The path back to .500 in our sights?

[Moan4Yoan]

13 hours ago, WBWSF said:

Signing Gio Gonzalez for a mere $2 million a year (like the Brewers did) would have improved the starting rotation. He certainly is a better starter than Banuelos.

He’s a great fit for the Brewers and I’m not surprised he signed there.  Gio is mostly a 5 inning pitcher these days but the Brewers can finish up his starts with their bullpen.

[greg775]

5 hours ago, Richie said:

 This team might finish THIRTY games below? Simply because we don't have every single, solitary hole filled with an ideal piece to contend with? Come on... We're not a winning roster, but we ARE absolutely a competitive one. No one looks at the White Sox on the schedule at this point and goes "there's three games that we can just show up for". 

 Look around at the other teams with our record. They have the same kind of problems that we do. 26-29 is just about right. This is not a 66-96 team. 

I hope you are right Richie. I feel like this team is the team that played Minnesota. Hopefully I'm wrong. I do love victories. The hitters seem to be developing the uppercuts needed to launch balls over the fence at the Cell. I wish we'd bring up Palka since he appears to have the uppercut going. Anyway, I hope you are right that we are competitive.

Edited May 31, 2019 by greg775

[NWINFan]

Jason made the comment during a game broadcast about the Sox inching toward .500 and then sliding back. To me, one explanation was obvious and that is the lack of depth in pitching.  A team can't go into a long winning streak with a weak rotation.  And right now Lopez has me concerned, and he was supposed to be reliable. Then there was the ugliness in Minnesota.

Right now I'll just enjoy the winning streak. Just please, no more trading for prospects.

 

 

[glangon]

1 hour ago, NWINFan said:

Jason made the comment during a game broadcast about the Sox inching toward .500 and then sliding back. To me, one explanation was obvious and that is the lack of depth in pitching.  A team can't go into a long winning streak with a weak rotation.  And right now Lopez has me concerned, and he was supposed to be reliable. Then there was the ugliness in Minnesota.

Right now I'll just enjoy the winning streak. Just please, no more trading for prospects.

 

 

I think the concern is more with Covey tbh. With McCann catching Lopez, he looked a lot better in his last start and he only struggled when Renteria left him in too long. Banuelos looked ok last night and you just don't know what you are getting with Nova. This team will be up and down all year I think. If we catch a team on a hot streak like Seattle and Tampa Bay earlier in the year and Minnesota last week, then there is not a lot you can do about it with the pitching. Hopefully they can make it to .500 and maybe Cease coming up or signing Keuchel can help the ailing rotation. (or a clever trade)

[poppysox]

3 hours ago, NWINFan said:

Jason made the comment during a game broadcast about the Sox inching toward .500 and then sliding back. To me, one explanation was obvious and that is the lack of depth in pitching.  A team can't go into a long winning streak with a weak rotation.  And right now Lopez has me concerned, and he was supposed to be reliable. Then there was the ugliness in Minnesota.

Right now I'll just enjoy the winning streak. Just please, no more trading for prospects.

 

 

We are allowed to trade for already major league ready players.  I hope someone is looking for quality but blocked players.  The team is starting to look rather good positionally.  The prospects already in hand look to be enough to be very good.  Of course any team has room for another 5 star ass kicker.  As always...pitching-pitching-pitching is the need.  Trade for it-pay for it in free agency-and draft it.  Need a never ending supply of quality arms.

We are fine already at every position as we wait for Madrigal & Robert to arrive. The return of Kopech and Rodon and Arrival of Cease gives us playoff potential now without adding anyone.  In the off season find a #1/2 type guy and another 3/4 and this team contends.

[Dan of Steel]

8 hours ago, greg775 said:

I hope you are right Richie. I feel like this team is the team that played Minnesota. Hopefully I'm wrong. I do love victories. The hitters seem to be developing the uppercuts needed to launch balls over the fence at the Cell. I wish we'd bring up Palka since he appears to have the uppercut going. Anyway, I hope you are right that we are competitive.

Nuh-uh. The Twins series was set up for catastrophe. It was the Twins offense at their absolute best vs. the worst of the Sox rotation. 

This team competing for a playoff spot in July-August would surprise me. I don't think they're that good. 

However, they are not so bad that they're gonna finish the season 39-67. Keep in mind, last year's squad was 18-38 at this point in the season and finished 44-62. 

This team is A LOT better than a measly 4 games over the 2018 squad. 

[flavum]

I had the Sox with 24 wins on draft day. With two rainouts, drop that to 23.  They're at 27, with three more games, so I'm happy with the improvement.

It's amazing how wins come when you have a starter pitching like an ace, and a couple position players turning the corner offensively....and an adequate to good bullpen. 

If they finish 76-86, I think that would be a real good sign for next year. 

[greg775]

10 hours ago, NWINFan said:

Jason made the comment during a game broadcast about the Sox inching toward .500 and then sliding back. To me, one explanation was obvious and that is the lack of depth in pitching.  A team can't go into a long winning streak with a weak rotation.  And right now Lopez has me concerned, and he was supposed to be reliable. Then there was the ugliness in Minnesota.

Right now I'll just enjoy the winning streak. Just please, no more trading for prospects.

 

 

Don't discount the likelihood of trading for prospects. I think that's what the new-age fan and front office wants and demands. They're going to dump Colone and it's not gonna be for veterans. Prospects. I think a good portion of new-wave fans would love to drop Abreu for prospects despite his huge numbers that few prospects will ever match. 

[poppysox]

5 hours ago, flavum said:

I had the Sox with 24 wins on draft day. With two rainouts, drop that to 23.  They're at 27, with three more games, so I'm happy with the improvement.

It's amazing how wins come when you have a starter pitching like an ace, and a couple position players turning the corner offensively....and an adequate to good bullpen. 

If they finish 76-86, I think that would be a real good sign for next year. 

We also found a top tier catcher for nothing.

[flavum]

34 minutes ago, poppysox said:

We also found a top tier catcher for nothing.

That too. Good point. 

[ron883]

4 hours ago, greg775 said:

Don't discount the likelihood of trading for prospects. I think that's what the new-age fan and front office wants and demands. They're going to dump Colone and it's not gonna be for veterans. Prospects. I think a good portion of new-wave fans would love to drop Abreu for prospects despite his huge numbers that few prospects will ever match. 

I would love to dump Abreu for prospects. If Hahn can trade him for a decent 'spect or two, I'd give him major props

[spiderman]

On 5/30/2019 at 1:14 AM, Richie said:

So, we're 26-29 as we round out May and only 2.5 GB of the 2nd AL wild card spot. Mostly thanks to Boston's World Series hangover to this point. 

After sweeping Kansas City, we continue along a somewhat cozy stretch on our schedule. We'll host Cleveland (28-27) for 4 games in Chicago. We will then head to Washington (24-32) for 2 games. Before going to Kansas City (18-37) for a three game series before we come back home to host Washington and see the Nationals for 2 more. 

That's an 11 game stretch that we could seemingly take advantage of. 7-4 would get us back to .500 at 33-33. What say you?

I think if we can just manage a split with Cleveland, we'll get it done. The problem being that Banuelos, Covey and Nova will start the first three games of the series. Giolito throws the fourth... so... that's the one you expect to win (still feels weird saying stuff like that). So, we'll need to find a way to beat Carrasco, Bauer or Rodriguez with at least one of our three guys. Which, to say the least, is not an inspiring prospect. I have no faith that any of those guys do anything besides blow up the game before it even gets going. 

It really makes you wonder where this team would be, not only if they had a healthy Rodon/Kopech, but just if they didn't have a giant black hole enveloping the #3 to #5 spots in the rotation. It's tough to watch those games a lot of the time. 

 

 

 

 

 

With the back of the rotation being so iffy, while it is progress, what is the point of .500? It's probably not sustainable with the current rotation.

[Richie]

2 hours ago, spiderman said:

With the back of the rotation being so iffy, while it is progress, what is the point of .500? It's probably not sustainable with the current rotation.

What's the point of winning? 

I guess I don't follow. I think the point of winning is self-evident.

 

Edited June 1, 2019 by Richie

[wegner]

Great homestand....but we need 1 more tomorrow.  Let's do it boys. 

[poppysox]

9 hours ago, wegner said:

Great homestand....but we need 1 more tomorrow.  Let's do it boys. 

We need to sweep Cleveland and on to Washington.  Minnesota should be listening for our footsteps.  We're coming!

[sin city sox fan]

Today is the last day of the season this team will be under .500.   A World Series title is within our reach!

[poppysox]

2 minutes ago, sin city sox fan said:

Today is the last day of the season this team will be under .500.   A World Series title is within our reach!

An excellent concept.  Since you are from sin city...what are the odds?

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

On 5/30/2019 at 11:17 AM, ChiSox59 said:

Starting with 3 of 4 from Cleveland would be huge.  Don't love our chances the next two nights, though.  The Covey-Banuelos stack is an eye sore.  

Only Covey Banuelos ? ( We actually won the those games. Nova pitched well and lost that one. }Then Gio and Lopez again. Basically 4 of our 5 starters can't be counted on for much better than a 5-6 ERA . The fact that we got 3 decent starts in a row from Covey Banuelos and Nova has those residing on Cloud 9 in a celebratory tizzy.

Seems as if there's only the pessimists and the eternal optimists around here. I am the cautious optimist but you have to be blind not to see the faults in the rotation. Sure I love the idea of Keuchel on a 2 year contract to support the guys coming back from surgery  like Kopech , Rodon and Dunning because they are young and also there's a very real chance they don't pitch effectively or have setback like Burdi has had. Who knows if Hansen ever can become an effective starter again ? He can't even consistently throw strikes so far in relief.

1 one year deal for Keuchel would be ridiculous while also counting on Cease to be effective and have them both be effective enough to get the 2nd wild card.

I'm all for going for it next year but that would mean signing Keuchel for more than a year and also getting a very good starter via free agency. Might be Cole, Bumgarner or even Quintana. I can be optimistic about that even though every bone in my body says no way it happens because even if it does happen we still have young pitchers coming back from injuries and Cease while not injured hasn't proven anything.

I can only drink so much Kool-aid not the gallons some of you seem to be swallowing.

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

49 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

Only Covey Banuelos ? ( We actually won the those games. Nova pitched well and lost that one. }Then Gio and Lopez again. Basically 4 of our 5 starters can't be counted on for much better than a 5-6 ERA . The fact that we got 3 decent starts in a row from Covey Banuelos and Nova has those residing on Cloud 9 in a celebratory tizzy.

Seems as if there's only the pessimists and the eternal optimists around here. I am the cautious optimist but you have to be blind not to see the faults in the rotation. Sure I love the idea of Keuchel on a 2 year contract to support the guys coming back from surgery  like Kopech , Rodon and Dunning because they are young and also there's a very real chance they don't pitch effectively or have setback like Burdi has had. Who knows if Hansen ever can become an effective starter again ? He can't even consistently throw strikes so far in relief.

1 one year deal for Keuchel would be ridiculous while also counting on Cease to be effective and have them both be effective enough to get the 2nd wild card.

I'm all for going for it next year but that would mean signing Keuchel for more than a year and also getting a very good starter via free agency. Might be Cole, Bumgarner or even Quintana. I can be optimistic about that even though every bone in my body says no way it happens because even if it does happen we still have young pitchers coming back from injuries and Cease while not injured hasn't proven anything.

I can only drink so much Kool-aid not the gallons some of you seem to be swallowing.

It’s not just what we are seeing at the major league level but also the fact that the Sox have arguably the best position player prospect and pitching prospect in baseball (both in the top 3 in those respective categories at least and very close to big league promotions). Meanwhile, the team payroll sits at only $90M with very few future commitments and essentially zero bad contracts on the books. They are in a great position to open the contention window sooner than expected if they decide the time is right to do so.

[ChiSox59]

2 hours ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

Only Covey Banuelos ? ( We actually won the those games. Nova pitched well and lost that one. }Then Gio and Lopez again. Basically 4 of our 5 starters can't be counted on for much better than a 5-6 ERA . The fact that we got 3 decent starts in a row from Covey Banuelos and Nova has those residing on Cloud 9 in a celebratory tizzy.

Seems as if there's only the pessimists and the eternal optimists around here. I am the cautious optimist but you have to be blind not to see the faults in the rotation. Sure I love the idea of Keuchel on a 2 year contract to support the guys coming back from surgery  like Kopech , Rodon and Dunning because they are young and also there's a very real chance they don't pitch effectively or have setback like Burdi has had. Who knows if Hansen ever can become an effective starter again ? He can't even consistently throw strikes so far in relief.

1 one year deal for Keuchel would be ridiculous while also counting on Cease to be effective and have them both be effective enough to get the 2nd wild card.

I'm all for going for it next year but that would mean signing Keuchel for more than a year and also getting a very good starter via free agency. Might be Cole, Bumgarner or even Quintana. I can be optimistic about that even though every bone in my body says no way it happens because even if it does happen we still have young pitchers coming back from injuries and Cease while not injured hasn't proven anything.

I can only drink so much Kool-aid not the gallons some of you seem to be swallowing.

Lol, I said 3 of 4 would be huge. We’re 1 win away from that. Not sure how the remakes me a kook aid swallower. I am just cheering for my favorite team. 

[CaliSoxFanViaSWside]

1 hour ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

It’s not just what we are seeing at the major league level but also the fact that the Sox have arguably the best position player prospect and pitching prospect in baseball (both in the top 3 in those respective categories at least and very close to big league promotions). Meanwhile, the team payroll sits at only $90M with very few future commitments and essentially zero bad contracts on the books. They are in a great position to open the contention window sooner than expected if they decide the time is right to do so.

Yes next year but not a chance in hell this year.

 

33 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

Lol, I said 3 of 4 would be huge. We’re 1 win away from that. Not sure how the remakes me a kook aid swallower. I am just cheering for my favorite team. 

When I responded it wasn't meant for you per se just all the pie in the sky hopes I was reading for contention this year. So I am sorry if you thought I was calling you a Kool-Aid by the gallon drinker. Your earlier post  was actually more along my line of thinking  about Keuchel although I thought 3 years would be 1 two many.

Edited June 2, 2019 by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

[spiderman]

On 5/31/2019 at 9:50 PM, Richie said:

What's the point of winning? 

I guess I don't follow. I think the point of winning is self-evident.

 

They aren't winning enough to be a winning team because of the rotation (primarily). Of course, winning matters, but do you really think this is sustaining and should we be celebrating .500?

[Grindersrule]

I would say that 500 now is a great sign when we have Kopech, Cease and cash for another solid starter available. Likely huge upgrades to the pitching coming soon. 

[Richie]

4 hours ago, spiderman said:

They aren't winning enough to be a winning team because of the rotation (primarily). Of course, winning matters, but do you really think this is sustaining and should we be celebrating .500?

 I mean, by this philosophy - you should only be concerned with winning if you think you have a shot at the world series. "What's the point of winning the division? We're going to lose right away in the playoffs."

 Look, I get that this is a rebuild. However, you can't just lose 95 games every season up until your "pre-determined contending" season and be under the impression that "Welp! Suddenly we're going to be great now because it's 2020! Remember how everyone promised we'd be good in 2020? Well, here we are!". It's not just going to happen overnight.

 You need to see signs of growth from the team. Seeing them find ways to win is a big part of that. The rotation has been quite poor, but Cease is on his way up and Kuechel (or other outside help) is an option. Eloy and the young players should only get better. If I believed this team was as good as it was going to get in 2019. Sure, I would agree that we're going to hit some mega rough patch at some point. However, there's real concrete reasons for cautious/realistic optimism here. Wishing for .500 and some competitive baseball isn't asking for the world. 

 I'm not one of these guys who actually thinks we're going to be in a serious wild card hunt come September. However, to suggest that we should still (one year before we all think we're going to be a serious contender) be disregarding winning/losing entirely is just silly... That mentality has to end at some point. 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited June 2, 2019 by Richie

[Richie]

6 hours ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

Yes next year but not a chance in hell this year.

 

When I responded it wasn't meant for you per se just all the pie in the sky hopes I was reading for contention this year. So I am sorry if you thought I was calling you a Kool-Aid by the gallon drinker. Your earlier post  was actually more along my line of thinking  about Keuchel although I thought 3 years would be 1 two many.

I think you're misinterpreting a lot of people's thoughts. All I see is hopes that we can have some fun this year and (as opposed to the last couple of seasons) put up a fight. I haven't read this thread post for post... but is anyone really saying that they think we're going to win the 2nd AL Wild Card?