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12 minutes ago, StrangeSox said:

I mean it was okay, not terrible, it's just not the show it was S1-4.

 

Next week is supposedly the longest battle ever put to film, and it took 55 days to film it. e: also I wonder if they're foreshadowing anything by having multiple characters talk about how safe the crypts are??

I thought about that too. There are theories online about some of the dead Starks coming back to life during the battle. Seems a bit far fetched to me.

My guess is that the Knight King wins the battle, a handful of characters die, and the remaining major characters retreat to the crypts which just happens to have a tunnel exit that allows them to escape south.

The idea that all of the "good guys" win a battle against the Knight King and then turn around to win another battle against Cersei and episode or two later just seems super weak. Something else has to happen to get these two story lines together more.

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Also it feels like they will lose the battle and that will be tough to watch. The plan with bran being isolated and watched by Theon seems very dumb, they need to just ask sansa what to do. 

Also, while I understand they need to protect the dragons after losing one, it feels like you'd want to swing them around and have them attack from the rear.

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1 minute ago, Jenksismyhero said:

I thought about that too. There are theories online about some of the dead Starks coming back to life during the battle. Seems a bit far fetched to me.

My guess is that the Knight King wins the battle, a handful of characters die, and the remaining major characters retreat to the crypts which just happens to have a tunnel exit that allows them to escape south.

The idea that all of the "good guys" win a battle against the Knight King and then turn around to win another battle against Cersei and episode or two later just seems super weak. Something else has to happen to get these two story lines together more.

I think that part where Dany says "the dead are already here" references that the dead know the entrance to the crypts and get into winterfall through there.

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Grey Worm,

Ser Brienne,

Lyanna Mormont all got the literary kiss of death last night. I'd bet the house on all three of them dying either next week or the week after. 

Pod is the next most likely after those three.

I think Bran told Tyrion that he and Jaime were toast as well. 

Also, I think this episode was great, but it should have been the first one. 

Edited by mqr

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52 minutes ago, mqr said:

Grey Worm,

Ser Brienne,

Lyanna Mormont all got the literary kiss of death last night. I'd bet the house on all three of them dying either next week or the week after. 

Pod is the next most likely after those three.

I think Bran told Tyrion that he and Jaime were toast as well. 

Also, I think this episode was great, but it should have been the first one. 

If Tyrion and Jaime die I don't think it will be in the White Walker battle, otherwise the whole assigning Bronn to the task of killing them would be utterly pointless.

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I agree with that. But I could see Bronn shwoing up right before the battle and pulling an oopsie look what I did during the fracas 

Edited by mqr

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3 hours ago, bmags said:

I would expect the following to die:

Absolutely, no questions about it - Greyworm

Almost certain - Brienne, Jorah, Davos, Tormund, Other Nights watch dude

Feels like it - Arya

Grey Worm making plans felt like it was literally from the McBain movie on the Simpsons.  He has one week until retirement, and then he's going to sail around the world in a boat called "Live-4-Eva."  

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1 minute ago, illinilaw08 said:

Grey Worm making plans felt like it was literally from the McBain movie on the Simpsons.  He has one week until retirement, and then he's going to sail around the world in a boat called "Live-4-Eva."  

Absolutely.

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So by my count there are currently 24 named characters in Winterfell for the battle of the dead.  Here are my odds on each character surviving the fight:

  • Jon - 100%
  • Daenerys - 100%
  • Tyrion - 100%
  • Sansa - 100%
  • Missandei - 100%
  • The Hound - 100%
  • Davos - 75%
  • Sam - 75%
  • Gilly - 50%
  • Arya - 50%
  • Gendry - 50%
  • Lyanna Mormont - 50%
  • Jaime - 50%
  • Pod - 50%
  • Yohn Royce - 25%
  • Varys - 25%
  • Jorah - 25%
  • Bran - 25%
  • Brienne - 25%
  • Tormund - 25%
  • Theon - 0%
  • Delorous Edd - 0%
  • Beric Dondarrion - 0%
  • Gray Worm - 0%

Based on simple math, I’m guessing about half of the 24 characters bite the dust and wouldn’t be shocked if it’s a little higher than that.

Edited by Chicago White Sox
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Arya seemed like a huge setup to kill off, just got that vibe.

I would say Lyanna Mormont is for sure going to die, so much setup there.  The rest I agree with for the most part.  

And that's crazy to think about, what show has killed off a dozen named characters in 1 episode?  And it could be even worse!  It would make sense why this is all coming to an end so quickly episode wise, what else are they going to film if they're all dead?

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Also, I hate what they have done with Dany this season.  They so quickly pushed her from lovable hero to power hungry/a bit mad Targaryean.  Just seems forced to make up for the quickness of the season.

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7 minutes ago, bigruss said:

Arya seemed like a huge setup to kill off, just got that vibe.

I would say Lyanna Mormont is for sure going to die, so much setup there.  The rest I agree with for the most part.  

And that's crazy to think about, what show has killed off a dozen named characters in 1 episode?  And it could be even worse!  It would make sense why this is all coming to an end so quickly episode wise, what else are they going to film if they're all dead?

I agree on Arya.  At least one or two big characters have to die and Arya seems like a pretty good choice.  She seems like the least important to the story going forward (unless she kills Cersei) and the fact she’s at an all-time high in terms of cockiness seems like a death sentence.

I’ll need to rewatch the Lyanna Mormont scenes because it feels like I missed something important there.  That being said, I’d be surprised if they killed off both her & Jorah (simply because it wipes out the Mormont name) and I fully expect Jorah to go down in a blaze of glory. 

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3 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said:

So by my count there are currently 24 named characters in Winterfell for the battle of the dead.  Here are my odds on each character surviving the fight:

  • Jon - 100%
  • Daenerys - 100%
  • Tyrion - 100%
  • Sansa - 100%
  • Missandei - 100%
  • The Hound - 100%
  • Davos - 75%
  • Sam - 75%
  • Gilly - 50%
  • Arya - 50%
  • Gendry - 50%
  • Lyanna Mormont - 50%
  • Jaime - 50%
  • Pod - 50%
  • Yohn Royce - 25%
  • Varys - 25%
  • Jorah - 25%
  • Bran - 25%
  • Brienne - 25%
  • Tormund - 25%
  • Theon - 0%
  • Delorous Edd - 0%
  • Beric Dondarrion - 0%
  • Gray Worm - 0%

Based on simple math, I’m guessing about half of the 24 characters bite the dust and wouldn’t be shocked if it’s a little higher than that.

If Bran dies, humanity dies. Well, he's no longer Bran. If Bloodraven dies, humanity dies. 

Also, I'd bet money Varys never dies in both the show and books. 

Edited by TaylorStSox

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I'm not sure Arya dies yet. She has the 3rd most POV chapters in the books behind Tyrion and Jon Snow. She'll die, but I'd be pretty surprised if it's this early. The Faceless Man aspect has to have some kind of pay off. 

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1 hour ago, TaylorStSox said:

If Bran dies, humanity dies. Well, he's no longer Bran. If Bloodraven dies, humanity dies.

Why is this?  I must be missing some context around this.

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So did Bran say he wanted to essentially be bait for the Night King because of theory that he IS the Night King and the characters need to think Bran died so he can use his powers for the Night King? Still don't really understand how his super powers work, but his quick interest to volunteer to be bait for the guy everyone is shitting themselves about seemed a bit strange to me, like he has other plans for it.

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Also, Captain Phasma is so totally dying. That whole scene with her getting knighted made my girlfriend cry, so it must have been an enormous moment for her character, which obviously translates to a swan song as a lot of you have pointed out.

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5 hours ago, ChiliIrishHammock24 said:

So did Bran say he wanted to essentially be bait for the Night King because of theory that he IS the Night King and the characters need to think Bran died so he can use his powers for the Night King? Still don't really understand how his super powers work, but his quick interest to volunteer to be bait for the guy everyone is shitting themselves about seemed a bit strange to me, like he has other plans for it.

Bran is Bloodraven. Bloodraven is kind of the opposite of Night King. They're in direct opposition of one another. He's tied into the network of Weirwood trees. He can see everything that trees can see. He can see the entirety of human history. He's kind of like a God. They actually talked about it in the last episode. In the books, he becomes part of the root system of a tree. It's like a throne that grows into his body. 

Bloodraven and the Night King are kind of like the manifestation of God and Lucifer among the Old God's. In GOT, all the Gods are real - The Old God's, the New God's, The Lord of Light and the Many Faced God (the God of death). They're all represented in Winterfell right now. Beric for the Lord of Light and Arya for the God of Death. 

Azor Ahai is like the manifestation of the Lord of Light. He's like their Jesus. Whoever that person is, will kill the Nights King. It could be Jaime, as he is the "Kingslayer" and it would complete his redemption story, but Jaimes redemption story will probably end with him killing Cersei. It could be Jon Snow, because he's like the Jesus of this story. We'll find out I guess. 

I'm basing this all off memory of the books. I haven't read them in years though. 

Edited by TaylorStSox

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1 hour ago, TaylorStSox said:

Bran is Bloodraven. Bloodraven is kind of the opposite of Night King. They're in direct opposition of one another. He's tied into the network of Weirwood trees. He can see everything that trees can see. He can see the entirety of human history. He's kind of like a God. They actually talked about it in the last episode. In the books, he becomes part of the root system of a tree. It's like a throne that grows into his body. 

Bloodraven and the Night King are kind of like the manifestation of God and Lucifer among the Old God's. In GOT, all the Gods are real - The Old God's, the New God's, The Lord of Light and the Many Faced God (the God of death). They're all represented in Winterfell right now. Beric for the Lord of Light and Arya for the God of Death. 

Azor Ahai is like the manifestation of the Lord of Light. He's like their Jesus. Whoever that person is, will kill the Nights King. It could be Jaime, as he is the "Kingslayer" and it would complete his redemption story, but Jaimes redemption story will probably end with him killing Cersei. It could be Jon Snow, because he's like the Jesus of this story. We'll find out I guess. 

I'm basing this all off memory of the books. I haven't read them in years though. 

No offense, but you’re making some pretty big leaps here if I remembering the books correctly.  Also, the TV show has gone in significantly less detail than the books on these subjects and won’t be hitting all the same story beats.  Like even the Azor Ahai stuff has been kept to a minimum.  There is unlikely to be a payoff with the Faceless / Many Faced God.  As for Bran, he is the Three Eyed, Blood Raven was Bryndan Rivers the Three Eyed Raven before him.

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15 hours ago, bigruss said:

Also, I hate what they have done with Dany this season.  They so quickly pushed her from lovable hero to power hungry/a bit mad Targaryean.  Just seems forced to make up for the quickness of the season.

I actually don't think it's forced and makes complete sense. When she was an essos she claimed a lot of morality and power from the ending of slavery, but in westeros she has to deal with people who do have a reference point for her - the targaryen rule (and specifically her father) they experienced and were crushed under. She does not have a moral claim with the ending of slavery, since they have none. 

So they do not respect her power in a way that is different for her than in essos where she was just an unknown. 

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Great episode this week.  Nice set up for the ensuing battle.  I have a feeling many of the series regulars will be killed.  Some of the deaths are going to surprise us, I'm sure.  It's going to interesting to see who is left standing.

I would agree, after seeing some other posts, that Brienne, Grey Worm, and Lyanna will bite it soon.  Seemed like some pretty blatant foreshadowing.

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2 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said:

No offense, but you’re making some pretty big leaps here if I remembering the books correctly.  Also, the TV show has gone in significantly less detail than the books on these subjects and won’t be hitting all the same story beats.  Like even the Azor Ahai stuff has been kept to a minimum.  There is unlikely to be a payoff with the Faceless / Many Faced God.  As for Bran, he is the Three Eyed, Blood Raven was Bryndan Rivers the Three Eyed Raven before him.

I'm pretty sure the name Bloodraven is passed down. 

 

The Azor Ahai stuff hasn't been kept to a minimum its just been a few seasons since its been a focus. 

Edited by TaylorStSox

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2 minutes ago, TaylorStSox said:

I'm pretty sure the name Bloodraven is passed down. 

 

The Azor Ahai stuff hasn't been kept to a minimum its just been a few seasons since its been a focus. 

I’m just saying relative to the books, the Azor Ahai prophecy stuff has barely been mentioned.  Stannis was hyped up as the Prince who was Promised, but a lot of the background behind that (like Lightbringer and Azor Ahai killing his wife) has been ignored for the most part.

As for Brynden Rivers, he was the bastard son of a Targaryen king (whose nickname was “Lord Bloodraven”) and most believe him to be the current Three Eyed Raven training Bran in the books.

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3 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I’m just saying relative to the books, the Azor Ahai prophecy stuff has barely been mentioned.  Stannis was hyped up as the Prince who was Promised, but a lot of the background behind that (like Lightbringer and Azor Ahai killing his wife) has been ignored for the most part.

As for Brynden Rivers, he was the bastard son of a Targaryen king (whose nickname was “Lord Bloodraven”) and most believe him to be the current Three Eyed Raven training Bran in the books.

Azor Ahai hasn't been ignored at all. It was a prominent part of Stannis's arc on the show. Melisandre has been a major character since S2. 

 

I know who Brynden Rivers is. I was just mistaken in thinking the name Bloodraven is passed down to each Three Eyed Raven. 

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I could also see Theon being Azor Ahai. It lines up with the prophecy of Azor Ahai being reborn from salt and stone, "what's dead may never die," and his redemption/Reek arc. I believe he's also the 5th most prominent character behind Tyrion, Jon Snow, Dany and Arya. 

Edited by TaylorStSox

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