fathom Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 Just now, Harold's Leg Lift said: Yep. Short sighted. Also Buehler gained velocity after the TJS. I actually wasn't overly impressed with what I saw from him his junior year at Vandy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted February 15, 2019 Author Share Posted February 15, 2019 1 minute ago, fathom said: Also Buehler gained velocity after the TJS. I actually wasn't overly impressed with what I saw from him his junior year at Vandy. This has been a thing with the dodgers though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harold's Leg Lift Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 It's a thing for a lot of teams. Amateur scouting is about projection. It's not about what they are now it's about what they're going to be. Fulmer had a bad frame, bad delivery and bad command. I have no idea how they thought he was going to get better. Buehler had projection. He had ceiling. He wasn't close to being a finished product. Fulmer went backwards and Buehler went thru the roof. That's projection scouting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted February 15, 2019 Author Share Posted February 15, 2019 11 minutes ago, Harold's Leg Lift said: It's a thing for a lot of teams. Amateur scouting is about projection. It's not about what they are now it's about what they're going to be. Fulmer had a bad frame, bad delivery and bad command. I have no idea how they thought he was going to get better. Buehler had projection. He had ceiling. He wasn't close to being a finished product. Fulmer went backwards and Buehler went thru the roof. That's projection scouting. I obviously think the dodgers are better at scouting and development than the white sox (I think 2/3s of the league at least is), but my point was the dodgers specifically have been drafting injured or post-injured players with success in bringing them back with good or better stuff, and sometimes not but the big successes stick out. They aren't the only ones, pearson and jeff hoffman. But it's not always so obvious at the time, some decent evaluators started rethinking the 6' rhp around 2015: https://blogs.fangraphs.com/the-black-swan-theory-of-drafting-pitchers/ Then BP or someone recently looked at it and due to risk basically said take 6' RHP...just take them in the second round. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harold's Leg Lift Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 12 minutes ago, bmags said: I obviously think the dodgers are better at scouting and development than the white sox (I think 2/3s of the league at least is), but my point was the dodgers specifically have been drafting injured or post-injured players with success in bringing them back with good or better stuff, and sometimes not but the big successes stick out. They aren't the only ones, pearson and jeff hoffman. But it's not always so obvious at the time, some decent evaluators started rethinking the 6' rhp around 2015: https://blogs.fangraphs.com/the-black-swan-theory-of-drafting-pitchers/ Then BP or someone recently looked at it and due to risk basically said take 6' RHP...just take them in the second round. Kiley. That dude's clueless. I'm not ready to get on board for the 6'0" right hander. There will always be freaks in baseball. Grienke, Stroman, Lincecum but I wouldn't want to be in the business of hoping for a freak. If I'm gonna miss on a guy I'm gonna miss big. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Look at Ray Ray Run Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 2 hours ago, Harold's Leg Lift said: Kiley. That dude's clueless. I'm not ready to get on board for the 6'0" right hander. There will always be freaks in baseball. Grienke, Stroman, Lincecum but I wouldn't want to be in the business of hoping for a freak. If I'm gonna miss on a guy I'm gonna miss big. Kiley McDaniel is clueless? What? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 4 hours ago, Harold's Leg Lift said: It's a thing for a lot of teams. Amateur scouting is about projection. It's not about what they are now it's about what they're going to be. Fulmer had a bad frame, bad delivery and bad command. I have no idea how they thought he was going to get better. Buehler had projection. He had ceiling. He wasn't close to being a finished product. Fulmer went backwards and Buehler went thru the roof. That's projection scouting. He did not have bad command in college. His last year he had over a 3/1 K/BB ratio and a 1.03 WHIP. Also if you watch any of his games he was dominant. The other things could be considered but the command wasnt bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harold's Leg Lift Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 Being able to throw the ball past college hitters doesn't mean you have good command. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fathom Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 1 minute ago, Harold's Leg Lift said: Being able to throw the ball past college hitters doesn't mean you have good command. I watched a lot of Fulmer's starts his junior year when the Sox started to get linked to him. One thing that really stood out was just how many strike outs he got on breaking pitches in the dirt. Clearly, we've seen that he just hasn't been able to get professional hitters to chase that pitch. He also had some difficulty maintaining his velocity from start to start that season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 1 hour ago, Harold's Leg Lift said: Being able to throw the ball past college hitters doesn't mean you have good command. That's why you need to watch some to get a feel for how he pitched. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harold's Leg Lift Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 Yep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Look at Ray Ray Run Posted February 16, 2019 Share Posted February 16, 2019 6 hours ago, ptatc said: He did not have bad command in college. His last year he had over a 3/1 K/BB ratio and a 1.03 WHIP. Also if you watch any of his games he was dominant. The other things could be considered but the command wasnt bad. I mean he walked 50 guys in like 120 innings. That's not very good command in college. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hi8is Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Will fulmer pitch BP to Manny if he signs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dominikk85 Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 At this point I would be fine with any contribution from him. When drafted you hoped for a starter of course but if he turns out to be a dominant reliever that would be ok too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted February 18, 2019 Share Posted February 18, 2019 Good for him to take his career into his own hands and not do things he felt were hurting him. Hope it works. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wanne Posted February 18, 2019 Share Posted February 18, 2019 On 2/14/2019 at 2:47 PM, SoxAce said: "Fulmer, however, believes his unorthodox mechanics were part of what made him effective." FINALLY. Still thought it was weird they made him change it a while back abd was adamant about it. Never understood that. The Sox drafted him #8 overall because of his success and felt the need to change him? Like the point with Sale...if it ain't broke don't fix it. Hope he flourishes in the bullpen. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted February 18, 2019 Author Share Posted February 18, 2019 6 minutes ago, Wanne said: Never understood that. The Sox drafted him #8 overall because of his success and felt the need to change him? Like the point with Sale...if it ain't broke don't fix it. Hope he flourishes in the bullpen. He had more issues than sale with endurance and keeping his stuff late in starts. If he wanted to be a starter it needed to change, but if he isn't then he should go back to what worked, though still needs better command. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted February 18, 2019 Share Posted February 18, 2019 55 minutes ago, Wanne said: Never understood that. The Sox drafted him #8 overall because of his success and felt the need to change him? Like the point with Sale...if it ain't broke don't fix it. Hope he flourishes in the bullpen. The difference was the high effort and different mechanics will make it tough for fulmer to stick as a starter. Sale has different mechanics but is not a high effort motion. You can have one issue but not both to pitch deep into games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted February 19, 2019 Author Share Posted February 19, 2019 https://theathletic.com/822743/2019/02/19/why-carson-fulmer-trained-at-driveline-this-offseason-to-reclaim-his-college-dominance/ Fegan on the situation. Can’t wait to get eyes on his first game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirmin' for Yermin Posted February 19, 2019 Share Posted February 19, 2019 11 minutes ago, bmags said: https://theathletic.com/822743/2019/02/19/why-carson-fulmer-trained-at-driveline-this-offseason-to-reclaim-his-college-dominance/ Fegan on the situation. Can’t wait to get eyes on his first game. dang, it cut off after the first paragraph Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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