Machado because we traded for him early? Would it still be a mistake then?

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QUOTE (whitesoxwinner @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 02:18 AM)
Hahn became GM after 2012 season. Started the rebuild after 2016 season. That is 4 years.

 

 

I said in my post, first time he got the chance without Kenny forcing his hand. Meaning, Kenny stopped forcing his hand and let him proceed with building the team as he saw fit recently.

Edited by SonofaRoache

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I bet the offer is Giolito and Anderson. This would allow Machado to play SS.

 

How awesome would it be though if it was a three way with the Yankees. AGAIN THIS WOULD NEVER HAPPEN.

 

Yankees:

Machado

 

O's:

Giolito

Anderson

 

White Sox:

Ellsbury-Plus 10 Million

Torres- Top 5 Prospect

Sheffield-Top 40 Prospect- not updated but I just suspect

Frazier- Not the biggest fan but ya know they are shopping him.

 

Yankees:

Get their Short Stop of the Future and Rid themselves of Machado. Immediately can sign him to a 10-$300 deal. Get rid of that ugly contract

 

O'S:

Get to a short stop to replace Machado and a starting pitcher

 

White Sox:

Ellsbury- Is actually a useful player just not start quality. Say we get 10 million from the Yankees. That pay down the contract to 56 Million/3. Roughly a little less than 19 million per season.

 

Torres: Could pretty much immediately replace Anderson at Short Stop.

 

Sheffield- Reports from Law and Longenhagen were extremely high on his AFL. I would not doubt he jumps inside the top 40.

 

Frazier- Probably my least favorite prospect of the bunch.

 

 

 

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QUOTE (SonofaRoache @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 02:15 AM)
How are we blowing up our rebuild?

 

Moncada, Kopech, Lopez, Fulmer, Rodon, Jimenez, Robert, Cease, Hansen, Burger, Collins, Rutherford, Burdi, Dunning, and 4th pick would mostly all be here.

 

We don’t need him this year and we don’t need to trade young players to sign him. He’s testing FA. If you need him that bad have the front office start preparing their pitch today.

 

He will be the Jay Cutler of the White Sox.

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QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 02:19 AM)
You know how many people thought Samardzija was a great candidate to resign with the Sox ? This board had a ton of posters just like you with Machado thinking Samardzija would not test free agency. The fact that Machado is way better than Samardzija makes it even more likely he becomes a FA.Even if he thinks Chicago is great, Hahn is great, the players are great the field is great , the fans are great and the Sox will be serious contenders for a World Series he will still become a free agent.

 

If the Sox truly want him get him as a Free agent at least that way there's another year of development and Kopech and Jimenez are on the Sox at mid season they keep ABreu and Avi and both have good years and the young starting pitchers continue to grow and our other top prospects put up some good numbers. The Sox may be even more attractive in a years time but right now the Sox need to let th rebuild continue to grow.

 

Can you imagine getting Machado for a year than Hahn trades Abreu and Avi not to mention whatever he gave up for Machado ? How the heck would that look to Machado ? It would be like 1 step forward and 3 steps back.

 

 

I don't disagree with the statement on Shark. Sure people thought we'd re-sign him, but my point is that trade should have never been made to begin with. His numbers weren't that good, especially not worthy of the deal he wanted anyway. He is James Shields with a little more height. I think Hahn is going after him because he knows it'll be tough to talk any of the big FA's into coming here without some type of boost. If 6 teams offer 10/300, we aren't winning that race. Maybe Hahn had Castilo chat with him and heard back that he would have to test Chicago out first before signing a deal. Either way, I think Hahn knows what he is doing and I have no reason to doubt him after these past 12 months.

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QUOTE (soxforlife05 @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 02:25 AM)
We don’t need him this year and we don’t need to trade young players to sign him. He’s testing FA. If you need him that bad have the front office start preparing their pitch today.

 

He will be the Jay Cutler of the White Sox.

 

 

This type of thinking is what puts teams like the Twins behind the Yankees, Red Sox, etc every year. You have to gain any advantage you can over the big boys. Remember, there is no promise we can build a team better than Houston, LAA, Yankees, Red Sox, or the Indians. That's 5 teams we have to worry about the next 5-7 years, and even with our crop of prospects, we aren't at that level.

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QUOTE (SonofaRoache @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 02:26 AM)
.Either way, I think Hahn knows what he is doing and I have no reason to doubt him after these past 12 months.

 

What have the White Sox won with Hahn as GM? 1 division title? No playoff wins? i don’t even remember the year Hahn took over. The Shark and Shields deals don’t bother you? Or you gonna say KW did those because they were bad trades lol

Edited by soxforlife05

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QUOTE (SonofaRoache @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 02:29 AM)
This type of thinking is what puts teams like the Twins behind the Yankees, Red Sox, etc every year. You have to gain any advantage you can over the big boys. Remember, there is no promise we can build a team better than Houston, LAA, Yankees, Red Sox, or the Indians. That's 5 teams we have to worry about the next 5-7 years, and even with our crop of prospects, we aren't at that level.

 

You weren’t around for the Shark deal where everyone who was later proven wrong made the same arguments you are making now.

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QUOTE (Tony @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 02:31 AM)
If the Sox give up anything of significant value? Yes, it would still be a mistake.

 

Manny Machado has been on a middle of the road Baltimore team his entire career. He'll come to Chicago in 2018 and play in an empty ballpark for a team that is probably going to 72-75 games, at most. He's a 25 year old on the verge of signing one of the largest contracts in SPORTS history, and you honestly believe he's going to be enamored about playing with Moncada and Eloy?

 

Stop acting like Veruca Salt, take a deep breath, and wait out the rebuild. Do it the right way. Acquire as many young assets as you can, let them develop, and see who become core pieces.

 

 

We aren't trading Moncada, Kopech, and Gio here. We are trading our 3rd best pitching prospect, and while not ideal, it's not like the rebuild will end because we trade him.

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The White Sox reportedly had the best offer.

That might mean we are into the 72 hour window as we speak.

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Kopech or Giolito is insanity. Pure insanity. Even with an extension.

 

Kopech, Giolito, Hansen, Rodon all need to be off the table. Lopez as well likely. Cease and Dunning, sure, with an extension in place.

 

But Kopech is a damn near fireable offense.

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QUOTE (soxforlife05 @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 02:32 AM)
You weren’t around for the Shark deal where everyone who was later proven wrong made the same arguments you are making now.

 

 

I'm making an argument for a great baseball player though moving to a big city. Shark sucked, played for the Cubs so the White Sox were probably meh to him in comparison, and re-signing him would have been a horrible mistake anyway because he sucks.

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Now that Stanton is in Yankee pinstripes, I think it is almost a certainty that Machado will be a Yankee next offseason. The Sox are delusional if they think that they can convince Machado to sign here without testing FA. Giving up anything for him now is a mistake. It would certainly make me lose a ton of faith in the FO's ability to stay the course and rebuild correctly.

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QUOTE (SonofaRoache @ Dec 13, 2017 -> 11:26 PM)
I don't disagree with the statement on Shark. Sure people thought we'd re-sign him, but my point is that trade should have never been made to begin with. His numbers weren't that good, especially not worthy of the deal he wanted anyway. He is James Shields with a little more height. I think Hahn is going after him because he knows it'll be tough to talk any of the big FA's into coming here without some type of boost. If 6 teams offer 10/300, we aren't winning that race. Maybe Hahn had Castilo chat with him and heard back that he would have to test Chicago out first before signing a deal. Either way, I think Hahn knows what he is doing and I have no reason to doubt him after these past 12 months.

Hahn may be doing a great job with the rebuild but the Samardzija thing was a disaster and Hahn was the guy who did that. So you trust Hahn but think the Samardzija deal was a terrible thing that Hahn did ? So has he earned your trust because of the rebuild but all of a sudden it's not a rebuild it's a trade just like the Samardzija trade ? Those who do not learn from their mistakes are doomed to repeat them.

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QUOTE (SonofaRoache @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 01:38 AM)
I'm making an argument for a great baseball player though moving to a big city. Shark sucked, played for the Cubs so the White Sox were probably meh to him in comparison, and re-signing him would have been a horrible mistake anyway because he sucks.

 

You have this weird assumption that all it takes is 1 magical year on the Sox and Machado is going to fall in love. He's going to be playing in front of 10k people and lose 90+ games.

 

Money. Money is all that matters. If we can't offer him the most money + opt outs + NTC he's never going to sign here, now or in 2018.

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Well, I think we've found a thread to crack out on for a couple weeks or months

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QUOTE (Quin @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 01:37 AM)
Kopech or Giolito is insanity. Pure insanity. Even with an extension.

 

Kopech, Giolito, Hansen, Rodon all need to be off the table. Lopez as well likely. Cease and Dunning, sure, with an extension in place.

 

But Kopech is a damn near fireable offense.

Agreed. This is such a dumb White Sox move. Just when I thought the organization had come to their senses...............

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QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 02:40 AM)
Hahn may be doing a great job with the rebuild but the Samardzija thing was a disaster and Hahn was the guy who did that. So you trust Hahn but think the Samardzija deal was a terrible thing that Hahn did ? So has he earned your trust because of the rebuild but all of a sudden it's not a rebuild it's a trade just like the Samardzija trade ? Those who do not learn from their mistakes are doomed to repeat them.

 

 

 

That Shark trade smells like Kenny. A vet pitcher who was brought in to go for it. Machado is coming to be a part of the rebuild if it happens. I trust Hahn in this rebuild because his moves have been excellent. This is what I mean when I say I have no reason to doubt him. Building the team, and not simply trying to go for it with an average team has gone much better.

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QUOTE (Jenksy Cat @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 02:40 AM)
You have this weird assumption that all it takes is 1 magical year on the Sox and Machado is going to fall in love. He's going to be playing in front of 10k people and lose 90+ games.

 

Money. Money is all that matters. If we can't offer him the most money + opt outs + NTC he's never going to sign here, now or in 2018.

 

 

My belief is that we have zero percent chance to sign him in FA. I think that goes up to 70 percent if we offer him a top offer after he is traded here. I think this team is going to surprise people and if healthy can get close to 81. It wont be a fairy tale situation but knowing that we will start to compete in 2019 should be the cherry

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QUOTE (SonofaRoache @ Dec 14, 2017 -> 02:59 AM)
That Shark trade smells like Kenny. A vet pitcher who was brought in to go for it.

 

Lol I predicted you would say this 30 minutes ago. All the bad trades are KW's fault, all the good trades are Hahn's. You probably think the Shields trade was KW too right?

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