steveno89 Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 11 hours ago, GreenSox said: Fair enough (although the Sox control Bummer through 2024) but don't forget to include the person who has the most trade value: McCann. And I doubt we'll see much; they've sat out more July's than they should have and don't specialize in "selling high" I do not see how McCann can be dealt. Who is going to catch in 2020? McCann has to stay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 1 hour ago, steveno89 said: I do not see how McCann can be dealt. Who is going to catch in 2020? McCann has to stay. Grandal will be available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yesterday333 Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 9 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said: Grandal will be available. Couldn't you wait until the offseason after we sign Grandal to trade McCann? Why risk Grandal not signing with us? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 1 minute ago, yesterday333 said: Couldn't you wait until the offseason after we sign Grandal to trade McCann? Why risk Grandal not signing with us? I am not really advoating for trading McCann, to be clear. Though I would definitely trade him without much hesitation if someone made a compelling offer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveno89 Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 16 hours ago, greg775 said: For some reason I get so mad when somebody wants to free up cash. Why in the hell did Hahn throw away so much money on Alonso and Nova and even Jon Jay. Jerry's wealth irritates me. By free up cash, I mean we could potentially allocate the $15 million or so an Abreu extension might cost to other player(s). I love what Abreu has brought to the organization, but I do not love the idea of paying retail to an aging slugger. The fanbase needs to be prepared for the front office to not be emotional about Abreu and to go in a different direction. His production has declined, and I wouldn't give him more than a one year deal at this stage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 17 minutes ago, steveno89 said: By free up cash, I mean we could potentially allocate the $15 million or so an Abreu extension might cost to other player(s). I love what Abreu has brought to the organization, but I do not love the idea of paying retail to an aging slugger. The fanbase needs to be prepared for the front office to not be emotional about Abreu and to go in a different direction. His production has declined, and I wouldn't give him more than a one year deal at this stage. with regards to the bolded, the Sox have stated a number of times that they plan to retain Jose. I see very little reason to believe he won't be on the Sox next year. I hope the Sox are not emotional about the decision making and tell Jose he'd be lucky to get a 1 year / $10M deal on the open market. But I also don't expect them to be too harsh. 2/$18M, maybe with a $10M team option for third year seems like a fine compromise. I too would prefer just a $8-10M 1 year deal with a team option, but at that point Jose probably elects to looks around. I think the Sox could do a lot worse than having Jose around another season or two if the AAV isn't too far over $10M. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 2 hours ago, steveno89 said: By free up cash, I mean we could potentially allocate the $15 million or so an Abreu extension might cost to other player(s). I love what Abreu has brought to the organization, but I do not love the idea of paying retail to an aging slugger. The fanbase needs to be prepared for the front office to not be emotional about Abreu and to go in a different direction. His production has declined, and I wouldn't give him more than a one year deal at this stage. I know what you mean but at least tell me you are furious at them for paying Alonso what they did and that hack pitcher from the Pirates Nova and Jon Jay. It seems to me our fans just love saving Jerry money so he can continue to live the rich life. Because of their ill regard for money I want Jose to get as much cash as he can from our ill guided front office and owner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, ChiSox59 said: I am not really advoating for trading McCann, to be clear. Though I would definitely trade him without much hesitation if someone made a compelling offer. Do smart baseball people really think McCann is going to bring the Sox a haul? Let's hear specifics. Do any teams need immediate help at catcher? To me it seems the haul received for McCann will not be that heavy. I think the only tradeable guys to receive a prospect or two that could someday be useful are McCann and Colome. Edited July 18, 2019 by greg775 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 The only chance of the Sox getting anything at the deadline is to package Bummer and Colome. Nobody's giving you anything for Abreu and McCann that makes them worth trading. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 (edited) His last 15 games, McCann is down to a 563 OPS, 8/40 in the month of July. Prior to that, 966, 886, 863 over his first three months, pretty remarkable consistency. 2.0 fWAR, on pace for 3.2-3.5 but falling off now. Edited July 18, 2019 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 2 hours ago, Jack Parkman said: The only chance of the Sox getting anything at the deadline is to package Bummer and Colome. Nobody's giving you anything for Abreu and McCann that makes them worth trading. Jack, what's your take on Bummer? Nobody's really commented on my repetitive take that Bummer will NOT be dealt. He's a perfect White Sox to the front office right now. Young, very cheap and with team control for a long time. There's no way in hell they'll flip him. I thought this was one of my better takes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 (edited) 20 minutes ago, greg775 said: Jack, what's your take on Bummer? Nobody's really commented on my repetitive take that Bummer will NOT be dealt. He's a perfect White Sox to the front office right now. Young, very cheap and with team control for a long time. There's no way in hell they'll flip him. I thought this was one of my better takes. My opinion is that you always trade relievers having a good season when there is a less than 50/50 chance of making the playoffs. I believe this regardless of team control. Relievers are so volatile from season to season, that you can't count on Bummer ever having a year this good again. My belief is relievers are always short term pieces and never long term pieces. It doesn't matter what I think of him. He should be traded. He's more valuable to a playoff team than to the Sox. Edited July 18, 2019 by Jack Parkman 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenSox Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 There is a good argument for trading all of these guys, but they can't come back with a bunch of Gillaspies and Medeiros' either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poppysox Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 9 hours ago, steveno89 said: I do not see how McCann can be dealt. Who is going to catch in 2020? McCann has to stay. Keep McCann and make an attempt to get Grandal. Two good catchers is better than one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSpalehoseCWS Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 3 hours ago, poppysox said: Keep McCann and make an attempt to get Grandal. Two good catchers is better than one. I was going to suggest this. They also fit perfectly from a platoon standpoint too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hi8is Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 Charlie Tilson is the correct answer... always. So, with that said: Charlie Tilson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poppysox Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 13 hours ago, greg775 said: Jack, what's your take on Bummer? Nobody's really commented on my repetitive take that Bummer will NOT be dealt. He's a perfect White Sox to the front office right now. Young, very cheap and with team control for a long time. There's no way in hell they'll flip him. I thought this was one of my better takes. The offers will dictate who is traded out of Bummer & Colome. Anyone can be traded but good pieces don't get traded other than in good return deals. Abreu is another situation. We either extend him or trade him in the next two weeks. If you don't extend or trade Abreu you end up with nothing after the season. I certainly don't think the FO is giving Jose a qualifying offer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 Should the Abreu/Sawx rumor get its own thread? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenSox Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 (edited) On 7/19/2019 at 6:55 AM, poppysox said: The offers will dictate who is traded out of Bummer & Colome. Anyone can be traded but good pieces don't get traded other than in good return deals. Abreu is another situation. We either extend him or trade him in the next two weeks. If you don't extend or trade Abreu you end up with nothing after the season. I certainly don't think the FO is giving Jose a qualifying offer. I think it will be trade or nothing and probably nothing. I don't think that they've ever planned on re-signing him and nothing I've seen from Abreu this season would warrant reconsideration of that. He hasn't hit much since the break. Is there some legit Boston rumor? Edited July 20, 2019 by GreenSox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 Sox should be looking to trade for Mike Leake or Matt Boyd IMO, even if it means giving up a few guys ranked 10-20 in the system and perhaps Leury. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 1 minute ago, chitownsportsfan said: Sox should be looking to trade for Mike Leake or Matt Boyd IMO, even if it means giving up a few guys ranked 10-20 in the system and perhaps Leury. Matt Boyd is going to cost a lot more than a few guys in the 10 to 20 range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: Matt Boyd is going to cost a lot more than a few guys in the 10 to 20 range. You're probably right which is why I'd target Leake. According to that link interest is low. Leake is owed some money and the Sox won't have to give up much of anything to get him. I'd assume that one of Rutherford or Basabe + an A ball lotto ticket would get it done. That might even be too much depending on how much salary the Mariners want to eat. Leake would slot in nicely as the 3rd or 4th starter the next two years. Gio/Kopech/Leake/Cease/Rodon/Lopez/Dunning Sign a FA like Cole and that rotation can kick one of Rodon/Lopez/Dunning to the curb or bullpen and things really are looking up. Edited July 20, 2019 by chitownsportsfan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 (edited) 57 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said: You're probably right which is why I'd target Leake. According to that link interest is low. Leake is owed some money and the Sox won't have to give up much of anything to get him. I'd assume that one of Rutherford or Basabe + an A ball lotto ticket would get it done. That might even be too much depending on how much salary the Mariners want to eat. Leake would slot in nicely as the 3rd or 4th starter the next two years. Gio/Kopech/Leake/Cease/Rodon/Lopez/Dunning Sign a FA like Cole and that rotation can kick one of Rodon/Lopez/Dunning to the curb or bullpen and things really are looking up. I've been on the Leake bandwagon for a while. Believe he has a NTC though. Plug him into the back of the rotation. Sign Cole in the off-season and go with Cole, Giolito, Cease, Leake, Lopez to open the year while Kopech rehabs in the minors. Evaluate if Lopez needs to go start in Triple-A or see how he does out of the pen when Kopech comes up. Edited July 20, 2019 by soxfan2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenSox Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 (edited) They Sox don't need to trade prospects for veteran pitchers....that's what they did from 2014-16, and sporadically from 2001-2012 and it has a 100% failure rate. 100%. The only time it arguably worked was the rent of Garcia for 1 year; but the rent wasn't the win..... signing him as a FA was the win. That's what the Sox need to do. And if you are going to do it, you certainly don't do it in July. Or trade prospects for pitching prospects (perhaps closer to the majors prospects). I'm not convinced trading guys like Bummer or Fry is really in order. Yes relievers are volatile, but that's mostly true with the older guys. These guys, esp Bummer, haven't reached their peak and we don't know what they have. Based on prior returns, it's not really worth it. Edited July 21, 2019 by GreenSox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 1 hour ago, GreenSox said: They Sox don't need to trade prospects for veteran pitchers....that's what they did from 2014-16, and sporadically from 2001-2012 and it has a 100% failure rate. 100%. The only time it arguably worked was the rent of Garcia for 1 year; but the rent wasn't the win..... signing him as a FA was the win. That's what the Sox need to do. And if you are going to do it, you certainly don't do it in July. Or trade prospects for pitching prospects (perhaps closer to the majors prospects). I'm not convinced trading guys like Bummer or Fry is really in order. Yes relievers are volatile, but that's mostly true with the older guys. These guys, esp Bummer, haven't reached their peak and we don't know what they have. Based on prior returns, it's not really worth it. They are not going to trade Bummer just because he is a reliever and fans think relievers are a dime a dozen. The guy is everything the White Sox stand for: young, controllable, affordable, cheap right now and has been effective. He's the kind of guy they are trying to acquire. Young players. Now Colome will be traded. Not Bummer tho. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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