The Sir Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 Just now, bschmaranz said: Awesome. Glad to see him go. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sockin Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Saufley said: A couple of us earlier suggested to offer $300M and we were told not to be so fast, to not give away leverage. Now we're up to $325. I mentioned this earlier. Who is involved from what we know? The Sox, Phillies, and maybe the Yankees and maybe a mystery team. If you go up to 300 you eliminate the Yankees and maybe the mystery team. If the Phillies are really mostly concerned with Harper then they would be hesitant to meet that offer. Manny then has the Sox and probably no where else. Call his bluff if he wants 300 and if he does, he'll take it. Edited January 14, 2019 by Sockin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonofaRoache Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 4 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: Just to play Devil’s Advocate, Heyward had a 5.6 fWAR season & was 26 years old and only got 8 years & a $23M AAV from the Cubs. 162 game averages for their careers. Heyward .263 BA .753 ops 16 homers 68 RBI's Machado .282 BA .822 OPS 31 homers 90 RBI's. Both play gold glove defense, but Machado is at a premium position. Also, inflation. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 4 minutes ago, bschmaranz said: Good for Avi. Thought he may need to take a minor league deal. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sir Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 Just now, Sockin said: I mentioned this earlier. Who is involved from what we know? The Sox, Phillies, and maybe the Yankees and maybe a mystery team. If you go up to 300 you eliminate the Yankees and maybe the mystery team. If the Phillies are really mostly concerned with Harper then would be hesitant to meet that offer. Manny then has the Sox and probably no where else. Call his bluff if he wants 300 and if he does, he'll take it. Why? We'd be bidding against ourselves. The Yanks aren't in interested in even hitting 250, and what mystery team? If we know for sure that someone out there is beating us, then beat them. But if we have the top offer at 250, and nobody else is driving that up, we would be foolish to do it ourselves. Manny might want 300, but if 300 ain't there, he ain't getting it. He might not like it, but he's not gonna turn down 250 if it's the best offer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saufley Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 2 minutes ago, Sockin said: I mentioned this earlier. Who is involved from what we know? The Sox, Phillies, and maybe the Yankees and maybe a mystery team. If you go up to 300 you eliminate the Yankees and maybe the mystery team. If the Phillies are really mostly concerned with Harper then they would be hesitant to meet that offer. Manny then has the Sox and probably no where else. Call his bluff if he wants 300 and if he does, he'll take it. I hope so and I agree with you. Make the offer for $300M and make him a member of the White Sox. Forget leverage and get it done! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Princess Dye Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 4 minutes ago, The Sir said: Awesome. Glad to see him go. It's the kiss of death when Hawk takes an extra special interest in you as a player. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
he gone. Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 Just now, ChiSox59 said: Good for Avi. Thought he may need to take a minor league deal. I could be wrong, but I don't think he was close to that line at all... I'm guessing he signed a 1yr, $6mm deal with incentives and a mutual option. He's still 1-2 seasons away from being a minor league contract type deal in my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 Just now, Princess Dye said: It's the kiss of death when Hawk takes an extra special interest in you as a player. lol you're not wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sir Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 Sorry, but some of you are terrible negotiators. Or you're just nonchalant because it's not your money. Silence is golden. If we have the best offer, we have the best offer. Unless someone beats it, he will take it eventually! Don't get fidgety and drive it up if the market's not there. I offered 20K less than listing price on my last house. Did they like it? Don't know, don't care. Did they accept eventually? Yep, because I was the top dog. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonofaRoache Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 13 minutes ago, Dick Allen said: If he signs with Philadelphia, wouldn't that say the Sox were outbid since neither player supposedly wants to go there? Not necessarily. Maybe the opt outs, upfront money, position, etc were more to his liking Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sockin Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 (edited) 8 minutes ago, The Sir said: Why? We'd be bidding against ourselves. The Yanks aren't in interested in even hitting 250, and what mystery team? If we know for sure that someone out there is beating us, then beat them. But if we have the top offer at 250, and nobody else is driving that up, we would be foolish to do it ourselves. Manny might want 300, but if 300 ain't there, he ain't getting it. He might not like it, but he's not gonna turn down 250 if it's the best offer. Because in my view the longer the Sox wait this out and try to get him at what they want him at , you run the risk of another team comes in to give him a shorter term deal with a high AAV and he gets to be a FA again. A team that isn't coming off 100 losses and is a much easier sell. The Sox have reportedly been frustrated with how things are being handled and being happy with their presentations. Presentations don't get you these players. Getting family members don't get you these players. Money does. If they're dicking him around you run the risk of him not even giving them the chance to counter offer something because they're penny pinching him when they have peanuts for payroll. Edited January 14, 2019 by Sockin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 6 minutes ago, BrianAnderson said: I could be wrong, but I don't think he was close to that line at all... I'm guessing he signed a 1yr, $6mm deal with incentives and a mutual option. He's still 1-2 seasons away from being a minor league contract type deal in my opinion. I'd be shocked if the guarantee was that high. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 (edited) 5 minutes ago, The Sir said: Sorry, but some of you are terrible negotiators. Or you're just nonchalant because it's not your money. Silence is golden. If we have the best offer, we have the best offer. Unless someone beats it, he will take it eventually! Don't get fidgety and drive it up if the market's not there. I offered 20K less than listing price on my last house. Did they like it? Don't know, don't care. Did they accept eventually? Yep, because I was the top dog. Houses are mostly fungible. Not the case here. There is no player that is even 50% as good as Manny that plays a massive position of need as a backup plan. Getting him to sign quickly before someone else can rethink things isn't the worst strategy. Edited January 14, 2019 by chitownsportsfan 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sir Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 1 minute ago, Sockin said: Because in my view the longer the Sox wait this out and try to get him at what they want him at , you run the risk of another team comes in to give him a shorter term deal with a high AAV and he gets to be a FA again. A team that isn't coming off 100 losses and is a much easier sell. The Sox have reportedly been frustrated with how things are being handled and being happy with their presentations. Presentations don't get you these players. Getting family members don't get you these players. Money does. I'm sorry man, but that doesn't make sense. He's not accepting 8/250 from us because he wants 300, but he'll be stolen away by less years and less AAV? No, I don't think that plays for Manny, and I don't think anyone other than Philly is going to join this market. Unless Philly beats 8/250, he'll accept from us sooner or later. Waiting sucks, but it's the right move tactically here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotHahn Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 1 hour ago, caulfield12 said: The longer this goes on, the more it seems that giving a record-breaking deal to Harper would have been the better play. Probably just buyer’s remorse. And we’re so conditioned to not getting the big name...last night, it felt like it was close to getting done, that’s already been the case at least twice in the last 2-3 weeks. It’s fairly easy to start talking yourself into “what could go wrong?” Just wonder if we put ourselves too much in the Machado camp, rather than equally going with Harper (Phillies), and whether that “favoritism” and arranging the roster on his behalf will make any difference if they’re still unwilling to go to $300 million? Of course, if the entire approach was to win a lowball battle under the impossible to predict (two months ago) field of limited suitors, the front office might be better off in Las Vegas...because failing with that type approach is going to be a PR disaster. Which is kind of why it doesn’t make much sense to think it wouldn’t eventually come down to the highest bidder all along. I agree. I think its time for a trip to Vegas for Hahn. Push in harder for Harper and go radio silent to Muchado camp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sockin Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 1 minute ago, The Sir said: I'm sorry man, but that doesn't make sense. He's not accepting 8/250 from us because he wants 300, but he'll be stolen away by less years and less AAV? No, I don't think that plays for Manny, and I don't think anyone other than Philly is going to join this market. Unless Philly beats 8/250, he'll accept from us sooner or later. Waiting sucks, but it's the right move tactically here. Yasmani Grandal literally turned down a long term deal from the Mets to sign a one year deal. Manny will do something similar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Sir Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 1 minute ago, chitownsportsfan said: Houses are mostly fungible. Not the case here. There is a player that is 95% as good as Manny that plays a massive position of need as a backup. Getting him to sign quickly before someone else can rethink things isn't the worst strategy. That's fair. The house analogy isn't perfect. I disagree, however, that MLB teams would be so impulsive about their off-season plans. If they're not trying for Machado yet, they're not going to rethink and try for him now. IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 Just now, Sockin said: Yasmani Grandal literally turned down a long term deal from the Mets to sign a one year deal. Manny will do something similar. Yah, because the 4-year deal was gone because they found another catcher. The Sox aren't finding another 3B in this FA market. Its VERY VERY VERY different. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 Just now, Sockin said: Yasmani Grandal literally turned down a long term deal from the Mets to sign a one year deal. Manny will do something similar. That's wrong. He rejected a multi-year deal almost a month ago from the Mets, they moved on, and then he had to settle for a one-year deal. He didn't reject that deal to settle on one year. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saufley Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 (edited) 4 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said: Houses are mostly fungible. Not the case here. There is no player that is even 50% as good as Manny that plays a massive position of need as a backup plan. Getting him to sign quickly before someone else can rethink things isn't the worst strategy. I agree. There's always another house but not another Manny Machado. Edited January 14, 2019 by Saufley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotHahn Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 1 hour ago, hi8is said: Why If you sign Harper theres a chance that Bryant will follow in 2020 to fill 3rd base. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sockin Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 Just now, soxfan2014 said: That's wrong. He rejected a multi-year deal almost a month ago from the Mets, they moved on, and then he had to settle for a one-year deal. He didn't reject that deal to settle on one year. Fair enough but if the dude doesn't get what he wants its fathomable for him to sign a short term deal with the Yankees when there are more suitors on the market next year or in the years to come. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 (edited) 2 minutes ago, NotHahn said: If you sign Harper theres a chance that Bryant will follow in 2020 to fill 3rd base. If Bryant hits the next 3 years like he did his first 3, no chance. Edited January 14, 2019 by soxfan2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnightsOnMintSt Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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