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KrankinSox

Hahn expects aggressive offseason

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14 minutes ago, Juschill said:Bell was an All Star the year before joining the White Sox and received MVP votes in his first year with the White Sox.  It was a big trade at the time.

 

 

2 minutes ago, turnin' two said:

Cmon.  Bell hit 4th or 5th every game he played in 1992.  He also hit 27 2B, 25 HR and drove in 112 runs.  Comparing him to where Griffey was in his career is completely disingenuous.  

I’ll admit he was better / higher regarded at the time of the trade than I originally let on (although he wasn’t very good by modern metrics).  That being said, if we have to go back to 1992 to find a “big” Cubs-Sox trade that still reinforces my point.

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7 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Does that make you four years old, because I’m still struggling to see how Josh Donaldson wasn’t a great player.

Did you bring up a post from 6 months ago? Jesus. 

 

Hey everyone: I also didn't realize Adrian Beltre had such a great career! Make fun of me. 

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Just now, Chicago White Sox said:

 

I’ll admit he was better / higher regarded at the time of the trade than I originally let on (although he wasn’t very good by modern metrics).  That being said, if we have to go back to 1992 to find a “big” Cubs-Sox trade that still reinforces my point.

It doesn't reinforce your point. Just admit you said something that didn't make much sense. I don't think any less of you. It's not a competition. The internet is so weird. 

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2 minutes ago, Nardiwashere said:

Even if George Bell was good, that was during the damn George HW Bush administration.  What in the world are people trying to argue? That a trade 30 years ago shows that the cubs and Sox regularly make trades? Has everyone lost their minds?

Thank you...and that’s the point.  A lot of the stereotypes of the White Sox have been turned over in recent years.  

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2 minutes ago, TaylorStSox said:

Did you bring up a post from 6 months ago? Jesus. 

 

Hey everyone: I also didn't realize Adrian Beltre had such a great career! Make fun of me. 

I mean, you literally just made fun of me for not remembering George Bell was highly regarded.  Pot call kettle black?

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2 minutes ago, TaylorStSox said:

It doesn't reinforce your point. Just admit you said something that didn't make much sense. I don't think any less of you. It's not a competition. The internet is so weird. 

I actually admitted I was wrong about Bell (although I still think he sucked with us), but it really doesn’t change my point.  That move was 27 years ago and the Sox & Cubs have basically done no significant trade then until Quintana.

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1 minute ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I mean, you literally just made fun of me for not remembering George Bell was highly regarded.  Pot call kettle black?

Yeah, I made fun of you. I didn't bring up a post from 6 months ago. I also admitted I was wrong and invited people to mock me for being wrong. 

Stop trying to "win." It's weird. 

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3 minutes ago, TaylorStSox said:

It doesn't reinforce your point. Just admit you said something that didn't make much sense. I don't think any less of you. It's not a competition. The internet is so weird. 

Explain to me how It doesn’t reinforce his point? Ron Schueler was GM for like a year when he made that trade.  

200 times a day, people bring up the fact that the 2008 playoffs was so long ago... but something that happened in 1991 and then again in 1999 is proof that something happens frequently?  

 

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22 minutes ago, Nardiwashere said:

Even if George Bell was good, that was during the damn George HW Bush administration.  What in the world are people trying to argue? That a trade 30 years ago shows that the cubs and Sox regularly make trades? Has everyone lost their minds?

I think the point is that it’s not unprecedented.  They’ve made far more big trades with the Cubs than they have, say the Mets or the Dodgers.  Using a trade with the Cubs as indicative of a change in mindset is not evidence of anything.

This started with someone saying the White Sox made a trade with the Cubs, ergo everything is different.  Never happened before.  Pay no attention to that offseason cluster f*** you saw last year.  

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28 minutes ago, TaylorStSox said:

Wake me up when the Sox sign a top of the rotation starter. I'm gonna get comfortable. 

7-FC92516-81-C9-4045-8-E34-DE6-DBBB09544

Edited by Moan4Yoan

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6 minutes ago, Juschill said:

I think the point is that it’s not unprecedented.  They’ve made far more big trades with the Cubs than they have, say the Mets or the Dodgers.  Using a trade with the Cubs as indicative of a change in mindset is not evidence of anything.

This started with someone saying the White Sox made a trade with the Cubs, ergo everything is different.  Never happened before.  Pay no attention to that offseason cluster f*** you saw last year.  

The Sosa/Bell trade happened when Rick Hahn was using a fake ID in Ann Arbor.  Sosa was like 125 pounds.  He played essentially his entire career, retired, became eligible for the HOF in that time period.  Half the current players on the 25 man roster weren't even born.  

But yeah, you are correct.  The Cubs and Sox have technically made trades with each other in the past.

You've persuaded me.  I think the Sox will sign Cole to the largest contract in the history of the MLB because he did it 20+ years ago with Albert Belle.  No one can technically say Sox have never spent a ton of $ before.  Its not unprecedented.  

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35 minutes ago, TaylorStSox said:

Yeah, I made fun of you. I didn't bring up a post from 6 months ago. I also admitted I was wrong and invited people to mock me for being wrong. 

Stop trying to "win." It's weird. 

Lol...I guess I’m weird or trying to “win” for calling someone a hypocrite.

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The Sox and Cubs have made trades, but it doesn’t happen all that often.

However, it has happened more the the Sox signing top free agents to massive contracts.

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16 minutes ago, Juschill said:

I think the point is that it’s not unprecedented.  They’ve made far more big trades with the Cubs than they have, say the Mets or the Dodgers.  Using a trade with the Cubs as indicative of a change in mindset is not evidence of anything.

This started with someone saying the White Sox made a trade with the Cubs, ergo everything is different.  Never happened before.  Pay no attention to that offseason cluster f*** you saw last year.  

Come on man, it was a totally different environment back then.  And both sides have admitted to the risk of making a deal of this significance with each other. This isn’t just some random message board poster claiming this, SoxTalk’s favorite Cubs GM has said this himself.

And no, I simply said a lot of the stereotypes the Sox were known for have since been overturned in recent years.  I’ve acknowledged the clusterfuck that was the Machado miss many times on here and I’m not banking on them signing Gerrit Cole.

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Just now, Moan4Yoan said:

The Sox and Cubs have made trades, but it doesn’t happen all that often.

However, it has happened more the the Sox signing top free agents to massive contracts.

Before the Quintana deal, it was one massive signing for us and one “big” trade with the Cubs 🤷‍♂

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3 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said:

The challenge Hahn faces this offseason is the farm system is in really rough shape after you remove untouchables.  Just too many guys who regressed or got injured this year.  That puts a ton of pressure on him to fill a lot of holes via free agency.  If they’re willing to fund a league average payroll, then I think it’s doable.  But if they plan on filling major holes via trade, they’re in for a rude awakening.

Hahn has to know they have to sign free agents.  They just don't have the depth to trade many prospects. Unfortunately they couldn't/didn't get the ball rolling this week. Two years in a row he id not make a significant move at the deadline.  

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46 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Before the Quintana deal, it was one massive signing for us and one “big” trade with the Cubs 🤷‍♂

I never said “big” trades.  But I do remember Sosa for Bell, Karchner for Garland, and Cotts for Aardsma.

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Optimistically, Collins or Sheets can/could comprise 2/3rds of the DH platoon and solve part of the right handedness dominance issue...and, now that Castellanos and Puig won’t carry draft pick compensation, they both move up the charts.

 

Not sure why we didn’t go after Aaron Sanchez or Corey Dickerson...just watch, Sanchez will end up pitching like a monster for the Astros, who really distanced themselves from the rest of the American League at the deadline.  We’re so irrelevant (at this precise moment) we don’t even qualify as a trade deadline “loser” these days.

Edited by caulfield12

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The way I see it is he's going to have to pay for a lot of pitching in free agency if this team is ever going to take the next step. That's barring some sort of miracle that all our prospect pitchers, healthy and injured both, pan out to be superlative. If they stay healthy, we've got a pretty good everyday lineup starting next year with Robert and Madrigal on the big club and maybe Burger and Vaughn, too. Maybe Rutherford.

It's actually time to see if the rebuild is going to work ... if Hahn signs pitching. We know they are not going to get the big guns who will command top dollar, so he needs to sign guys who are affordable in Jerry's world.

I could see it going either way, frankly. We could start next season on paper a horrible team or start the season on paper our first contending team in the rebuild.

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Greg, Burger is a ways from even playing after almost two full seasons off...just making a major league roster someday would be cause for celebration and even a Disney movie deal.

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6 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said:

The only pitcher getting more than five years will be Cole IMO.  That means everyone else should be in our wheelhouse (see Danks deal.)

And I get people being skeptical if we’ll ever sign a guy to a $200M+ deal, but that doesn’t mean we can’t land the vast majority of free agents this offseason.  People are just so butt hurt over last offseason that they’re no longer being rational.  We’ve always had middle of the pack payrolls or better under Jerry and that isn’t going to suddenly change because we temporarily cut back on spending like all rebuilding teams do.

My worry is that Reinsdorf has seen his profits soar during the rebuild, and won't want to go back to a healthy payroll like they've had in the past. I mean, the Nate Jones salary dump trade doesn't exactly embolden me with confidence that they are ready to spend on this team.

Yes I still am butt hurt over the Machado fiasco - and honestly, we all should be. You've commented before about how they were arrogantly swinging their dick all around last winter and then did nothing. They essentially lied to us throughout the last off-season.

All I take out of his comments from Wednesday are that he's starting to swing it around again. You know the old saying, fool me once....

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8 hours ago, gusguyman said:

What an epitome of a Hahn quote. "Logical to see a heightened level of aggressiveness this offseason."

1) This doesn't even say we WILL see a more aggressive offseason, just that it would make sense to

2) Heightened level of aggressiveness is a relative term, so it only means more aggressive than last year, which could still not be close to aggressive enough in the fans eyes

The dude is a master at not actually committing to anything he sounds like he is. I'd pay a pretty penny to hear his wedding vows.

I refuse to put myself through that Hahn-spin cycle again. 

I expect nothing because it's Reinsdorf's MO.

Given his ridiculously low payroll commitments, I actually allowed myself to believe he was going to sign both Harper and Machado plus a couple of starters.

He could have done all of that and still been well under 200 million. If the fans didn't respond, he would  have certainly been justified to pull the plug.

He never gave us the chance.

That would have a been a pivotal moment in his regime and he let slip away.

He had a clear path to two future hall of famers in their prime.

Just like he was able to buy  two major market sports teams for pennies on the dollar (the only reason he owns them), the opportunity to sign two free agents of that caliber with no other big market competitors will never come again.  

It's his responsibility to put a competitive product on the field.

I owe Reinsdorf nothing in advance.

If he's not affluent enough to compete, then sell the Sox to someone who can.

Evidently that transaction should have been consummated decades ago.

Edited by GradMc
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I want Cole. It would be amazing. But I dont think we NEED him to win.

At some point into the season we should have the below team. If we add players the caliber of Bumm/Wood/Wheeler in the rotation, a RF, and a couple of set up men were fine. I would also like a Marco Gonzales type SP added. I believe RA/Jerry will make moves like these.

Rotation: Gio, Kopech, Bumm, Cease, Lopez, Gonzales (you get Rodon at some point and get a Gonzales type SP to limit the innings of Cease and Kopech)

BP: Colome, Bummer, Fry, Herrera........... add some more pieces. Do we put Rodon in the pen?

C> McCaan/Collins

1b> Vaughn/Collins

DH> Collins/FA (maybe Abreu if he accepts an extension)

2nd> Madrigal

SS> Anderson

3rd> Moncada

OF> Robert, Eloy, FA

 

At best that's a contender. At worst that will be a fun team to watch that should grow into a contender in 2021 which IMO was the year we alll should have kept an eye on anyway.

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