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OneDog847

The $$$$ will be spent!

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2 hours ago, TaylorStSox said:

Can you name a single pitcher who's had both major shoulder surgery and TJS and came back? 

I don't know any pitchers who have had both procedures, therefore I can't comment on their success, or lack there of. This seems like a question for "ptatc".

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Well I found something different we can spend some money on:

 

For any who don't know, Boddy is the guy who runs Driveline. Let's use some of that money we have lying around to revamp our player development staff.

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16 minutes ago, GenericUserName said:

Well I found something different we can spend some money on:

 

For any who don't know, Boddy is the guy who runs Driveline. Let's use some of that money we have lying around to revamp our player development staff.

 

GoFundMe?  Cooper would probably love that...

Edited by caulfield12

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6 hours ago, GenericUserName said:

Well I found something different we can spend some money on:

 

For any who don't know, Boddy is the guy who runs Driveline. Let's use some of that money we have lying around to revamp our player development staff.

 

Let’s get this dude, move Cooper into an advisory role/roving instructor and hire Brian Bannister to be the pitching guy in the organization. He’s very analytical inclined and has been working for the Red Sox for the past few years  

http://www.nbcsports.com/boston/red-sox/why-hasnt-rising-star-brian-bannister-left-red-sox%3famp

https://www.si.com/mlb/2019/06/07/boston-red-sox-brian-bannister-mvp-machine

Edited by Joshua Strong
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3 hours ago, Joshua Strong said:

Let’s get this dude, move Cooper into an advisory role/roving instructor and hire Brian Bannister to be the pitching guy in the organization. He’s very analytical inclined and has been working for the Red Sox for the past few years  

http://www.nbcsports.com/boston/red-sox/why-hasnt-rising-star-brian-bannister-left-red-sox%3famp

https://www.si.com/mlb/2019/06/07/boston-red-sox-brian-bannister-mvp-machine

The odds of the White Sox not promoting a coach from their own “network” of coaches and alumni would seem to be somewhere between slim and none.

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22 hours ago, bmags said:

The point of people advocating signing for Machado was to remove some of the luck required in the rebuild, however.

And much of the criticism is of process, which doesn't mean the outcomes cannot be good. I am very happy with Moncada, Anderson, Eloy and Giolito. You can see my posts post-machado, there was always a way to contention but weirdly enough getting players whose down years get you an .850 OPs and great defense was what I wanted!

But the main issues are well documented, but aside from injuries it has been :

- Still developing player development operation

- Inability to convert more depth from international scouting operation

- Inability to convert more depth from rounds 3-10 in draft

- Consistently signing free agents that then produce the worst year of their careers. Regardless of whether the free agents are supposed to be "part of the core", signing free agents during our competing years of 2014-16 proved to be an awful mark on Hahns tenure, and he has not gotten better. And I do not want to hear about McCann, I'm as happy as ever on signing him, but every GM in the game has a McCann that has been around longer than 2 years.

When we started the rebuild, the expectation was we were setting ourselves up for consistent contention. Trading away three great, cost controlled players for prospects and multiple top ten picks should net us great prospects and a competitive team. It's fair for people to judge whether their process is consistent with other organizations who are putting together consistently excellent teams.

This is spot on especially the part about removing the luck along with a superstar having a down half a season and still would be our best player. The worst thing about loving Giolito or Moncada or Eloy and Anderson is that they have no sustained success and we cannot yet expect them to do well because any young player can get hot and then revert back to being bad. That is always the worry until they get a few good years in a row under their belts. It is the same thing with counting on Robert and Madrigal. All these players have so very little time actually being good and in the case of prospects not even good at the highest level. It's great to have hope and believe it's all working but there is nothing wrong with having as close to a sure thing as you can get.

Taylor Street couldn't have said Hahn was killing it 6 months ago. He shouldn't be claiming victory based on a few months of sample size. Not to mention all the other bad GM'ing things bmags brought up in Hahn's reign.

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15 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

This is spot on especially the part about removing the luck along with a superstar having a down half a season and still would be our best player. The worst thing about loving Giolito or Moncada or Eloy and Anderson is that they have no sustained success and we cannot yet expect them to do well because any young player can get hot and then revert back to being bad. That is always the worry until they get a few good years in a row under their belts. It is the same thing with counting on Robert and Madrigal. All these players have so very little time actually being good and in the case of prospects not even good at the highest level. It's great to have hope and believe it's all working but there is nothing wrong with having as close to a sure thing as you can get.

Taylor Street couldn't have said Hahn was killing it 6 months ago. He shouldn't be claiming victory based on a few months of sample size. Not to mention all the other bad GM'ing things bmags brought up in Hahn's reign.

Every GM is killing it during year 3 of a rebuild. Let's see where the Sox are this time next year. The Cubbies started their playoff run during year 4 of their rebuild. No reason the Sox shouldn't be able to do the same. 

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Let’s just say there has never been a GM better positioned with the mid market payrolls of the AL central and the ability to jump start the rebuild with Sale, Eaton, Q...not to mention Frazier/Kahnle/Robertson.

Even if we have the best group of young position players in baseball...we have five young starting pitchers with TJS already in their histories and the Lopez.

We’ve spent multiple years bringing in college relievers yet don’t have anything resembling a lockdown pen. 

We largely don’t play smart baseball and have outdated coaches at the major league level.

We’ve probably already wasted picks on Fulmer, Burdi, Hansen (at least the upside was there), Burger, Sheets...and have hit a complete brick wall in terms of any of the four remaining minor league OF prospects after Robert even being close to ready for 2020...meaning we need to at the very least rent a RFer for 2-3 years.  Collins is just as much suspect as prospect.

All of the lesser trades since 2016 have brought in...well, maybe nobody who will contribute to our next playoff team.  Palka and Fry last year are worth very little this year.  We have lots of utility players and 4th/5th infielders...but the only real breakthrough has been the play of McCann.  

Other than that move, we might have had the worst offseason in recent memory, as Colome might be dealt and our catching situation still is unresolved long-term.

 

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23 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

Philly is up over 8000 per game and thats through June average vs. entire 2018.

White Sox 300 behind 2018 full year pace but half the summer remaining.

Padres should end up around 2500-3000 plus per game but were already near 27000 with a terrible team last year.

 

Just now on the score Joe Sheehan just said the white Sox are the third highest jump from last year to this year in attendance at 2300 more per game.   And summer hasn't even started yet

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Just now, Kyyle23 said:

Just now on the score Joe Sheehan just said the white Sox are the third highest jump from last year to this year in attendance at 2300 more per game.   And summer hasn't even started yet

☹️

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7 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said:

Just now on the score Joe Sheehan just said the white Sox are the third highest jump from last year to this year in attendance at 2300 more per game.   And summer hasn't even started yet

I think part of the reason that attendance is up is that tickets are pretty much dirt cheap. You can basically buy an upper deck tix off Stubhub the day of game for less than $10 dollars and pretty much sit almost wherever you want on the 100 level. 

Feels like Summer here today finally. Mid-80s with sunshine. 

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Just now, OneDog847 said:

I think part of the reason that attendance is up is that tickets are pretty much dirt cheap. You can basically buy an upper deck tix off Stubhub the day of game for less than $10 dollars and pretty much sit almost wherever you want on the 100 level. 

Feels like Summer here today finally. Mid-80s with sunshine. 

It's been like that for a while, people are interested because things are much more interesting.

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28 minutes ago, OneDog847 said:

I think part of the reason that attendance is up is that tickets are pretty much dirt cheap. You can basically buy an upper deck tix off Stubhub the day of game for less than $10 dollars and pretty much sit almost wherever you want on the 100 level. 

Feels like Summer here today finally. Mid-80s with sunshine. 

It's been like that for a few years, though. 

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20 hours ago, Kyyle23 said:

Just now on the score Joe Sheehan just said the white Sox are the third highest jump from last year to this year in attendance at 2300 more per game.   And summer hasn't even started yet

There’s a ton of qualifiers on that. 

 

Yankee and Red Sox series ON THE WEEKEND with the added benefit of good(for Chicago) weather, and a lot of giveaways. The “free shit” crowd has been out in full force this year.  The second game

the second game of the year sold more tickets than opening day because everyone just had to have the hoodie. 

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3 minutes ago, ewokpelts said:

There’s a ton of qualifiers on that. 

 

Yankee and Red Sox series ON THE WEEKEND with the added benefit of good(for Chicago) weather, and a lot of giveaways. The “free shit” crowd has been out in full force this year.  The second game

the second game of the year sold more tickets than opening day because everyone just had to have the hoodie. 

Ok

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20 minutes ago, ewokpelts said:

There’s a ton of qualifiers on that. 

 

Yankee and Red Sox series ON THE WEEKEND with the added benefit of good(for Chicago) weather, and a lot of giveaways. The “free shit” crowd has been out in full force this year.  The second game

the second game of the year sold more tickets than opening day because everyone just had to have the hoodie. 

This from a month ago...

Nineteen of the 30 teams have seen their average fall from a similar point last year, with the largest drops in Toronto (6,963), San Francisco (6,463), Baltimore (3,839) and Detroit (3,686).

Large rises have taken place for Philadelphia (10,383), Oakland (4,027), San Diego (3,465) and the Chicago White Sox (2,311). The Phillies signed Bryce Harper and the Padres added Manny Machado.

 

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23 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

This from a month ago...

Nineteen of the 30 teams have seen their average fall from a similar point last year, with the largest drops in Toronto (6,963), San Francisco (6,463), Baltimore (3,839) and Detroit (3,686).

Large rises have taken place for Philadelphia (10,383), Oakland (4,027), San Diego (3,465) and the Chicago White Sox (2,311). The Phillies signed Bryce Harper and the Padres added Manny Machado.

 

And?

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1 minute ago, ewokpelts said:

And?

I’m not going to go through the entire season at baseball reference to compare attendance through X number of games...for the A’s and Padres...but knowing the White Sox, it only means there’s now even less incentive to make dramatic moves for Cole, Ozuna and Grandal or another starting pitcher/high leverage reliever this coming offseason.   The sky hasn’t fallen, as predicted.   After the botched Machado deal, some were speculating attendance would fall into the 1.35-1.4 million range, and that clearly hasn’t happened at all.

Obviously, dramatically discounting ticket prices has helped...attending Cubs’ games these days will cost you a reverse mortgage.

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10 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

I’m not going to go through the entire season at baseball reference to compare attendance through X number of games...for the A’s and Padres...but knowing the White Sox, it only means there’s now even less incentive to make dramatic moves for Cole, Ozuna and Grandal or another starting pitcher/high leverage reliever this coming offseason.   The sky hasn’t fallen, as predicted.   After the botched Machado deal, some were speculating attendance would fall into the 1.35-1.4 million range, and that clearly hasn’t happened at all.

Obviously, dramatically discounting ticket prices has helped...attending Cubs’ games these days will cost you a reverse mortgage.

Couldn't you also say that putting a good team out there will help even more? This year we are merely competitive if we were good we could get a lot more people. Thus signing a big time FA would be even more beneficial.

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23 hours ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

This is spot on especially the part about removing the luck along with a superstar having a down half a season and still would be our best player. The worst thing about loving Giolito or Moncada or Eloy and Anderson is that they have no sustained success and we cannot yet expect them to do well because any young player can get hot and then revert back to being bad. That is always the worry until they get a few good years in a row under their belts. It is the same thing with counting on Robert and Madrigal. All these players have so very little time actually being good and in the case of prospects not even good at the highest level. It's great to have hope and believe it's all working but there is nothing wrong with having as close to a sure thing as you can get.

Taylor Street couldn't have said Hahn was killing it 6 months ago. He shouldn't be claiming victory based on a few months of sample size. Not to mention all the other bad GM'ing things bmags brought up in Hahn's reign.

I'm glad you mentioned this. I take nothing for granted,  especially where Giolito is concerned. He looked great in September of 2017 but was Jaime Navarro bad last year. Many thought Lopez had figured it out last year but now look at how he has regressed. In addition to dropping like flies young pitchers today are so inconsistent. I expect Moncada to be good from here on out and Jiminez to eventually be a top of the line hitter. Anderson is not baseball smart, makes way too many physical and mental errors and of course I hope he's healthy again soon. Yes, I agree. These guys must show sustained success and it will take time for us to properly evaluate them over the long haul.

Edited by SI1020

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I made a post in the game thread from yesterday just before it got closed. Someone pointed out that Cole is expecting 6 years $140 million.

As a frame of reference, that is an AAV of $23.333 mill. 

Their offer to Machado of $250 million for 8 years: AAV of $31.25 mill.

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5 minutes ago, soxfan2014 said:

I made a post in the game thread from yesterday just before it got closed. Someone pointed out that Cole is expecting 6 years $140 million.

As a frame of reference, that is an AAV of $23.333 mill. 

Their offer to Machado of $250 million for 8 years: AAV of $31.25 mill.

But manny wanted a record breaker as well as the opt out. Things the Sox don’t do. 

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39 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

I’m not going to go through the entire season at baseball reference to compare attendance through X number of games...for the A’s and Padres...but knowing the White Sox, it only means there’s now even less incentive to make dramatic moves for Cole, Ozuna and Grandal or another starting pitcher/high leverage reliever this coming offseason.   The sky hasn’t fallen, as predicted.   After the botched Machado deal, some were speculating attendance would fall into the 1.35-1.4 million range, and that clearly hasn’t happened at all.

Obviously, dramatically discounting ticket prices has helped...attending Cubs’ games these days will cost you a reverse mortgage.

The Sox ticket prices have been this low since 2013. And all but one year attendance has decreased. 

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7 minutes ago, ewokpelts said:

But manny wanted a record breaker as well as the opt out. Things the Sox don’t do. 

That really wasn't my point ha.

It was more for the people doubting they would offer Cole a contract due to what he wants. Yet, they just offered more overall and a significantly higher (I'd say $8 mill per year is significant) AAV to someone just last off-season.

Edited by soxfan2014

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