Race for the worst 2018 record (Top 5 pick) again

[Kyyle23]

47 minutes ago, GreenSox said:

The Cubs were losing so they brought in new front office:  a front office  with world series cred.  They told the fans it would take a few years.  They went through 3 managers in 3 years.  What stars did they trade?  Samardzija?  34 year old Dempster?  They didn’t really tank, they just built.

Very little comparison to how things work on the southside.  And it doesn't take much imagination how the casual fan would be more excited about the Cubs approach to building a team.

Arent there multiple players on the Cubs world series roster that were in those trades?   You know, guys like Hendricks and Russell?   or maybe the Feldman for Strop and Arrietta?  Garza got them CJ Edwards and Justin Grimm.

 

Thats pretty much rebuilding

[soxfan49]

23 hours ago, flavum said:

While I'd like them to go 3-9, and somehow grab the 2nd spot, it's not happening. 3rd spot is almost a lock unless the Marlins go on a Tigers of 2017 run...which I suppose is possible.

A long time ago (probably May), I wanted the Sox to come home from Houston 30-60.  They're one loss away today from being there.

Here's a breakdown of the final 72, Home-Away-Total (my guess):

KC 9-3-12 (8-4)

Det 3-7-10 (4-6)

Cle 6-3-9 (3-6)

Min 2-5-7 (3-4)

LAA 3-4-7 (2-5)

NY 3-3-6 (1-5)

Bos 4-0-4 (1-3)

Bal 0-3-3 (2-1)

TB 0-3-3 (1-2)

Tor 3-0-3 (2-1)

Sea 0-3-3 (0-3)

Cubs 3-0-3 (1-2)

Stl 2-0-2 (1-1) Covey vs Mikolas, Rodon vs Weaver

29-43

59-103, 3rd pick

Agree. I think it should be etched in stone that the best they could pick is #3. After KC deals Moustakas and Baltimore trades Machado, they could both lose 120 games. The Sox won't.

Edited July 9, 2018 by soxfan49

[southsider2k5]

38 minutes ago, Jose Abreu said:

Rebuilds are a lot easier when your future GM gifts you a stud first baseman, the Astros inexplicably pass on Bryant, the A's somehow give up 6 years of a top prospect for two months of a mediocre pitcher, etc. Takes a lot of luck.

And half a billion dollars in free agents paid for by a full Wrigley Field on a nightly basis.

[Chicago White Sox]

39 minutes ago, GreenSox said:

The Cubs were losing so they brought in new front office:  a front office  with world series cred.  They told the fans it would take a few years.  They went through 3 managers in 3 years.  What stars did they trade?  Samardzija?  34 year old Dempster?  They didn’t really tank, they just built.

Very little comparison to how things work on the southside.  And it doesn't take much imagination how the casual fan would be more excited about the Cubs approach to building a team.

Bringing in a different front office is an entirely different debate.  We are losing lots of games right now which is part of the plan.  That has been communicated to our fan base by our front office.  It will take a couple years, which has also been communicated.  This is no different than what the Cubs said & did and I don’t recall anyone calling their rough years as embarrassing.  Sure, a lot of fans temporarily lost interest in the team, but that’s only natural.  But for some reason, a relatively large group of fans here despise the rebuild but can’t help watching it anyways.  Our 2018 season is exactly what a 1st/2nd year rebuilding year looks like.  If you guys can’t handle it, please take some time off.  Developing multiple young players at once is not always going to be fun and right now we’re still trying out a bunch of fringe major-leaguers.  Take a few weeks or even months off and come back when some of the ugliness has passed.  It won’t make you any lesser of a fan.  I can fully appreciate how enduring it is to watch this team on a daily basis.

[southsider2k5]

Just now, Chicago White Sox said:

Bringing in a different front office is an entirely different debate.  We are losing lots of games right now which is part of the plan.  That has been communicated to our fan base by our front office.  It will take a couple years, which has also been communicated.  This is no different than what the Cubs said & did and I don’t recall anyone calling their rough years as embarrassing.  Sure, a lot of fans temporarily lost interest in the team, but that’s only natural.  But for some reason, a relatively large group of fans here despise the rebuild but can’t help watching it anyways.  Our 2018 season is exactly what a 1st/2nd year rebuilding year looks like.  If you guys can’t handle it, please take some time off.  Developing multiple young players at once is not always going to be fun and right now we’re still trying out a bunch of fringe major-leaguers.  Take a few weeks or even months off and come back when some of the ugliness has passed.  It won’t make you any lesser of a fan.  I can fully appreciate how enduring it is to watch this team on a daily basis.

[Kyyle23]

1 hour ago, Juschill said:

The embarrassment is that the Cubs, while tanking, were still outdrawing the all-in White Sox by about a million fans per season.

The Cubs always draw, it really doesnt embarrass me.  Houston wasnt drawing huge crowds when they were losing 100 for three years straight.  They recovered, their fans got over it.

[SonofaRoache]

11 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Bringing in a different front office is an entirely different debate.  We are losing lots of games right now which is part of the plan.  That has been communicated to our fan base by our front office.  It will take a couple years, which has also been communicated.  This is no different than what the Cubs said & did and I don’t recall anyone calling their rough years as embarrassing.  Sure, a lot of fans temporarily lost interest in the team, but that’s only natural.  But for some reason, a relatively large group of fans here despise the rebuild but can’t help watching it anyways.  Our 2018 season is exactly what a 1st/2nd year rebuilding year looks like.  If you guys can’t handle it, please take some time off.  Developing multiple young players at once is not always going to be fun and right now we’re still trying out a bunch of fringe major-leaguers.  Take a few weeks or even months off and come back when some of the ugliness has passed.  It won’t make you any lesser of a fan.  I can fully appreciate how enduring it is to watch this team on a daily basis.

You have some great points. The problem is we care about baseball so much and there is no other sport to care about until September. It's not easy to just take time off. I think another issue is Moncada and Anderson are probably the only two guys who will be a regular during our competing years. Lopez and maybe Gio will be as well. So we're watching a bunch of guys who won't be here suck it up. I'd rather have our fans vent and complain to endure these times than for them to lose interest and become Cubs fans. 

[southsider2k5]

15 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said:

The Cubs always draw, it really doesnt embarrass me.  Houston wasnt drawing huge crowds when they were losing 100 for three years straight.  They recovered, their fans got over it.

Houston at one point quite literally had a zero TV rating.

[joejoedairy]

25 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Bringing in a different front office is an entirely different debate.  We are losing lots of games right now which is part of the plan.  That has been communicated to our fan base by our front office.  It will take a couple years, which has also been communicated.  This is no different than what the Cubs said & did and I don’t recall anyone calling their rough years as embarrassing.  Sure, a lot of fans temporarily lost interest in the team, but that’s only natural.  But for some reason, a relatively large group of fans here despise the rebuild but can’t help watching it anyways.  Our 2018 season is exactly what a 1st/2nd year rebuilding year looks like.  If you guys can’t handle it, please take some time off.  Developing multiple young players at once is not always going to be fun and right now we’re still trying out a bunch of fringe major-leaguers.  Take a few weeks or even months off and come back when some of the ugliness has passed.  It won’t make you any lesser of a fan.  I can fully appreciate how enduring it is to watch this team on a daily basis.

There were definitely fans and newspaper guys who were calling them embarrassing. "thats so cub" was a derisive comment at the time

[BamaDoc]

I am a diehard fan.  I do not change teams and have been with the Sox since Bill Veeck.  I am an optimist  and I support the rebuild.  I now go to the minor league box scores first.  There are enough prospects and teams that everyday I can find something good...........then I look at the big club.

[zisk]

1 hour ago, soxfan49 said:

Agree. I think it should be etched in stone that the best they could pick is #3. After KC deals Moustakas and Baltimore trades Machado, they could both lose 120 games. The Sox won't.

    I really have a hard time fathoming how bad Baltimore and KC are. Every time it gets tough waiting for 2019-2020, think about how you would feel

    if our farm system were like theirs. Then we would be bad and with out hope.

[soxfan49]

19 minutes ago, zisk said:

    I really have a hard time fathoming how bad Baltimore and KC are. Every time it gets tough waiting for 2019-2020, think about how you would feel

    if our farm system were like theirs. Then we would be bad and with out hope.

Shockingly enough, it might be worse to be an Angels fan. I'm sure living in Anaheim is nice and cheering for Trout is badass, but their roster is old and expensive and their farm system could be baseball's worst.

[turnin' two]

8 minutes ago, soxfan49 said:

Shockingly enough, it might be worse to be an Angels fan. I'm sure living in Anaheim is nice and cheering for Trout is badass, but their roster is old and expensive and their farm system could be baseball's worst.

This isn't the case anymore.  While their system was terrible for a while, it has gotten much better over the past few seasons.  I believe now they sport something like 5 top 100 prospects and have a system rated somewhere in the middle of the pack.  

[soxfan49]

7 minutes ago, turnin' two said:

This isn't the case anymore.  While their system was terrible for a while, it has gotten much better over the past few seasons.  I believe now they sport something like 5 top 100 prospects and have a system rated somewhere in the middle of the pack.  

You're right. My apologies. However, while on the topic, I'm reading a farm system ranking article now and they have the Royals dead last and the O's 23rd. Yikes.

[SonofaRoache]

52 minutes ago, soxfan49 said:

You're right. My apologies. However, while on the topic, I'm reading a farm system ranking article now and they have the Royals dead last and the O's 23rd. Yikes.

The Royals were trash for 30 years and then played in consecutive world series'. I think their fans are okay. 

[soxfan49]

Just now, SonofaRoache said:

The Royals were trash for 30 years and then played in consecutive world series'. I think their fans are okay. 

I don't think being relevant for 6% of the time in 32 year intervals would make any fan base happy.

[SonofaRoache]

52 minutes ago, soxfan49 said:

I don't think being relevant for 6% of the time in 32 year intervals would make any fan base happy.

Those two WS teams came a few years ago. They waited forever and got to compete in back to back years recently. Now they will wait again. 

[GreenSox]

12 hours ago, Jose Abreu said:

Rebuilds are a lot easier when your future GM gifts you a stud first baseman, the Astros inexplicably pass on Bryant, the A's somehow give up 6 years of a top prospect for two months of a mediocre pitcher, etc. Takes a lot of luck.

There was luck (and the Rizzo deal was highly questionable).  The Brewers struck gold on several deals.  Look at the Dodgers - turning AAAA players into among the best in baseball.
But if you make enough smart deals, you will make your own luck.  If you know how to evaluate talent, you create your own luck - do they?  If you are willing to make a move and  strike at the right time, you can create your own luck.   

 

Edited July 10, 2018 by GreenSox

[BFirebird]

12 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Bringing in a different front office is an entirely different debate.  We are losing lots of games right now which is part of the plan.  That has been communicated to our fan base by our front office.  It will take a couple years, which has also been communicated.  This is no different than what the Cubs said & did and I don’t recall anyone calling their rough years as embarrassing.  Sure, a lot of fans temporarily lost interest in the team, but that’s only natural.  But for some reason, a relatively large group of fans here despise the rebuild but can’t help watching it anyways.  Our 2018 season is exactly what a 1st/2nd year rebuilding year looks like.  If you guys can’t handle it, please take some time off.  Developing multiple young players at once is not always going to be fun and right now we’re still trying out a bunch of fringe major-leaguers.  Take a few weeks or even months off and come back when some of the ugliness has passed.  It won’t make you any lesser of a fan.  I can fully appreciate how enduring it is to watch this team on a daily basis.

This is post of the year material right here.  Pretty much my thoughts exactly.  Well said.

[Lip Man 1]

1 hour ago, GreenSox said:

But if you make enough smart deals, you will make your own luck.  If you know how to evaluate talent, you create your own luck - do they?  If you are willing to make a move and  strike at the right time, you can create your own luck.   

 

Agreed. "Luck is the residue of design..." -  HOF Baseball Executive Branch Rickey

[Balta1701]

12 hours ago, GreenSox said:

There was luck (and the Rizzo deal was highly questionable).  The Brewers struck gold on several deals.  Look at the Dodgers - turning AAAA players into among the best in baseball.
But if you make enough smart deals, you will make your own luck.  If you know how to evaluate talent, you create your own luck - do they?  If you are willing to make a move and  strike at the right time, you can create your own luck.   

 

Somewhat on this subject, our old friend Frankie Montas, traded as part of the Rick Hahn Special to the Dodgers for Todd Frazier and then to Oakland as part of the Rich Hill/Josh Reddick deal, shut down the Astros with a 6 inning 0 run performance last night.

[Kyyle23]

8 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Somewhat on this subject, our old friend Frankie Montas, traded as part of the Rick Hahn Special to the Dodgers for Todd Frazier and then to Oakland as part of the Rich Hill/Josh Reddick deal, shut down the Astros with a 6 inning 0 run performance last night.

he never lacked talent.  He just cant stay healthy

[Dam8610]

1 hour ago, Balta1701 said:

Somewhat on this subject, our old friend Frankie Montas, traded as part of the Rick Hahn Special to the Dodgers for Todd Frazier and then to Oakland as part of the Rich Hill/Josh Reddick deal, shut down the Astros with a 6 inning 0 run performance last night.

Well, he eventually turned into part of the package that acquired Rutherford, so if he becomes what we hope, the Sox could still come out ahead.

[footlongcomiskeydog]

1 hour ago, Kyyle23 said:

he never lacked talent.  He just cant stay healthy

Let's hope we aren't saying the same thing about Luis Robert and Eloy three years from now.

[Boopa1219]

On 7/8/2018 at 9:48 AM, flavum said:

While I'd like them to go 3-9, and somehow grab the 2nd spot, it's not happening. 3rd spot is almost a lock unless the Marlins go on a Tigers of 2017 run...which I suppose is possible.

A long time ago (probably May), I wanted the Sox to come home from Houston 30-60.  They're one loss away today from being there.

Here's a breakdown of the final 72, Home-Away-Total (my guess):

KC 9-3-12 (8-4)

Det 3-7-10 (4-6)

Cle 6-3-9 (3-6)

Min 2-5-7 (3-4)

LAA 3-4-7 (2-5)

NY 3-3-6 (1-5)

Bos 4-0-4 (1-3)

Bal 0-3-3 (2-1)

TB 0-3-3 (1-2)

Tor 3-0-3 (2-1)

Sea 0-3-3 (0-3)

Cubs 3-0-3 (1-2)

Stl 2-0-2 (1-1) Covey vs Mikolas, Rodon vs Weaver

29-43

59-103, 3rd pick

Definitely hoping for below 20 wins. It’s a stretch but every loss counts. 

Edited July 11, 2018 by Joshua Strong