Chicago White Sox Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 So @ChiSox59 recently put together an excellent offseason plan that really got me excited and made it clear to me just how important landing Gerrit Cole is. He without question would fill our biggest hole, which is a durable, proven ace that can anchor our young pitching and lead a postseason charge. Yes, we could find other arms to help anchor the staff, but they are unlikely to be as dominant as Cole should be over the course of our window. Imagine a staff built around Cole, Giolito, Kopech, & Cease. While we have the financial flexibility available that’s what we should be shooting for. Now for the hard part. I have been and remain somewhat skeptical they can get this done. IMO, Cole should garner close to the largest contract in baseball history for a pitcher. That would be put him somewhere around 7/$210M if I had to guess. To me, the dollars are not the problem as we literally just offered Machado $250M and can easily afford to pay this guy $30M/year. No, the real concern is the number of years and Reinsdorf’s general risk aversion to pitching. The longest non pre-arb deal we’ve ever given out to a pitcher is the five year commitment we made to John Danks and that ended badly for us. So here’s my question, can Hahn & KW convince Jerry that this is the ultimate finishing move to the rebuild and one that would put us in a tremendous spot to win a World Series? Hahn has claimed multiple times these past few years that many of the pre-conceived notions of the organization are slowly being wiped away (would never rebuild, would never trade with the Cubs, would never go into the LatAm penalty box). The biggest one remaining is signing a stud free agent and the Sox epically blew the Machado swepstakes after swinging their dicks around all offseason. Signing Cole is their chance to make up for that and it’s Jerry’s opportunity to prove once and for all that’s he’s willing to do whatever it takes to win one last World Series. What are your thoughts here? Do you think we make a serious pursuit? How far do you think we’re willing to go? Who the are biggest threats here? How much do you think he ultimately gets? Please share your thoughts and don’t just be a hater and simply say “no”. Make a case why or why not this may be possible. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerksticks Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 Well I feel like the Yankees and a few other teams can go 7/210 no problem. Why pick the Sox in that case? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harold's Leg Lift Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 Reindorf's head would explode if he gave a pitcher that much money. Plus it goes against his leagacy of suppressing player salaries. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 I’d be surprised if it got as high as 7/$210, but I guess you never know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Perfect Vision Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 I'd be surprised if he didn't get $200 million frankly. If Hahn and co. pursue Cole thinking they can get him for $150 mil, it's going to be Machado all over again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerksticks Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 8 minutes ago, Perfect Vision said: I'd be surprised if he didn't get $200 million frankly. If Hahn and co. pursue Cole thinking they can get him for $150 mil, it's going to be Machado all over again. To be fair, it can turn into $300M if he wins a few CYAs in a row Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 45 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: So @ChiSox59 recently put together an excellent offseason plan that really got me excited and made it clear to me just how important landing Gerrit Cole is. He without question would fill our biggest hole, which is a durable, proven ace that can anchor our young pitching and lead a postseason charge. Yes, we could find other arms to help anchor the staff, but they are unlikely to be as dominant as Cole should be over the course of our window. Imagine a staff built around Cole, Giolito, Kopech, & Cease. While we have the financial flexibility available that’s what we should be shooting for. Now for the hard part. I have been and remain somewhat skeptical they can get this done. IMO, Cole should garner close to the largest contract in baseball history for a pitcher. That would be put him somewhere around 7/$210M if I had to guess. To me, the dollars are not the problem as we literally just offered Machado $250M and can easily afford to pay this guy $30M/year. No, the real concern is the number of years and Reinsdorf’s general risk aversion to pitching. The longest non pre-arb deal we’ve ever given out to a pitcher is the five year commitment we made to John Danks and that ended badly for us. So here’s my question, can Hahn & KW convince Jerry that this is the ultimate finishing move to the rebuild and one that would put us in a tremendous spot to win a World Series? Hahn has claimed multiple times these past few years that many of the pre-conceived notions of the organization are slowly being wiped away (would never rebuild, would never trade with the Cubs, would never go into the LatAm penalty box). The biggest one remaining is signing a stud free agent and the Sox epically blew the Machado swepstakes after swinging their dicks around all offseason. Signing Cole is their chance to make up for that and it’s Jerry’s opportunity to prove once and for all that’s he’s willing to do whatever it takes to win one last World Series. What are your thoughts here? Do you think we make a serious pursuit? How far do you think we’re willing to go? Who the are biggest threats here? How much do you think he ultimately gets? Please share your thoughts and don’t just be a hater and simply say “no”. Make a case why or why not this may be possible. he is also a really good guy and the type you want around a clubhouse. he meets all of the intangible things people talk about. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonofaRoache Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 I put our chances of getting him or any top FA at 10 percent. I just don't think we are gonna outbid teams at that level. We can sign lower tier good players who will help, but Cole will be going to one of the big boys. We just need to hope Kopech, Cease, and Gio and be real good pitchers for us moving forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarava Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 Good post. In an ideal world, I'd want the Sox to sign Gerrit Cole, and someone else that can slot in as a #3 or #4 starter. Then let Gio, Cease and Kopech fill in the rest of the rotation. Move Lopez to the pen. The possibilities are endless. I don't think it's impossible that Cole comes here if Reinsdorf is willing to pony up the cash. The whole baseball world can see what is coming with the Sox, and I'm thinking some guys might want to be a part of it. We kind of saw the same thing with the Blackhawks and Cubs as their eventual champion teams were building up. It's gotta be a warm feeling to be a pitcher, knowing they will have guys like Moncada, Robert, Jimenez, Vaughn and Anderson putting up a lot runs for them. And while many guys love playing in New York, quite a few don't want that huge spotlight. I'm not sure where Cole would fall in that regard. The big problem is - I just can't see Reinsdorf committing $200 mil to a pitcher. To me, that's way riskier than giving Machado $300 mil, and he wouldn't do that. So while this all sounds nice, I just don't have faith in our owner. I would love to be wrong. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 (edited) I'm not sure I want to sign Cole for his price tag. I wonder how much of his success is due to the Astros pitching lab and how much is him. He was pretty mediocre his last couple seasons with the Pirates. Edited July 21, 2019 by Jack Parkman 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vote4Pedro Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 Meh...... I’d rather hope on Strasburg opting out and the Sox throwing money at him instead Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted July 21, 2019 Author Share Posted July 21, 2019 1 hour ago, Jerksticks said: Well I feel like the Yankees and a few other teams can go 7/210 no problem. Why pick the Sox in that case? Can they though? The Yankees haven’t really shown a huge willingness blow the luxury tax out of the water and I think they’ll be creeping up to it very quickly with no major additions. I show their luxury tax patroll at ~$142M for just nine players (I’m excluding the 17M owed to Chapman, as I’m assuming he opts out). Add $17.5M for benefits & minor league numbers and suddenly they’re at ~$160M vs a tax threshold out of $208M. So here’s where things get complicated. Chapman will likely opt out. Gregorius, Betances, Sabathia, Gardner, & Encarnacion are all free agents. Paxton will be getting a raise from his 2019 $8.6M figure. And most importantly, Judge & Sanchez will finally be hitting arbitration (amongst a few others). Those two plus Paxton will eat up a good chunk of the $48M they have below the tax threshold. IMO, unless the Yankees are prepared to be a serious tax payer (which they haven’t demonstrated under Hank but obviously possible), they’ll be hard pressed to resign guys and/or fill their holes plus add a guy like Cole. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southwest Sider Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 Sign me up. You can never have too much pitching, and *knock on wood* it looks like we should mostly be able to build a legit offense from within. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted July 21, 2019 Author Share Posted July 21, 2019 1 hour ago, Harold's Leg Lift said: Reindorf's head would explode if he gave a pitcher that much money. Plus it goes against his leagacy of suppressing player salaries. He’s now 83 years old, not sure suppressing player salaries is high on his to-do list at the moment. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 9 minutes ago, beckham15 said: Meh...... I’d rather hope on Strasburg opting out and the Sox throwing money at him instead Strasburg would be at least 50M cheaper and you could probably get him on a 5 year deal. Yes please. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted July 21, 2019 Author Share Posted July 21, 2019 1 hour ago, ChiSox59 said: I’d be surprised if it got as high as 7/$210, but I guess you never know. Let me ask you this, has there been a more desirable starting pitcher in recent memory? I just don’t see why he doesn’t get as much (or more) as pretty much any other starter before him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harold's Leg Lift Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 21 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: He’s now 83 years old, not sure suppressing player salaries is high on his to-do list at the moment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SonofaRoache Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 35 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: He’s now 83 years old, not sure suppressing player salaries is high on his to-do list at the moment. He was a week from 83 at the time of the Manny debacle. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted July 21, 2019 Author Share Posted July 21, 2019 54 minutes ago, Harold's Leg Lift said: You really seem to have an irrational hate of the dude. Like I’m no fan, but you to take it to another level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted July 21, 2019 Author Share Posted July 21, 2019 44 minutes ago, SonofaRoache said: He was a week from 83 at the time of the Manny debacle. Him being risk adverse or even cheap is completely different than wanting to suppress long-term salaries across the sport as Harold suggested. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 (edited) Right now, I’d put it like this... 1) Angels....from Southern Cal, pitched with Bauer at UCLA, LA would have three marketable stars in Trout, Ohtani, Cole 2) Astros...obvious reasons 3) Phillies...need another frontline starter to compete with Braves, willingness to spend (could alternatively go after Stroman, Syndegaard, Bauer, Minor, etc.) 4) Yankees...need more RHP balance, Severino’s recovery a question mark 5&6) Rangers and White Sox...Texas, because they’ll have money to spend, he’s shown that he enjoys environment in Texas and is quite comfortable there, but no pitcher wanted to deal with July/August weather although the new stadium should change that calculus White Sox or Rangers would have to offer $210-240 million over 6 years to get it done...which Reinsdorf is highly unlikely to approve for the numerous reasons discussed dating back to Jaime Navarro. Edited July 21, 2019 by caulfield12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bschmaranz Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 I'm with ya. He can be our Lester, except he's better. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poppysox Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 2 hours ago, Sarava said: Good post. In an ideal world, I'd want the Sox to sign Gerrit Cole, and someone else that can slot in as a #3 or #4 starter. Then let Gio, Cease and Kopech fill in the rest of the rotation. Move Lopez to the pen. The possibilities are endless. I don't think it's impossible that Cole comes here if Reinsdorf is willing to pony up the cash. The whole baseball world can see what is coming with the Sox, and I'm thinking some guys might want to be a part of it. We kind of saw the same thing with the Blackhawks and Cubs as their eventual champion teams were building up. It's gotta be a warm feeling to be a pitcher, knowing they will have guys like Moncada, Robert, Jimenez, Vaughn and Anderson putting up a lot runs for them. And while many guys love playing in New York, quite a few don't want that huge spotlight. I'm not sure where Cole would fall in that regard. The big problem is - I just can't see Reinsdorf committing $200 mil to a pitcher. To me, that's way riskier than giving Machado $300 mil, and he wouldn't do that. So while this all sounds nice, I just don't have faith in our owner. I would love to be wrong. We can easily afford to add $100 million per year in payroll. Even if we elect to pay a Cole type in the vicinity of $30 million per year that still leaves $70 million per year for a lesser starter, a right fielder and several very good relievers and several nice extensions. I think Jerry is prepared to spend the money but probably not all his eggs in just a couple of baskets. That's not necessarily wrong. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 1 hour ago, Chicago White Sox said: He’s now 83 years old, not sure suppressing player salaries is high on his to-do list at the moment. Lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 29 minutes ago, caulfield12 said: Right now, I’d put it like this... 1) Angels....from Southern Cal, pitched with Bauer at UCLA, LA would have three marketable stars in Trout, Ohtani, Cole 2) Astros...obvious reasons 3) Phillies...need another frontline starter to compete with Braves, willingness to spend (could alternatively go after Stroman, Syndegaard, Bauer, Minor, etc.) 4) Yankees...need more RHP balance, Severino’s recovery a question mark 5&6) Rangers and White Sox...Texas, because they’ll have money to spend, he’s shown that he enjoys environment in Texas and is quite comfortable there, but no pitcher wanted to deal with July/August weather although the new stadium should change that calculus White Sox or Rangers would have to offer $210-240 million over 6 years to get it done...which Reinsdorf is highly unlikely to approve for the numerous reasons discussed dating back to Jaime Navarro. It is Yankees 1, 2, and 3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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