Chisoxfn Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 5 minutes ago, Soxbadger said: Same here, if the Bears were 1 pick higher theyd have gotten that tampa deal and be sitting really great right now. I wonder who Pace was trying to trade up for? Chubb or Nelson? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wanne Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 I'm going to guess if he wanted to trade up earlier...it was Nelson. If he wanted to trade up into the end of the 1st round I'd guess Will Hernandez. Of course I could be way off...but makes sense (in my mind lol). I'll be thrilled if Hernandez somehow falls to the Bears. He's an animal...and honestly not all that far awful far off from Nelson. But you could be right...could have been Chubb...and then Landry (who I'm not a fan of at all). But I can't see the first two picks being D...that's why I'm guessing Hernandez. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 I’ll be first two picks are defense, especially if Jackson, Landry, Georgia backer and Davenport are on the board. If we go offense, I trade down in 2nd and take that lsu wideout. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan49 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 (edited) Used and abused at the point of attack? Is every fan base this disgusting? In 15 games last season he had 137 tackles, 14 TFL and 6.5 sacks. Not sure how much more production you’re looking for at 8th overall, but perhaps if the athletic OG was there at 8, we’d all be thrilled about the tiny impact he’s going to have in the NFL. He was absolutely the best player in the Georgia/OU game (and all of the other Georgia games). Every LB gets blocked. That’s what happens. Wasn’t that what Urlacher’s one issue was, getting off blocks? The Bears got maybe the best defensive player in the draft and dopes like Hub Arkush and the millions of moronic Bears fans all over the globe are complaining. Rough crowd. As for trading down, they’re second and third round picks? 15% of second rounders hit and 8% of third rounders pick, yet Pace wasn’t smart to stay at 8 rather than move down 5 spots to get a couple second rounders that will likely be either special teams gunners or on another team (or in another league) in 6 years. Edited April 27, 2018 by soxfan49 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan49 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 1 minute ago, Chisoxfn said: I’ll be first two picks are defense, especially if Jackson, Landry, Georgia backer and Davenport are on the board. If we go offense, I trade down in 2nd and take that lsu wideout. Davenport got drafted 14th overall Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan49 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 49 minutes ago, Soxbadger said: Same here, if the Bears were 1 pick higher theyd have gotten that tampa deal and be sitting really great right now. Well no because then they wouldn’t have the draft’s best linebacker and instead they’d likely have a SS or FS that wouldn’t see the field much in 2018 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wanne Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 1 hour ago, soxfan49 said: As for trading down, they’re second and third round picks? 15% of second rounders hit and 8% of third rounders pick, yet Pace wasn’t smart to stay at 8 rather than move down 5 spots to get a couple second rounders that will likely be either special teams gunners or on another team (or in another league) in 6 years. Bears don't have a 3d round pick this year. So tomorrows 2nd rounder...that's it unless he uses his two 4ths and something else to move up. That said...I'm extremely happy with the Roquan pick. Pretty sure Vic was all over that. They're all crap shoots. Hell...Lance Briggs was a 3rd round pick...so stating 2nd rounders are most likely garbage or merely gunners is inherently wrong. This is a deep draft...so there is some reasoning to trading down. I'm happy with Roquan...but moving down a few spots and picking up two 2nds would have been sweet!!!! Not understanding your rant at all... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheTruth05 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 6 hours ago, soxfan49 said: Used and abused at the point of attack? Is every fan base this disgusting? In 15 games last season he had 137 tackles, 14 TFL and 6.5 sacks. Not sure how much more production you’re looking for at 8th overall, but perhaps if the athletic OG was there at 8, we’d all be thrilled about the tiny impact he’s going to have in the NFL. He was absolutely the best player in the Georgia/OU game (and all of the other Georgia games). Every LB gets blocked. That’s what happens. Wasn’t that what Urlacher’s one issue was, getting off blocks? The Bears got maybe the best defensive player in the draft and dopes like Hub Arkush and the millions of moronic Bears fans all over the globe are complaining. Rough crowd. As for trading down, they’re second and third round picks? 15% of second rounders hit and 8% of third rounders pick, yet Pace wasn’t smart to stay at 8 rather than move down 5 spots to get a couple second rounders that will likely be either special teams gunners or on another team (or in another league) in 6 years. Look at the guys film and you can't say Pace was dumb for not trading down. Who the hell knows if he wasn't getting the same offer the Raider's received for 10. Give me the consensus stud MLB instead of some DB in the 3rd round that might or might not become a rotation guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 There are several interior linemen with 1st round grades still available. Seems like a good chance one of them makes it to #7. I think James Daniels could be the pick there if Pace doesn’t move down and try to recoup a 3rd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 9 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: There are several interior linemen with 1st round grades still available. Seems like a good chance one of them makes it to #7. I think James Daniels could be the pick there if Pace doesn’t move down and try to recoup a 3rd. Depends on how the Bears view Whitehair long term. Hernandez is also still there if they believe Whitehair is a C. On a side note, I'll be shocked if Landry isn't a Cleveland Brown tonight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan49 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 6 hours ago, Wanne said: Bears don't have a 3d round pick this year. So tomorrows 2nd rounder...that's it unless he uses his two 4ths and something else to move up. That said...I'm extremely happy with the Roquan pick. Pretty sure Vic was all over that. They're all crap shoots. Hell...Lance Briggs was a 3rd round pick...so stating 2nd rounders are most likely garbage or merely gunners is inherently wrong. This is a deep draft...so there is some reasoning to trading down. I'm happy with Roquan...but moving down a few spots and picking up two 2nds would have been sweet!!!! Not understanding your rant at all... I said 15% of second rounders & 8% of third rounders pan out, so yes, they most likely are garbage. Go look at the other 2003 third rounders. Fun exercise right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 11 minutes ago, soxfan49 said: I said 15% of second rounders & 8% of third rounders pan out, so yes, they most likely are garbage. Go look at the other 2003 third rounders. Fun exercise right? That seems incredibly low to me, how are you defining “pan out”? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 I just saw that Shazier walked on stage yesterday for the Steelers pick. That's awesome, they were so quiet on his progress and they always seemed to show him sitting, glad to see he's up on his feet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan49 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 48 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: That seems incredibly low to me, how are you defining “pan out”? It’s not. It’s a fact. I can’t seem to locate where I read it. I believe their version of pan out was “moderately (or better) impacting their respective teams’ win or loss outcome.” In 2003, the only players I recognize- Briggs, Witten, Ricky Manning, and Corey Redding Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 (edited) Simple math will show that can't be true. There are about 1700 players on NFL rosters. Careers are pretty short. They can't all be first round picks. Edited April 27, 2018 by Dick Allen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 (edited) 8 hours ago, Wanne said: Bears don't have a 3d round pick this year. So tomorrows 2nd rounder...that's it unless he uses his two 4ths and something else to move up. I'd be shocked if he doesn't, especially considering Bears have Tillman (and Singletary) announcing the pick(s) tonight as Tillman will be featured as the Walter Payton Man Of The Year winner. Edited April 27, 2018 by SoxAce Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan49 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Dick Allen said: Simple math will show that can't be true. I'm not going to use 2016 or 2017 yet because it's too early to judge, but there were 106 third round picks from 2013-2015. I've identified 11 that are moderately impactful or better: Larry Warford, Tyrann Mathieu, Keenan Allen, Jordan Reed, Morgan Moses, Trai Turner, Jerick McKinnon (questionable), Tyler Lockett (questionable), AJ Cann (questionable), Ty Montgomery (questionable) and David Johnson. Even giving you the questionable guys, that's 10.4%. If I removed 2 of the 4 questionable players, say Cann and McKinnon, we're at 8.4%. Tah dah! Edited April 27, 2018 by soxfan49 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 So Pace tried to get back into the first round late yesterday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan49 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 (edited) 57 minutes ago, Dick Allen said: Simple math will show that can't be true. There are about 1700 players on NFL rosters. Careers are pretty short. They can't all be first round picks. I know that. I'm not completely discrediting mid-round picks, but it seems like Bears fans solution every year is TRADE DOWN!!!! They hated trading up for Trubisky and hated trading up for Floyd. Now they stay still and get the best ILB in the draft, and we're upset over it. I'd much rather stay and get a top 10 pick than one in the teens (where the percentages drop again), especially if the prospect is as good as most think he is. Edited April 27, 2018 by soxfan49 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 25 minutes ago, soxfan49 said: I know that. I'm not completely discrediting mid-round picks, but it seems like Bears fans solution every year is TRADE DOWN!!!! They hated trading up for Trubisky and hated trading up for Floyd. Now they stay still and get the best ILB in the draft, and we're upset over it. I'd much rather stay and get a top 10 pick than one in the teens (where the percentages drop again), especially if the prospect is as good as most think he is. It isn't just a Bears fan thing. Look at Bill Belliceck's history of drafting. I'd say its largely worked out well for him. It takes a GM who is comfortable in his skin to move down, with some of the times, the moves being to accumulate future draft capital (i.e., picks in the following year). Bottom line, if you statistically have guys who are all closely graded and you can move down a few picks and add additional quality players without much degredation in talent, you do it. I also generally believe numbers play into it, so the more quality picks you have, the better the overall chances. If an elite player was sitting there who you had a #3 overall type grade on, than I'm not trading down, unless I get paid the draft capital to make it worthwhile. My view was the probability you get much different of a player within those couple picks was minimal. Might be true / might not. In terms of who we picked, I have zero problem with who we took. He also very well might have been there had we been able to move down with the Bills (who knows). Of course that is a major hypothetical since it was the Bucs who made the offer with the Bills and they picked ahead of us and I presume Bills were under the impression that if they didn't move up with the Bucs, the Cardinals were moving up to the Bucs spot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 3 hours ago, soxfan49 said: I said 15% of second rounders & 8% of third rounders pan out, so yes, they most likely are garbage. Go look at the other 2003 third rounders. Fun exercise right? What percent of 1st rounders pan out? I think that is a valid statistic so you can compare an apples-to-apples of wherever your stat is coming from. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 31 minutes ago, soxfan49 said: I know that. I'm not completely discrediting mid-round picks, but it seems like Bears fans solution every year is TRADE DOWN!!!! They hated trading up for Trubisky and hated trading up for Floyd. Now they stay still and get the best ILB in the draft, and we're upset over it. I'd much rather stay and get a top 10 pick than one in the teens (where the percentages drop again), especially if the prospect is as good as most think he is. By the way, it is all relative value. When you see someone you really like and they are the right fit and can alter your franchise, you absolutely do it. I'm arguing for a trade down this year but I was entirely supportive of moving up a year ago. I also recognize it takes 2 to tango and the offer has to be statistically powerful. I.e., you are walking away feeling you are going to get better value on your picks (and that needs to be reflective/based of your draft board and what talent you think you are going to get at the positions you are swapping). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheTruth05 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 47 minutes ago, Dick Allen said: So Pace tried to get back into the first round late yesterday. I wouldn't be surprised he tries to move up in the 2nd,they obviously really want someone they feel might be gone early tonight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoSox05 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 Now that the Packers have two first round picks next year, they can pretty take any player they want. Nick Bosa please enter the draft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheTruth05 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 Really thought this number would be higher,not saying it's a bad percentage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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