Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Look at Ray Ray Run

Rick Hahn and his Trades

Recommended Posts

11 minutes ago, gusguyman said:

Especially for a guy who has the tools to be good defensively in both CF and RF. He doesn't need a great bat to carry him if he can polish his routes.

Yeah, I should have mentioned that as well.  To arbitrarily set an OPS benchmark across all positions is just dumb.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, SoxAce said:

He was actually 21 majority of that year (late August bday).

Lol...I totally botched that math, but it furthers reinforces the point that Basabe was actually pretty damn good at AA all things considered.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Good god man.  That .734 OPS was good for a wRC+ of 111 and that’s not even park adjusted.  That is phenomenal for a 22 year old who as expected had some initial struggles making the biggest jump in minor league ball.

We can come back to this in a few years. Having a decent wRC+ for half of AA season isn’t the goal. Having a productive MLB RFer is, and Basabe isn’t going to be that.

And even if he does get an MLB stint, there’s going to be no objective standard that Sox fans (as found on SoxTalk) will hold him to. He’ll put up a .650 OPS but they’ll point to some other facet of his game or obscure sabes stat and make excuses for how he’s actually a decent player, despite what our eyes tell us. They’ll say he’s still young, or that it’s too small of a sample (although the definition of “SSS” will extend as necessary). That’s what they have done for Yolmer Sanchez for six years now. At what point can we write anyone off???

We are the biggest congratulants of mediocrity of any fan base in sports, but then we have the gall to wonder why we’re completely mediocre.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, gusguyman said:

Especially for a guy who has the tools to be good defensively in both CF and RF. He doesn't need a great bat to carry him if he can polish his routes.

Polish his routes? This organization produces complete imbeciles in the field. Talented athletes, sure, but technically refined and smart players who take the best routes? No way. What makes you think this organization will develop the best results out of any given player, especially in an aspect like that?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, The Sir said:

We can come back to this in a few years. Having a decent wRC+ for half of AA season isn’t the goal. Having a productive MLB RFer is, and Basabe isn’t going to be that.

And even if he does get an MLB stint, there’s going to be no objective standard that Sox fans (as found on SoxTalk) will hold him to. He’ll put up a .650 OPS but they’ll point to some other facet of his game or obscure sabes stat and make excuses for how he’s actually a decent player, despite what our eyes tell us. They’ll say he’s still young, or that it’s too small of a sample (although the definition of “SSS” will extend as necessary). That’s what they have done for Yolmer Sanchez for six years now. At what point can we write anyone off???

We are the biggest congratulants of mediocrity of any fan base in sports, but then we have the gall to wonder why we’re completely mediocre.

Talk about changing the goalposts.  You tried to imply that Basabe was bad in AA last year by citing his OPS and several of us made arguments that pretty clearly proved otherwise.  Instead of going off on some bizarre “accountability” tangent, just take the L and move on.  We all have made comments here that were quickly disproven, it’s really not a big deal.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am enjoying this uptick in quality of play as much as anyone, but before I offer any apologies to Rick Hahn, being .500 isn’t the goal. I will see how this plays out. If half of these guys are for real, they should be OK. Gio, no one could have seen this coming. Eloy is staring to become the beast we were hoping. Moncada looks like he can do a lot of damage. Anderson and McCann iare hitting. Hopefully it is real. Robert, Madrigal, Vaughn. Nice line up. Will need some pitching .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Kudos to RH for 3 amazing trades, but I can't separate them from his performance. In fact, they are bittersweet exactly because they are so great.

There is a decent chance we end up with 4/5 of a really good rotation, a star 3B, and a star LF/DH from this trade.  Tim Anderson was already around, and Luis Robert looks like another good international signing. That is a great core right there, so we don't need to get Springer/Correa/Bregman in 5 years from the draft. We are most of the way there.

Which is why it is so damning that we haven't found those complimentary pieces yet. I have high hopes for Madrigal, and I like Vaughn a lot. But these trades highlight just how bad the drafting and FA signings have been. 

If Madrigal/Vaughn are good, and if we sign a couple good FAs this offseason, then I will happily say RH did a great job. He hasn't so far though. If we want to have sustained success like the Cardinals and Red Sox, we need to draft well now. Otherwise we will end up like the Royals: A 3ish year window and then a quick descent back to mediocrity. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, The Sir said:

We can come back to this in a few years. Having a decent wRC+ for half of AA season isn’t the goal. Having a productive MLB RFer is, and Basabe isn’t going to be that.

And even if he does get an MLB stint, there’s going to be no objective standard that Sox fans (as found on SoxTalk) will hold him to. He’ll put up a .650 OPS but they’ll point to some other facet of his game or obscure sabes stat and make excuses for how he’s actually a decent player, despite what our eyes tell us. They’ll say he’s still young, or that it’s too small of a sample (although the definition of “SSS” will extend as necessary). That’s what they have done for Yolmer Sanchez for six years now. At what point can we write anyone off???

We are the biggest congratulants of mediocrity of any fan base in sports, but then we have the gall to wonder why we’re completely mediocre.

As of a few weeks ago, Yolmer Sanchez still had the second highest WAR since 2017 of any position player on the team, behind Jose Abreu. Yolmer is better suited as a utility player than a starter, but that is a useful piece, not something to just toss in the garbage. He is not the problem. Maybe you should get your eyes checked, they seem to be telling you the wrong shit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Talk about changing the goalposts.  You tried to imply that Basabe was bad in AA last year by citing his OPS and several of us made arguments that pretty clearly proved otherwise.  Instead of going off on some bizarre “accountability” tangent, just take the L and move on.  We all have made comments here that were quickly disproven, it’s really not a big deal.

Because that OPS isn’t good, and nothing you cite redeems it, because if a guy in this system doesn’t dominate the minors, he’s not going to do jack up here. We’ve seen it a dozen times over. I’ve said my piece.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, gusguyman said:

Otherwise we will end up like the Royals: A 3ish year window and then a quick descent back to mediocrity. 

For the record once again...the Royals have a championship trophy and 2 world series appearances out of that run. I will take that any time you want to offer it.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

three solid trades. The rest of the body of work since 2005  is terrible. At least we’re trending in the right direction now.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Dick Allen said:

I am enjoying this uptick in quality of play as much as anyone, but before I offer any apologies to Rick Hahn, being .500 isn’t the goal. I will see how this plays out. If half of these guys are for real, they should be OK. Gio, no one could have seen this coming. Eloy is staring to become the beast we were hoping. Moncada looks like he can do a lot of damage. Anderson and McCann iare hitting. Hopefully it is real. Robert, Madrigal, Vaughn. Nice line up. Will need some pitching .

Getting some of that pitching now will help keep the momentum.  No reason not to enjoy some wins while we wait for next year.  Wining helps create the atmosphere you need to compete long haul.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

To summarize, the Sale, Eaton, and Q trades all look solid, and they very well might turn out to be sensational if a few years.  The Yankee trade was MEH.  They all have one thing in common:  in addition to the principals of the trades (Eloy, Cease, Gio, Lopez, Yoan, Kopech) on the receiving end, Sox got a whole bunch of junky players who really never had a chance of helping.  Too numerous to mention.  Why bother, Hahn?  Just get some good players in return.  It just smacks of the other GM's convincing Hahn to take the deals because of quantity.  Oh well.

But, in two pages of posts, nobody mentions the Tatis fuck up.  He had three hits last night, by the way, and looked sensational.  I just can't get over the sheer incompetence.  If he ever took a moment to explain his action, I might be able to understand it.  It was a bozo move, and one is too many.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, South Side Fireworks Man said:

Hahn should've gotten more for Peavey.

Hahn won that trade.

  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, oldsox said:

To summarize, the Sale, Eaton, and Q trades all look solid, and they very well might turn out to be sensational if a few years.  The Yankee trade was MEH.  They all have one thing in common:  in addition to the principals of the trades (Eloy, Cease, Gio, Lopez, Yoan, Kopech) on the receiving end, Sox got a whole bunch of junky players who really never had a chance of helping.  Too numerous to mention.  Why bother, Hahn?  Just get some good players in return.  It just smacks of the other GM's convincing Hahn to take the deals because of quantity.  Oh well.

But, in two pages of posts, nobody mentions the Tatis fuck up.  He had three hits last night, by the way, and looked sensational.  I just can't get over the sheer incompetence.  If he ever took a moment to explain his action, I might be able to understand it.  It was a bozo move, and one is too many.

Hahn said that if they don't make the Tatis deal, they probably stay the course with Sale/Q/Eaton in 2017. He said that the Tatis trade is what directly lead to the rebuild happening in the first place. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, Hatchetman said:

You don’t get credit for releasing the guys you get 

Montas helped get us Frazier, another piece was used to get Lawrie.  The only guy we released was Avi after like six seasons of control.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
53 minutes ago, oldsox said:

Hahn won that trade.

I like that trade even now that Avi is gone.  We won it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've said it before I'll say it again. Hahn is a White Sox GM forever or as long as he wants to be. Acquiring Eloy is that significant. If Gio and Cease and Eloy stay healthy he may go down as the greatest GM in Chicago sports history. All he has to do is acquire 2 veteran starters and one reliever and one outfielder and he's ready for postseson play.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hahn has made three bad trades — trading away Marcus Semien, Frankie Montas, and the worst of all Fernando Tatis Jr.

He has done pretty well in trades but he is absolutely awful at free agent signings over his career as Sox GM.

Edited by Moan4Yoan

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Montas helped get us Frazier, another piece was used to get Lawrie.  The only guy we released was Avi after like six seasons of control.

Frazier was pretty damn mediocre as a Sox and Lawrie was a bust.  I’d rather have Montas.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×