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Machado signs with Padres 10/300

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1 hour ago, YouGottaBeBleepingMe said:

Nope. Here is the reason: you are trying to say they were great using their numbers, but their numbers are inflated by PED's. If you wanna say "they were HOF'ers before they took the PED's", nope. Plenty of guys like Mattingly, Murphy, Clark, and Hersheiser put up HOF caliber numbers for an extended period. The guys you mentioned were not that much different without their PED extension.

Take Clemons. His first 2 years in Boston were meh. His next 7 were clearly otherwordly. His next 4 were not good by any definition, and Boston let him walking feeling he was washed up. Heck, when the White Sox signed Jaime Navarro over Roger Clemons, it was a consensus opinion that it was a better signing than giving that money to a washed up Clemons. Clemons started taking PED's, and the next 9 years were otherworldly. After his body had the usual steroid breakdown (see Bonds and McGuire and their late career injuries) which I am using as proof of his use of PED's, his last 2 years were meh just like his first 2. So, what is your argument? Clemons belongs because his 9 year steroid run makes him an ATG after 7 great years and 6 meh to bad years? That's BS. Without that 9 year PED enhanced period, how was he really much better than Hersheiser?

MLB pretending the late 90’s, early 2000’s didn’t happen is ridiculous. It’s just as ridiculous as ignoring Pete Rose as the all time hits leader. Especially because it’s already likely there are guys in the Hall that used PED’s that either didn’t put up the gaudy numbers to get put under a microscope or were smart enough to not get caught and draw attention to themselves. Fuck, Bud Selig is in the HOF and he knew fully what was going on and turned a blind eye to it. How is that fair to the legit players in there? If you’re trying to protect the sanctity of the Hall, you could argue it’s already lost it. I also said that *if* they made it in (not that I want them in) they should be in their own category entirely and separated from the greats. For example, MLB could fully disclose that this was the STEROID ERA, and these are the player that were the best and defined that period. This is why there is a drug testing system/penalties currently in place, etc. I’m not saying that these guys aren’t assholes for doing what they did (I very much dislike Clemens, Bonds, Aroid as players and people), but is was a dark blip during MLB’s history. You never are going to fully know with 100% certainty whose clean. Players are still getting busted to this day.

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24 minutes ago, CWSpalehoseCWS said:

MLB pretending the late 90’s, early 2000’s didn’t happen is ridiculous. It’s just as ridiculous as ignoring Pete Rose as the all time hits leader. Especially because it’s already likely there are guys in the Hall that used PED’s that either didn’t put up the gaudy numbers to get put under a microscope or were smart enough to not get caught and draw attention to themselves. Fuck, Bud Selig is in the HOF and he knew fully what was going on and turned a blind eye to it. How is that fair to the legit players in there? If you’re trying to protect the sanctity of the Hall, you could argue it’s already lost it. I also said that *if* they made it in (not that I want them in) they should be in their own category entirely and separated from the greats. For example, MLB could fully disclose that this was the STEROID ERA, and these are the player that were the best and defined that period. This is why there is a drug testing system/penalties currently in place, etc. I’m not saying that these guys aren’t assholes for doing what they did (I very much dislike Clemens, Bonds, Aroid as players and people), but is was a dark blip during MLB’s history. You never are going to fully know with 100% certainty whose clean. Players are still getting busted to this day.

Pudge Rodriguez, David Ortiz and Piazza immediately come to mind...

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This is my daily "I woke up for work and was excited to see what I missed last night, only to see absolutely NOTHING juicy was mentioned at all and was a total letdown waste of time and it saddens me greatly." post.

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1 hour ago, Ross Gload Fan said:

This is my daily "I woke up for work and was excited to see what I missed last night, only to see absolutely NOTHING juicy was mentioned at all and was a total letdown waste of time and it saddens me greatly." post.

Yeah this fucking suck and I’m pissed as hell.  And with that Lozano press release yesterday there is zero chance something happens today yet I’ll end up reading through 30 pages of nothing anyways.

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I don't even know what to think anymore. Maybe a deal will happen today. Maybe it will happen in a month. Or maybe yesterday's events pissed off one of the sides off to where it won't ever happen. Who knows man.

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34 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Yeah this fucking suck and I’m pissed as hell.  And with that Lozano press release yesterday there is zero chance something happens today yet I’ll end up reading through 30 pages of nothing anyways.

We gotta keep that whale updates thread updated. 

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43 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Yeah this fucking suck and I’m pissed as hell.  And with that Lozano press release yesterday there is zero chance something happens today yet I’ll end up reading through 30 pages of nothing anyways.

We've all been sucked in, and there's no escape.  I check periodically, and when I see the note at the bottom about a bunch of recent replies I get excited.  That is until I read through the posts and see we're discussing NBA contracts, how much of an idiot Levine is, and why the moon is smaller than the sun even though it's closer.

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8 hours ago, Jose Abreu said:

If SoxFest comes around and these whales are either still unsigned or one has signed elsewhere, I would be surprised if Hahn even honored the commitment to show up. And I wouldn't blame him

The casual fan will at least take it easy on him, unlike all of us, who would probably line up to the podium and have a rapid fire Q&A session as we should.

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Bruce (on score now) basically said Lozano is just venting frustration over low offers.  Claimed both Machado and Harper will wind up with closer to 200 than 300 mil.  White Sox offer is traditional, not a lot of opt outs, etc.

Edited by bschmaranz

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8 hours ago, DH in the NL said:

Has anyone been to the fan questions to management part of Soxfest? I was wondering how that goes about? Do you have to be selected to participate? Is it free with admission? How many people are allowed to participate? Etc.

There are lots of families there and more general questions about the upcoming or previous season and less targeted questions like we would ask. It’s included in the cost of your admission and you can walk right up to the mic and participate. Usually Farmer or someone like that is there with Hahn or Williams to moderate. When I used to go with my dad at the Hyatt that is how it went, I’m not sure if anything changed since then.

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10 minutes ago, bschmaranz said:

Bruce (on score now) basically said Lozano is just venting frustration over low offers.  Claimed both Machado and Harper will wind up with closer to 200 than 300 mil.  White Sox offer is traditional, not a lot of opt outs, etc.

The only thing I believe is the offer not having a lot of opt outs.  But as we've talked about, no one knows what the offers are except for those actually involved in the process.

I still think Machado ends up with a contract close to the 8/$250M rumor, and Harper will probably get more.  If, as Bruce claims, both guys get closer to $200M, the Sox should sign both.

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9 hours ago, The Sir said:

Pete Rose, yes. The other three, no.

Sadly, Bonds would have made it easily until he decided 'roids were a necessary supplement to a career that had produced 445 homeruns, 460 SBs, and a .968 OPS over 14 years.

There remains no way to know that Bonds wansnt regularly taking something else throughout his career and only switched to the tetrahyrdrogestrinone when the new more powerful stuff became available.

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Does anyone believe that Bruce actually knows the exact offer? He seems like he wants people to think he does. Since I started to pay attention to him, he seems like a hack. Has he proven to be well connected with the Sox in the past?

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2 minutes ago, Orlando said:

Does anyone believe that Bruce actually knows the exact offer? He seems like he wants people to think he does. Since I started to pay attention to him, he seems like a hack. Has he proven to be well connected with the Sox in the past?

Bruce only knows what people are feeding him, he is being used as puppet in this chase. I imagine today is going to be a pretty slow news day in regards to hearing anything on Machado after yesterday’s debacle. 

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4 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said:

Guys I really feel like it's gonna happen today 

Up until several days ago, I would wake up, roll over, and immediately, before anything else, grab my phone to check SoxTalk because it seems like we've done midnight FA surprises often enough in the past.

Not any more. I'm going to Ireland in mid-March. I'm excited for that and, as such, I have an informal countdown going for that. I'm lumping this in with it. My 50 days 'til vacay is also a solid countdown on days 'til we have answers for both of these dudes. Whatever.

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If I had to guess, there are several sets of leaks here and each with a different origin.  The rumored offer of 7/$210M (or whatever it was) seems like it probably was our first, formal offer.  That’s actually a somewhat realistic opening offer if Machado’s original ask was in the $350M to $400M range.  And it wasn’t until Passan/Gomez said the Sox had offered 8/$250M that is was ever really disputed.  My guess is the Sox let that one out of the bag once they were prepared to make their next offer (one Passan/Gomez alluded to) to create some misdirection for the Phillies.

Regarding the 8/$250M offer, I truly believe this is legit but was not made in writing and is therefore not a former offer.  My guess is Lozano leaked this to put some heat on the Phillies.  It should be clear as day that the leaks that came out shortly thereafter from Bob, Bruce, etc. debunking the rumor came out of the White Sox camp.  Merkin being part of the posse is proof of that.

All that being said, I think these 7/$175M rumors are new beast.  The Sox had already put it out there that a 7/$210M offer had been made.  There was value in having Philadelphia believe that’s where they were currently sitting.  Moving the the number down to $175M (and a $25M AAV) doesn’t really benefit us at that point and quite frankly makes it easy to question its validity since it’s so ridiculous.  Therefore, I can only think of two parties who could be responsible for these leaks.  IMO, it either has to be the Phillies (in an attempt to convince Harper’s camp that Machado is a much more affordable option) or Boras (in an attempt to embarrass Lozano).  I just don’t see anything else that adds up.

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