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Latest Fangraphs Prospect Rankings

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33 minutes ago, TaylorStSox said:

Cease at 95 and Madrigal at 19 makes it hard for me to take this list seriously. 

Especially after Cease was the pipeline pitcher of the year...

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I'm very curious, the vast majority of that list are from warm-weather climates, whether it be from Southern states or other countries...could it be because they are able to play baseball year round I wonder?

Edited by Scoots

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The FG guys in general are higher than most on smaller, speedy, middle infielders with great hit tools and good defense while they are really low on "stuff" pitchers that aren't big or have control issues (and Cease fits both categories). I think both of them still think Cease will be a reliever, so its really not that bad of a ranking with that in mind. 

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36 minutes ago, GenericUserName said:

The FG guys in general are higher than most on smaller, speedy, middle infielders with great hit tools and good defense while they are really low on "stuff" pitchers that aren't big or have control issues (and Cease fits both categories). I think both of them still think Cease will be a reliever, so its really not that bad of a ranking with that in mind. 

Yea, plus I think they were high on Madrigal heading into the draft as well. I remember reading he was the best pure hitter in the draft, though that may have been from other sites too. Totally disagree about Cease though.

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They have Madrigal (19) over Mize (33)? Was that how they had their final draft rankings?

Found final rankings, they had Mize over Madrigal but barely.  

Edited by maggsmaggs

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Obviously I'm no expert, but a player has to have a higher upside for me to put him in the top 20. I look at Madrigal and see David Eckstein, which is fine and I'm not mad about the pick, but I expect top 20 players to have more potential. 

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2 hours ago, TaylorStSox said:

Obviously I'm no expert, but a player has to have a higher upside for me to put him in the top 20. I look at Madrigal and see David Eckstein, which is fine and I'm not mad about the pick, but I expect top 20 players to have more potential. 

Are you saying you think his ceiling is David Eckstein?

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6 hours ago, SoxBlanco said:

Are you saying you think his ceiling is David Eckstein?

With a slightly higher BA and fewer BB's. Yeah. I think that's a great comp actually. 

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3 hours ago, TaylorStSox said:

With a slightly higher BA and fewer BB's. Yeah. I think that's a great comp actually. 

I think you are confusing ceiling with most likely outcome...

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11 hours ago, SoxBlanco said:

Are you saying you think his ceiling is David Eckstein?

I am going to go out and say I think that is his floor.  I think he is going to be a regular .300+ hitter.  If we are looking at comps, how about a Luis Castillo from the 2000's Marlins teams.  Less steals, more defense, but something like that.  I also like a prime level Omar Viquel, but at 2B instead of SS.

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6 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

I am going to go out and say I think that is his floor.  I think he is going to be a regular .300+ hitter.  If we are looking at comps, how about a Luis Castillo from the 2000's Marlins teams.  Less steals, more defense, but something like that.  I also like a prime level Omar Viquel, but at 2B instead of SS.

Prime Vizquel? Oh ffs, come on. Vizquel is probably the greatest defensive SS of all time. Madrigal most likely won't even stick at SS in the majors, so it's an odd comparison. 

 

The only difference I see between Madrigal and Eckstein is that Madrigal will probably hit for a higher average, but walk a lot less. So they're basically even OPS wise. 

Edited by TaylorStSox

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2 minutes ago, TaylorStSox said:

Prime Vizquel? Oh ffs, come on. Vizquel is probably the greatest defensive SS of all time. Madrigal most likely won't even stick at SS in the majors, so it's an odd comparison. 

 

The only difference I see between Madrigal and Eckstein is that Madrigal will probably hit for a higher average, but walk a lot less. So they're basically even OPS wise. 

That is why I said at 2b, instead of SS. 

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3 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

That is why I said at 2b, instead of SS. 

It's a weird comparison. You're basically robbing Vizquel of his primary value, that of being an all time great defender. 

 

The Castillo comparison is way off too. A lot of his value was in that he walked a ton and stole a ton of bases. 

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6 minutes ago, TaylorStSox said:

It's a weird comparison. You're basically robbing Vizquel of his primary value, that of being an all time great defender. 

 

The Castillo comparison is way off too. A lot of his value was in that he walked a ton and stole a ton of bases. 

You are trying to be way too crazy here. 

Both were smallish players.  Omar Vizquel was a game changing defender at SS.  All reports are that Nick Madrigal has that ability at 2B.  Omar was an ideal #2 hitter between Kenny Lofton and Robbie Alomar who could do just about anything with his bat to win a game.  I think Nick is also going to be that type of hitter, with a similar amount of power, speed, and SBs.  Omar took a walk around every 10 to 12 PAs, and Madrigal put up a similar number in college.  If you still a solid lead off hitter in front of him, and a good power hitter behind him, I am feeling pretty confident with his baseball IQ, that the walks will come at a minimum of a similar rate, if not more.

This is totally on the assumption that due to physical limitations that Nicky doesn't gain a ton of power in his game.  All bets are off if he can find the same weight room as a Jose Altuve found in about 2015.  Speaking of Altuve, if you look at the first four seasons of his career, that might be another solid bat comp for Nick.

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6 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

You are trying to be way too crazy here. 

Both were smallish players.  Omar Vizquel was a game changing defender at SS.  All reports are that Nick Madrigal has that ability at 2B.  Omar was an ideal #2 hitter between Kenny Lofton and Robbie Alomar who could do just about anything with his bat to win a game.  I think Nick is also going to be that type of hitter, with a similar amount of power, speed, and SBs.  Omar took a walk around every 10 to 12 PAs, and Madrigal put up a similar number in college.  If you still a solid lead off hitter in front of him, and a good power hitter behind him, I am feeling pretty confident with his baseball IQ, that the walks will come at a minimum of a similar rate, if not more.

This is totally on the assumption that due to physical limitations that Nicky doesn't gain a ton of power in his game.  All bets are off if he can find the same weight room as a Jose Altuve found in about 2015.  Speaking of Altuve, if you look at the first four seasons of his career, that might be another solid bat comp for Nick.

You're comparing a 2nd baseman in A ball to a Hall of Fame/best defender in the history of the game SS and I'm being "way too crazy?" Wtf? 

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Just now, TaylorStSox said:

You're comparing a 2nd baseman in A ball to a Hall of Fame/best defender in the history of the game SS and I'm being "way too crazy?" Wtf? 

You have set your mind on Eckstein and the discussion is over.  That is fine.

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Just now, southsider2k5 said:

You have set your mind on Eckstein and the discussion is over.  That is fine.

If you can come with a better comp than a SS in the hall of fame and a 2nd baseman known for 2 things Madrigal doesnt do, steal bases and walk, then I'm all ears. 

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1 minute ago, TaylorStSox said:

Also, Altuve is clearly on enough juice to make Barry Bonds blush. Another strange comparison. 

Are you purposefully NOT reading what I am saying?

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2 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Are you purposefully NOT reading what I am saying?

I get what you're saying, it's just completely outlandish. Vizquel without the defense is basically David Eckstein, so again, wtf. What's next, Dustin Podroia without the power? Frank Thomas without the walks and power? 

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