wrathofhahn Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 We have some options to move. Abreu Nate Jones James Shields Luis Avilian Joakim Soria Xavier Cedeno Bruce Rodon We also have some longterm guys who could be moved. Yolmer Sanchez Jace Fry Hector Santiago So who stays and who goes. I think with the sending down of Bummer Hahn has sort of tipped his hand he is trying to be as active as possible and he loaded up on mediocre lefties which always have trade value. Personally I expect our relievers to be decimated. Avilian likely goes. Soria. Jones. Cedeno. I also expect Abreu to be shopped hard. Santiago is another guy they are trying to create value from and moving to the bullpen also a lefty. Shield stays. Fry stays. Sanchez may stay but longterm he's more of a 2B but looking at the teams don't see much demand. Rodon is sort of interesting he's been dominant much more so then his ERA indicates. If he gets a good package back despite this he's probably gone but I don't really see that happening but who knows the Cubs made that Q trade despite traditional metrics. Maybe there is a GM out there willing to pay full price. Rodon has a 1.89 FIP and a 3.07 xFIP. Still got the gas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daggins Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 For us? Total snoozer. I'm at like 15% Abreu gets moved and everyone else will bring back limited returns. I think Shields goes in August and otherwise they move like, Soria and a couple other relievers. They might explore trading Rodon or Abreu this offseason, but I expect the deadline to be a dud. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 15 minutes ago, wrathofhahn said: We have some options to move. Abreu Nate Jones James Shields Luis Avilian Joakim Soria Xavier Cedeno Bruce Rodon We also have some longterm guys who could be moved. Yolmer Sanchez Jace Fry Hector Santiago So who stays and who goes. I think with the sending down of Bummer Hahn has sort of tipped his hand he is trying to be as active as possible and he loaded up on mediocre lefties which always have trade value. Personally I expect our relievers to be decimated. Avilian likely goes. Soria. Jones. Cedeno. I also expect Abreu to be shopped hard. Santiago is another guy they are trying to create value from and moving to the bullpen also a lefty. Shield stays. Fry stays. Sanchez may stay but longterm he's more of a 2B but looking at the teams don't see much demand. Rodon is sort of interesting he's been dominant much more so then his ERA indicates. If he gets a good package back despite this he's probably gone but I don't really see that happening but who knows the Cubs made that Q trade despite traditional metrics. Maybe there is a GM out there willing to pay full price. Rodon has a 1.89 FIP and a 3.07 xFIP. Still got the gas. Bruce Rondon or Carlos Rodon? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 (edited) Soria Has turned himself into an interesting trade piece. Rondon and Garcia could be pieces for a contending team. I dont think they are going to flip any of the core guys like Abreu, Yolmer, Jones. The pitching staff could come around and we could start competing next year. Edited June 11, 2018 by RockRaines Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 14 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: Bruce Rondon or Carlos Rodon? They should consider moving both, But more likely Bruce Rondon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockRaines Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 5 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: They should consider moving both, But more likely Bruce Rondon. Im of the opinion that Rodon may come around and we need him as a top of the rotation guy. Of course since he's made of glass, if they can get a kings ransom after a few good starts you have to flip him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 (edited) 3 minutes ago, RockRaines said: Im of the opinion that Rodon may come around and we need him as a top of the rotation guy. Of course since he's made of glass, if they can get a kings ransom after a few good starts you have to flip him. I agree that Rodon will eventually come around. He oozes talent. The question is do you hold onto him for the next two seasons and see where you're at or do you trade him for a haul? I don't think he's gonna be here in 2022, which should be the heart of the competitive window. You only hire Boras if you want to get paid. Honestly, the 3.5 seasons of control he has at this moment has started the clock. The more control, the more you get in return(theoretically) You have the injury/performance issues as well. They have to maximize the return on Rodon, IMO, because he is the last major trade chip they have. Hahn is dumb if he doesn't maximize his value via trade. They have 4 chances to move him and get a haul. TDL 18-19 and winter 19-20. They have to pull the trigger at just the right time. Edited June 11, 2018 by Jack Parkman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GenericUserName Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 8 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: I agree that Rodon will eventually come around. He oozes talent. The question is do you hold onto him for the next two seasons and see where you're at or do you trade him for a haul? I don't think he's gonna be here in 2022, which should be the heart of the competitive window. You only hire Boras if you want to get paid. Honestly, the 3.5 seasons of control he has at this moment has started the clock. The more control, the more you get in return(theoretically) You have the injury/performance issues as well. They have to maximize the return on Rodon, IMO, because he is the last major trade chip they have. Hahn is dumb if he doesn't maximize his value via trade. They have 4 chances to move him and get a haul. TDL 18-19 and winter 19-20. They have to pull the trigger at just the right time. I think trade deadline next year is about the right time. It would give teams more than a year of him being healthy to see, it might be the best point of maximizing remaining time of control while also showing his talent, and it will be at a point of the rebuild where we can still make trades that help the future even if it slightly hurts the present. To me, if it doesn't happen at the trade deadline next year, it won't happen at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 (edited) 4 minutes ago, GenericUserName said: I think trade deadline next year is about the right time. It would give teams more than a year of him being healthy to see, it might be the best point of maximizing remaining time of control while also showing his talent, and it will be at a point of the rebuild where we can still make trades that help the future even if it slightly hurts the present. To me, if it doesn't happen at the trade deadline next year, it won't happen at all. I agree that TDL 2019 is probably the right time to pull the trigger but they should listen both now and this coming winter. You never know what could get offered. Even if they don't move him, they could gain insight on completing a deal next July. Edited June 11, 2018 by Jack Parkman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yesterday333 Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 If Avi comes back and re-establishes some value he could be traded as well. I am hoping we package guys together to get bigger returns. If we trade Abreu hopefully an arm or 2 gets thrown in to increase the what we get back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 Just now, yesterday333 said: If Avi comes back and re-establishes some value he could be traded as well. I am hoping we package guys together to get bigger returns. If we trade Abreu hopefully an arm or 2 gets thrown in to increase the what we get back. I think they should trade Abreu for his sake. Dude is a pro and deserves a chance to play for a winner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yesterday333 Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 Just now, Jack Parkman said: I think they should trade Abreu for his sake. Dude is a pro and deserves a chance to play for a winner. Well if they talk to him and thats what he wants, i agree. I am just not sure he is as valuable to another team as he is to us and nobody pays what we demand. But if they do give us a kings ransom then great! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 (edited) 51 minutes ago, RockRaines said: Soria Has turned himself into an interesting trade piece. Rondon and Garcia could be pieces for a contending team. I dont think they are going to flip any of the core guys like Abreu, Yolmer, Jones. The pitching staff could come around and we could start competing next year. Are you serious? Teams won't fall for a Coop-induced stretch of excellence from Soria. No GM is going to take on his salary when you consider what you are getting. A guy who can turn into a stiff at a moment's notice. He's doing a nice job now but Soria is the kind of guy who could turn a contender into a pretender in a hurry through buzzkill. If Hahn can get anything useful for Soria, that would be good but I'm not hopeful. All this Abreu talk (not by you) is so damn stupid. Why trade one of the best players in the damn league?? A guy everybody on the team fricking LOVES? If Hahn trades him he has rocks for brains. Shields? Dump him ASAP. Not hopeful for that though. Jones? By all means trade him if you can. Edited June 11, 2018 by greg775 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 (edited) 55 minutes ago, yesterday333 said: Well if they talk to him and thats what he wants, i agree. I am just not sure he is as valuable to another team as he is to us and nobody pays what we demand. But if they do give us a kings ransom then great! Yeah. If I'm Hahn I go to Abreu and ask him what is more important to him, staying in Chicago or playing for a winner. Whichever he chooses, I'd accommodate for the remainder of his deal unless Hahn gets exactly what he wants. Edited June 11, 2018 by Jack Parkman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron883 Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 40 minutes ago, greg775 said: Are you serious? Teams won't fall for a Coop-induced stretch of excellence from Soria. No GM is going to take on his salary when you consider what you are getting. A guy who can turn into a stiff at a moment's notice. He's doing a nice job now but Soria is the kind of guy who could turn a contender into a pretender in a hurry through buzzkill. If Hahn can get anything useful for Soria, that would be good but I'm not hopeful. All this Abreu talk (not by you) is so damn stupid. Why trade one of the best players in the damn league?? A guy everybody on the team fricking LOVES? If Hahn trades him he has rocks for brains. Shields? Dump him ASAP. Not hopeful for that though. Jones? By all means trade him if you can. This is a business man. Sure he is loved, but sometimes you get traded. The team is full of big boys. They can handle a trade. Jose Will be happy going to a contender id imagine. He was quoted this year saying that he wants to win. Give the man a shot on a contender and get some pieces back in a trade. Everybody and their mothers know he will have a job with the sox for life after retirement if he wants. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 If these players stay healthy I think Jones, Soria and Avilan get traded but that's about it. Really don't think any team will meet Hahn's asking price for Abreu so he stays, which I'm fine with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 Just now, BlackSox13 said: If these players stay healthy I think Jones, Soria and Avilan get traded but that's about it. Really don't think any team will meet Hahn's asking price for Abreu so he stays, which I'm fine with. If the Sox really think as highly of Abreu as they say they do, if he wants to win they should take the best deal offered. Dude is a pro and deserves it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 3 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: If the Sox really think as highly of Abreu as they say they do, if he wants to win they should take the best deal offered. Dude is a pro and deserves it. Depends on what's in the best deal offered. If the best offer is sub-par then no they shouldn't trade Abreu. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 (edited) 2 minutes ago, BlackSox13 said: Depends on what's in the best deal offered. If the best offer is sub-par then no they shouldn't trade Abreu. The best deal offered=his market value. Offers only get worse the less control and more expensive he gets. Do the guy a favor if he wants to win. Edited June 11, 2018 by Jack Parkman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 Just now, Jack Parkman said: The best deal offered=his market value. They'll only get worse. Do the guy a favor if he wants to win. I disagree. What Abreu means to the team in terms of leadership to the young players and his role of big brother to Moncada means the Sox determine Abreu's value. If that value is not met then he is not traded. I've been saying for a while now that IMHO Abreu is more valuable to the Sox than what another team is willing to pay in a trade. It's best to wait and see without expectations. I still remember spring training 2018 some Sox fans felt Hahn should have taken the best offer for Q. Hahn's patience payed off big time. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 (edited) 6 minutes ago, BlackSox13 said: I disagree. What Abreu means to the team in terms of leadership to the young players and his role of big brother to Moncada means the Sox determine Abreu's value. If that value is not met then he is not traded. I've been saying for a while now that IMHO Abreu is more valuable to the Sox than what another team is willing to pay in a trade. It's best to wait and see without expectations. I still remember spring training 2018 some Sox fans felt Hahn should have taken the best offer for Q. Hahn's patience payed off big time. My argument is that if Abreu himself wants to win, accommodate his wishes. Think of it as him asking for a trade. Why would they keep him here if he doesn't want to be here and they think so highly of him? You don't do that to Abreu. Edited June 11, 2018 by Jack Parkman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Jack Parkman said: Yeah. If I'm Hahn I go to Abreu and ask him what is more important to him, staying in Chicago or playing for a winner. Whichever he chooses, I'd accommodate for the remainder of his deal unless Hahn gets exactly what he wants. This is what I said earlier. This is what i believe is right. It would be good publicity for the upcoming FA class as well. As long as Hahn, KW, JR and Abreu are the only ones who know the conversation took place it should be easy to keep it under wraps as well. Edited June 11, 2018 by Jack Parkman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 1 minute ago, Jack Parkman said: My argument is that if Abreu himself wants to win, accommodate his wishes. Think of it as him asking for a trade. Why would they keep him here if he doesn't want to be here and they think so highly of him? That is like being in an abusive relationship. I can't speak for Abreu but until he comes out and says he wants to be traded because he wants to win, then I'm not concerned about it. As of right now, he seems to like being the clubhouse leader for the Sox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 (edited) 4 minutes ago, BlackSox13 said: I can't speak for Abreu but until he comes out and says he wants to be traded because he wants to win, then I'm not concerned about it. As of right now, he seems to like being the clubhouse leader for the Sox. He said he's tired of losing, Shields said it too. I think that is a sign. Jose is a pro and has done nothing but demolish AL pitching since he's been here. Can't say the same about Shields. Edited June 11, 2018 by Jack Parkman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackSox13 Posted June 11, 2018 Share Posted June 11, 2018 33 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: He said he's tired of losing, Shields said it too. I think that is a sign. Jose is a pro and has done nothing but demolish AL pitching since he's been here. Can't say the same about Shields. I agree with your idea of going to Abreu to see what he wants and for all we know they've talked already. But there is a difference between a player saying he's tired of losing and saying he wants to be traded. It is only fair to point out the Sox have had plenty of injuries that have contributed to loses and they really aren't as bad as their record indicates. Yoan, Avi, Delmonico, Leury, Rodon have all been injured and then there's the struggles from young pitchers like Giolito and Fulmer. Lol, let's not forget the pen. As for Shields being tired of losing. It's ironic because he's made his contributions to the losing as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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