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Chisox378

Jon Jay reinstated

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Just now, Richie said:

Opening day 2020 will be a year and a half from Kopech's injury/surgery. Barring a setback, I don't see how he isn't ready to go.

They might want to send him to AAA to "shake off the rust" missing a year+. Then call him up and gain that extra year back. 

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1 hour ago, Chisox378 said:

Jay is on the club. Its about time. He will give us a big boost on the field and in the clubhouse. Lets hope we can get rolling and not look back! Lets go Sox!

I'll be happy if he can suck less than Alonso myself.

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1 hour ago, Chisox378 said:

How can we tank when we are going to win the wild card?!?! (or division!?!?!)

I'll have what this guy is drinking! 😃 Obviously this comment that he posted was made in jest.

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8 minutes ago, Richie said:

Opening day 2020 will be a year and a half removed from Kopech's UCL injury/TJ surgery. Barring a setback, I don't see how he isn't ready to go.

It's almost certain he will be on some sort of pitch / inning restriction.   And also, we really should be anticipating command issues and frustrations throughout the year.

The Sox better be anticipating their 2020 plans with Kopech being nothing more than a 5th starter.  Problem is, Lopez should also be looked at as nothing more than a 5th starter. 

They better think big, and I mean HUGE, in free agency.   Yes, Garret Cole.  

Edited by HOFHurt35

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6 minutes ago, SoxAce said:

They might want to send him to AAA to "shake off the rust" missing a year+. Then call him up and gain that extra year back. 

That would be pretty shady. They'd have to remove him from the 60 day IL and then demote him to AAA instead of him going there as part of a rehab assignment.

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4 minutes ago, Richie said:

Opening day 2020 will be a year and a half removed from Kopech's UCL injury/TJ surgery. Barring a setback, I don't see how he isn't ready to go.

I'm highly skeptical that Kopech will ready to go on opening day 2020. Zach Burdi is almost two years removed from Tommy John and the guy can barely pitch more than two innings a week. 

 

6 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

He’s saying the Sox will have to add multiple starters to have a healthy rotation at the beginning of the year, but when the TJS guys finally come back we are actually going to have some depth.  As raBBit has said before, that’s a good thing since Kopech & Cease may not be ready for a deep postseason run.

Kopech is the only guy who will be back from TJ in 2020. I don't think Dunning or Rodon will be able to go until 2021. 

6 minutes ago, Richie said:

 

 

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Just now, TomPickle said:

That would be pretty shady. They'd have to remove him from the 60 day IL and then demote him to AAA instead of him going there as part of a rehab assignment.

He comes off the 60-day IL at the start of the off-season, no?

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7 minutes ago, Lip Man 1 said:

I'll have what this guy is drinking! 😃 Obviously this comment that he posted was made in jest.

We are 5 games back of the Wild Card, its still not the All Star Break. No Joke! 😃

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4 minutes ago, HOFHurt35 said:

It's almost certain he will be on some sort of pitch / inning restriction.   And also, we really should be anticipating command issues and frustrations throughout the year.

The Sox better be anticipating their 2020 plans with Kopech being nothing more than a 5th starter.  Problem is, Lopez should also be looked at as nothing more than a 5th starter. 

They better think big, and I mean HUGE, in free agency.   Yes, Garret Cole.  

Yes sir. Cole or Bumgardner this year and James Paxton or Robbie Ray the year after that. The $$$ better be spent on pitching, pitching, and more pitching. 

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5 minutes ago, SoxAce said:

They might want to send him to AAA to "shake off the rust" missing a year+. Then call him up and gain that extra year back. 

Honestly, it a perfect world we sign two free agent starters (for now let’s say Wheeler & Wood).  The rotation to start 2019 would then be the following:

  1. Giolito
  2. Wheeler
  3. Cease
  4. Wood*
  5. Lopez

Then sometime in May (once we get a year back on control and some rust has been worn off), Kopech comes up and likely replaces Lopez (who goes to the pen or optioned to Charlotte).  At some point, Rodon & Dunning should be back.  While Dane can’t be counted on to fill a major league role in 2020, Carlos can potentially be a factor if we make a playoff push and need an arm to replace Cease or Kopech late in the season.

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24 minutes ago, OneDog847 said:

I'm highly skeptical that Kopech will ready to go on opening day 2020. Zach Burdi is almost two years removed from Tommy John and the guy can barely pitch more than two innings a week. 

 

Kopech is the only guy who will be back from TJ in 2020. I don't think Dunning or Rodon will be able to go until 2021. 

 

I would think Dunning would be back middle of the year at worse. It doesn't take 15+ months to recover anymore.

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23 minutes ago, soxfan2014 said:

He comes off the 60-day IL at the start of the off-season, no?

I'm honestly not sure about that. Even if that is the case they would still have to demote him to AAA rather than send him on a rehab assignment and it would extremely obvious what they are doing. It would win the White Sox an extra year of Kopech and probably piss off every pitcher in the system.

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1 minute ago, TomPickle said:

I'm honestly not sure about that. Even if that is the case they would still have to demote him to AAA rather than send him on a rehab assignment and it would extremely obvious what they are doing. It would win the White Sox an extra year of Kopech and probably piss off every pitcher in the system.

Players on the IL come off at the end of the year. We always talk about that here when we go over any possible 40-man roster issues. And you do have a case for sending him to the minors since he hasn't pitched in over a year. Sure he'll have Spring Training, but I'm sure they will want to see him go 6-7 innings somewhat consistently before calling him up.

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4 minutes ago, TomPickle said:

I'm honestly not sure about that. Even if that is the case they would still have to demote him to AAA rather than send him on a rehab assignment and it would extremely obvious what they are doing. It would win the White Sox an extra year of Kopech and probably piss off every pitcher in the system.

I’m not sure I agree here.  If the Sox go out and add a pair of free agent starters, it’s easy to argue that they’re trying to compete right out of the gate and have Kopech work through his rust in games that don’t matter.

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Just now, Chicago White Sox said:

I’m not sure I agree here.  If the Sox go out and add a pair of free agent starters, it’s easy to argue that they’re trying to compete right out of the gate and have Kopech work through his rust in games that don’t matter.

Okay, but they could just as easily do that while he's on the IL for a rehab assignment.

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1 minute ago, TomPickle said:

Okay, but they could just as easily do that while he's on the IL for a rehab assignment.

But don’t rehab assignments have max durations?  Just read something that said it was like 30 days for pitchers.  I don’t disagree that it would get some criticism, but I don’t think it’s totally unethical if the goal is to win in 2020.

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1 hour ago, OneDog847 said:

How can the Sox plan to have a healthy staff at the beginning of 2020? The only guys that you can pencil into the starting rotation for 2020 are Giolito, Lopez, and maybe Cease. Kopech might not be ready to go come Opening Day. 

The Sox are going to have to pony up some big $ for pitching this offseason. There is no way around it. 

I never said the Sox are going to sit out the offseason.

I’m saying they need to plan to break camp with 12-13 arms that make up a playoff caliber staff and then then they will be insulated with depth when they can add Dunning and Rodon to the staff they broke camp with. 

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51 minutes ago, BigHurt3515 said:

I would think Dunning would be back middle of the year at worse. It doesn't take 15+ months to recover anymore.

Even if Dunning is back in the middle part of next year, he has a grand total of 62 innings above A-ball and basically hasn't pitched since mid-2018. You might think about calling him up at the end of the year if you're in a pennant race and desperate for arms and he's performing well, but he wasn't a ready big leaguer when he got hurt so there's no reason to think the injury will make him suddenly better prepared to be a big leaguer, so no we shouldn't even be talking about him as a useful piece next year.

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1 hour ago, OneDog847 said:

I'm highly skeptical that Kopech will ready to go on opening day 2020. Zach Burdi is almost two years removed from Tommy John and the guy can barely pitch more than two innings a week. 

 

Kopech is the only guy who will be back from TJ in 2020. I don't think Dunning or Rodon will be able to go until 2021. 

 

Dunning will be ready to pitch in 2020. I don't know if it will be at the MLB level.

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2 hours ago, HOFHurt35 said:

It's almost certain he will be on some sort of pitch / inning restriction.   And also, we really should be anticipating command issues and frustrations throughout the year.

The Sox better be anticipating their 2020 plans with Kopech being nothing more than a 5th starter.  Problem is, Lopez should also be looked at as nothing more than a 5th starter. 

They better think big, and I mean HUGE, in free agency.   Yes, Garret Cole.  

Early on, especially in spring training and April/May? Sure. 

Outside of missing the time, there's nothing with TJ which should result in command issues. He should actually start bullpens relatively soon. That and spring training will be for "shaking the rust off". Saying he should be viewed as a 5th starter is silly, I'm sorry to say. 

Outside of missing the full year - Tommy John is essentially a non-issue for pitchers these days once they've completed rehab. The surgery and recovery is truly phenomenal. 

Edited by Richie

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2 hours ago, OneDog847 said:

I'm highly skeptical that Kopech will ready to go on opening day 2020. Zach Burdi is almost two years removed from Tommy John and the guy can barely pitch more than two innings a week. 

 That would seem to be an outlying example and not the norm. 

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12 minutes ago, Richie said:

In his first handful of outings, especially in spring training? Sure. However, it should be all systems go after that period of time. 

Outside of missing the time, there's nothing with TJ which should result in command issues. He should actually start bullpens relatively soon. That and spring training will be for "shaking the rust off". Saying he should be viewed as a 5th starter is silly, I'm sorry to say. 

Outside of missing the full year - Tommy John is essentially a non-issue for pitchers these days once they've completed rehab. The surgery and recovery is truly phenomenal. 

It has less to do with the recovery than it has to do with still Kopech ultimately being an unknown, PLUS coming off surgery. Let's say Kopech came into 2019 healthy. If the Sox had designs of competing, penciling Kopech in at the number two or three spot still could be a recipe for disaster.  

Now add in, say, a 10% chance he doesn't come back right from surgery on top of all that and now competing and going into the season with Kopech as your #2 or #3 starter are likely mutually exclusive ideas.

Maybe he comes back and is immediately a horse. Well, then great. Now you have extra depth. But you absolutely cannot count on that. From a roster construction standpoint he’s a backend starter until he shows you he’s not. 

Edited by mqr

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3 minutes ago, Richie said:

In his first handful of outings, especially in spring training? Sure. However, it should be all systems go after that period of time. 

Outside of missing the time, there's nothing with TJ which should result in command issues. He should actually start bullpens relatively soon. That and spring training will be for "shaking the rust off". Saying he should be viewed as a 5th starter is silly, I'm sorry to say. 

Outside of missing the full year - Tommy John is essentially a non-issue for pitchers these days once they've completed rehab. The surgery and recovery is truly phenomenal. 

Most athletes will tell you it takes about 18 months to feel "normal " again after these types of surgeries. They can play as early as 9 months post surgery but it's not quite normal. They prevailing theory is that the smaller nerves can heal for roughly that amount of time.

This extra time isn't too big of a deal for an offensive lineman but for a pitcher who needs such fine detail for mechanics, it can take that long to really get going again. 

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Just now, Richie said:

 That would seem to be an outlying example and not the norm. 

Burdi could be in the 15% we can't get back to his prior level of performance. 

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