Dodgers & Reds trade (Kemp, Puig, & Wood to CIN, Bailey, Josiah Gray & Jeter Downs to LA)

[bmags]

The reds absolutely believe they are competing next year and think reenforcements from their farm are still on the way. Sounds familiar.

[Bob Sacamano]

7 minutes ago, bmags said:

The reds absolutely believe they are competing next year and think reenforcements from their farm are still on the way. Sounds familiar.

Hey if they can steal a few wins from the Cubs, that's all I care about. Cardinals and Reds should be better next year. Just need the Pirates to make some moves.

[Dominikk85]

I like it from the reds. Sure it probably won't make them win the division but if several prospects break out they might have a good year. Also they didn't give up that much. The guys are real prospects but in the end it was only a 45 and a 40 (8 and 13th in last fg ranking).

Losing two solid but middling prospects and 7m for possibly 4-5 wins isn't a bad deal. Also if they have good years and the reds are out of it the reds can flip wood and puig at the deadline or give them a QO and get a comp pick so the risk is really marginal for them.

[Bob Sacamano]

4 minutes ago, dominik-keul@gmx.de said:

I like it from the reds. Sure it probably won't make them win the division but if several prospects break out they might have a good year. Also they didn't give up that much. The guys are real prospects but in the end it was only a 45 and a 40 (8 and 13th in last fg ranking).

Losing two solid but middling prospects and 7m for possibly 4-5 wins isn't a bad deal. Also if they have good years and the reds are out of it the reds can flip wood and puig at the deadline or give them a QO and get a comp pick so the risk is really marginal for them.

Wood has 2 years of control left. If he's pitching good, they should be able to get something back for him in July.

[Dominikk85]

35 minutes ago, soxfan2014 said:

Wood has 2 years of control left. If he's pitching good, they should be able to get something back for him in July.

Yes this really migitates the risk. Downs and gray are good prospects but you will get similar prospects back at the deadline if not more unless they both get injured.

 

[Chicago White Sox]

44 minutes ago, dominik-keul@gmx.de said:

I like it from the reds. Sure it probably won't make them win the division but if several prospects break out they might have a good year. Also they didn't give up that much. The guys are real prospects but in the end it was only a 45 and a 40 (8 and 13th in last fg ranking).

Losing two solid but middling prospects and 7m for possibly 4-5 wins isn't a bad deal. Also if they have good years and the reds are out of it the reds can flip wood and puig at the deadline or give them a QO and get a comp pick so the risk is really marginal for them.

I doubt either guy guys a QO but if they do they probably accept it.

[Chicago White Sox]

40 minutes ago, soxfan2014 said:

Wood has 2 years of control left. If he's pitching good, they should be able to get something back for him in July.

Wood has one year of control left.

[Bob Sacamano]

40 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Wood has one year of control left.

Damn you're right. I thought I read he has 2.

[Dominikk85]

Yes only one year for wood.

Still wood and puig should fetch similar prospects as they cost at the deadline if they don't crater totally or get injured. 

[caulfield12]

Reds really needed to shore up fan interest by doing SOMETHING.

Sox basically in the same situation, trying to jumpstart things by one year and build some excitement...just like the Mariners did adding Cano and Cruz, but without enough pitching or general prospect depth behind it in SEA.  

Of course, it didn’t help that Felix went south simultaneously.    At one point, he looked like a sure-fire HoFer.

[BlackSox13]

3 hours ago, DirtySox said:

I would have been fine with it for Cinci if they weren't giving up Gray and Downs. Silly.

Wood and Puig have value and the reds had to give something up for that value.

3 hours ago, spiderman said:

Why did they have to trade good prospects in exchange for a salary dump (by both sides)? 

Good prospects? What do we know about them? Wood and Puig were bot salary dumps since they have some trade value. 

Guys I don't see the problem here. For one thing it's the reds, who cares? Secondly it makes the reds better and therefore put more pressure on the rest of the NLC. Third, it's not like cinci gave up top prospects to acquire Kemp,Puig and Wood.

 

[YonderLaroche]

good trade for the reds , wood and Puig are good , Kemp can hit 

[Y2Jimmy0]

22 hours ago, spiderman said:

Why did they have to trade good prospects in exchange for a salary dump (by both sides)? 

Reds will owe Kemp approximately $20 million and roughly $20 million for Wood/Puig combined. They dumped Homer Bailey's $23 million for this year and the Dodgers sent $7 million in the trade. It's basically a wash money wise for Cincinnati and Puig/Wood still have value. They had to give up prospects to obtain Wood/Puig combo. The deal doesn't make sense when looking at the fact that all 3 players with only be in Cincinnati for one season. They could flip all 3 at the deadline for more though possibly. 

[turnin' two]

11 minutes ago, Y2Jimmy0 said:

Reds will owe Kemp approximately $20 million and roughly $20 million for Wood/Puig combined. They dumped Homer Bailey's $23 million for this year and the Dodgers sent $7 million in the trade. It's basically a wash money wise for Cincinnati and Puig/Wood still have value. They had to give up prospects to obtain Wood/Puig combo. The deal doesn't make sense when looking at the fact that all 3 players with only be in Cincinnati for one season. They could flip all 3 at the deadline for more though possibly. 

Kemp put up an .818 OPS last year as well.  Now granted he doesn't walk, really at all and has really become a liability on defense, but still he has some value as well.  Especially considering he had that .818 OPS in Dodger Stadium for half his games, and he will not be in a very hitter friendly environment.  I don't think he will be useless for the Dodgers next year either.  

But like most others here, I don't think it was a great trade, because, while the Reds will be better, they have some tough teams in that division.  And Downs was a top 10 prospect for them, and Gray was trending in the right direction. 

[BlackSox13]

21 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Wood has one year of control left.

Thanks for pointing this out. Don't know why I thought he had two years left. 

[Chicago White Sox]

7 minutes ago, turnin' two said:

Kemp put up an .818 OPS last year as well.  Now granted he doesn't walk, really at all and has really become a liability on defense, but still he has some value as well.  Especially considering he had that .818 OPS in Dodger Stadium for half his games, and he will not be in a very hitter friendly environment.  I don't think he will be useless for the Dodgers next year either.  

But like most others here, I don't think it was a great trade, because, while the Reds will be better, they have some tough teams in that division.  And Downs was a top 10 prospect for them, and Gray was trending in the right direction. 

Downs was the 32nd overall pick in the 2017 draft and a legit prospect.  When you’re still rebuilding, you don’t trade a guy like that for a bunch of one year rentals.  A year from now Downs could see his stock jump significantly and be part of a trade for a much more impactful piece.  I just don’t get it from the Reds perspective.

[TheTruth05]

1 hour ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Downs was the 32nd overall pick in the 2017 draft and a legit prospect.  When you’re still rebuilding, you don’t trade a guy like that for a bunch of one year rentals.  A year from now Downs could see his stock jump significantly and be part of a trade for a much more impactful piece.  I just don’t get it from the Reds perspective.

Yup, I can’t say is be completely shocked if Cincy were able to flip those guys for more than they gave up when they fall out of contention in June but I definitely would be surprised if they did. 

Edited December 24, 2018 by TheTruth05

[Bob Sacamano]

As I've said before, this would be a good trade if it didn't involve the Reds. Now if it was a team that was actually good last year, different story. 

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

On 12/21/2018 at 1:35 PM, fathom said:

Yeah, that makes it incredibly likely Bryce is going to Dodgers.

Some times it's weird to be older than most on here because I came up with something that's old but reminds me of this series of posts by fathom. So who remembers Dragnet the old radio and TV Show about the Los Angeles PD ? If you do here goes. "Ladies and gentlemen: the story you are about to hear is true. Only the names haven't been changed to protect the innocent." Let the Dragnet theme music play in your head while reading or think of Dan Aykroyd's parody of Sgt. Joe Friday.

Friday 1:35 PM  Fathom says "incredibly likely Bryce is going to the Dodgers".

On 12/21/2018 at 1:43 PM, fathom said:

Assuming the Dodgers get Harper, this is a brilliant trade as they can also use Downs in a deal to try to get Kluber or Realmuto.

1:43 PM Fathom assumes the Dodgers get Harper but also could trade for Kluber and Realmuto

On 12/21/2018 at 1:52 PM, fathom said:

Large trade to just free room for Pollock and LeMahieu

Not sure if this post was sarcasm or not but any way..

1:52 PM Fathom mentions 2 other players Dodgers could go after . In 17 minutes he has Harper going to LA and possibly 4 other guys  . Fathom is stealthy covering all bases .

On 12/21/2018 at 1:58 PM, fathom said:

I agree, as they could be creating room also for Kluber or Realmuto

1:58 PM  Fathom agrees with the poster Chicago White Sox and agrees with him that this trade doesn't mean Harper goes to the Dodgers

On 12/21/2018 at 3:11 PM, fathom said:

I might be naive but I don’t think the Dodgers go after Harper. I’m thinking Pollock and Realmuto

3:11 PM Approximately 90 minutes after saying it's" incredibly likely Bryce goes to the Dodgers" he does an about face and declares "I don't think the Dodgers go after Harper". Still thinking Pollock and Realmuto... and Kluber ... and LeMahieu...

On 12/21/2018 at 4:15 PM, fathom said:

They really should just go all in and get Kluber and Harper, as their window would be the next 2-3 years.

4:15 PM a little more than an hour after saying he "don't think the Dodgers go after Harper" he thinks they should go all in on Harper and... Kluber. No mention of  Realmuto... and Pollock.... and LeMahieu...

On 12/21/2018 at 4:26 PM, fathom said:

I think it's either Harper or Pollock, and not both for them (unless the end up trading Bellinger)

4:26 PM  Fathom issues this definitive statement "It's either Harper or Pollock  !!!

Fathom think you covered your ass enough ? No wonder you're right so many times. You cover just about every possibility.

 

Fade to black , roll credits over Dragnet theme music.

Edited December 24, 2018 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[fathom]

Nice research but I was just going based off of the reports about the Dodgers priorities. For a week everyone thought they were trying to clear space for Harper (including some supposed “insiders”) but it became the narrative that they weren’t interested in him necessarily. I said they should go after Harper and Kluber due to their current window, but I don’t think they will go after both.  Weird for you to pick on me though as at least I wasn’t melting down about the Sox chances compared to most on here.

Edited December 24, 2018 by fathom

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

40 minutes ago, fathom said:

Nice research but I was just going based off of the reports about the Dodgers priorities. For a week everyone thought they were trying to clear space for Harper (including some supposed “insiders”) but it became the narrative that they weren’t interested in him necessarily. I said they should go after Harper and Kluber due to their current window, but I don’t think they will go after both.  Weird for you to pick on me though as at least I wasn’t melting down about the Sox chances compared to most on here.

Sorry it's all just poking a little fun at how quickly you went  from one thing to completely changing your mind. I mean it was like slightly less than 3 hrs you gave all these different opinions. I'm not sure how the narrative changed all that much in 3 hours. I know you also posted a series of tweets but when you consider so many people in the twitter verse you are going to have all kinds of possibilities popping up.

Besides it wasn't research it was more like me thinking "wait didn't he just say the complete opposite a few pages ago" ? The Dragnet/LAPD thing just kind of popped into my head since it's the LA Dodgers. I was hoping that would make it seem a little more lighthearted rather than mean spirited. Sorry if I bruised your ego. Merry Christmas . I really do think you are a quality poster and I only noticed because I take your opinions seriously.

I also envy your screen name . I wish I had the foresight to pick a short recognizable screen name all those years ago when I joined.instead of my 8 syllable goofy name. Maybe something like Fortitude or Rock Lobster.

Edited December 25, 2018 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[caulfield12]

It’s probably not helping that lots of season ticket holders have lost 15-25% of their net worth in the last month.

But the front office put themselves front and center...failing now is close to unacceptable.  That will leave Opening Day, the Jimenez (and Cease) debuts and the #3 draft pick announcement as the only reasons to get excited.

Unless Abreu or some of the veterans go on huge tears and can attract considerable trade interest in June/July.

 

Hope they signed that television contract on the dotted line before economic conditions deteriorate further...it’s going to be a pretty bumpy ride if we’re forced to suffer through another year of waiting on FA’s to choose the Sox.

Edited December 25, 2018 by caulfield12

[oldsox]

17 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

It’s probably not helping that lots of season ticket holders have lost 15-25% of their net worth in the last month.

But the front office put themselves front and center...failing now is close to unacceptable.  That will leave Opening Day, the Jimenez (and Cease) debuts and the #3 draft pick announcement as the only reasons to get excited.

Unless Abreu or some of the veterans go on huge tears and can attract considerable trade interest in June/July.

 

Hope they signed that television contract on the dotted line before economic conditions deteriorate further...it’s going to be a pretty bumpy ride if we’re forced to suffer through another year of waiting on FA’s to choose the Sox.

Market's going up next week.