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Zack Wheeler: To the Phils (5yr 118); Sox had made BIGGER offer

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3 minutes ago, Chisox378 said:

Remember last season everyone was so upset we didnt spend 300 mil on a .256 hitter..... Wheeler is good, but his ERA was at 3.96 last season, there may be better options.

There are better options, we just didn't even try for them. We went after the second tier and still got beat.

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4 minutes ago, Chisox378 said:

Remember last season everyone was so upset we didnt spend 300 mil on a .256 hitter..... Wheeler is good, but his ERA was at 3.96 last season, there may be better options.

You know less than Jon Snow.

Edited by cjgalloway
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24 minutes ago, shakes said:

People are mad because they don't function like a well run org. 

If this FO doesn't deserve ire for the public mistakes they are making, when can we criticize? I want to know the rules.

The one thing they are good at is controlling media messages about how they are relevant and there is always a reason - out of their control- why they can't sign the players they are targeting. And a good portion of the fan base eats it up and carries their water. When Hahn has a track record to standby I'll cut him some slack.

👏👏👏

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11 minutes ago, mqr said:

Were does this logic stop though? 120 is already way more than 95% of people thought.

100% agree and as I said in an earlier post our offer was about 20% above what most people thought he’d get.  Hard to fault them for the miss, but that doesn’t necessarily mean we may not have been better offer throwing another $10M his way.  Just depends on what we can do with that money now.

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30 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I’m just skeptical Ryu will leave L.A. / the West Coast until he does.  He’s definitely the one fall back option that could help in the short-run.

True or that Madbum leaves the NL even though I am in the minority that he's not as bad as everyone thinks. There seems to be a huge disconnect between what we think here and how the industry is evaluating him based on the reports.

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9 minutes ago, Chisox378 said:

Remember last season everyone was so upset we didnt spend 300 mil on a .256 hitter..... Wheeler is good, but his ERA was at 3.96 last season, there may be better options.

Man I don’t know what to tell you. If that’s how you evaluate players in 2019, I can understand why most of what’s being said here seems confusing.

I don’t intend that to sound mean, so I apologize if it does. But you’re really missing close to the entire iceberg by just looking at the tip. 

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1 hour ago, Rowand44 said:

Everyone can shape this however we want but the Sox lost...again.   They're not going to be in on the top 2 because they're the White Sox and MadBum just isn't as good right now as Wheeler.  Who knows if the Rosenthal report is true but even if it is, it's going to be another huge L of an offseason but hey we tried again or something.

This reaction reminds me of the reaction of some of the Nats fans when the Nats lost out to Detroit on signing Prince Fielder.

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3 minutes ago, Eminor3rd said:

Man I don’t know what to tell you. If that’s how you evaluate players in 2019, I can understand why most of what’s being said here seems confusing.

I don’t intend that to sound mean, so I apologize if it does. But you’re really missing close to the entire iceberg by just looking at the tip. 

Ok, if you say so, time will if Im right or wrong. Lets just say so far, Im 1 for 1. 9 years left on that juicy contract.

Edited by Chisox378

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2 minutes ago, asindc said:

This reaction reminds me of the reaction of some of the Nats fans when the Nats lost out to Detroit on signing Prince Fielder.

Unfortunately it's different because nats fans had a good GM and so it was just disappointment in getting a player they liked, not the constant thrashing sox fans have of hoping that luck will align to overcome their FAs incompetence.

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Just now, bmags said:

Unfortunately it's different because nats fans had a good GM and so it was just disappointment in getting a player they liked, not the constant thrashing sox fans have of hoping that luck will align to overcome their FAs incompetence.

That and Prince Fielder had one of the worst contracts in baseball history 

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Kenny and Hahn have to be devastated. Two years in a row their top offer was rejected. This was the first haymaker landed for this rebuild. We hit the floor fellas. 

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Just now, Baron said:

That and Prince Fielder had one of the worst contracts in baseball history 

And, in a good example of why fans should stop being so terrified of everything, dombrowski got out of that contract, got ian kinsler, the rangers went on to win at least 88 games 3 of the next 4 years. 

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2 minutes ago, SonofaRoache said:

Kenny and Hahn have to be devastated. Two years in a row their top offer was rejected. This was the first haymaker landed for this rebuild. We hit the floor fellas. 

Yup, all over, pack it in. 

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31 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

First off, while the dollar figure may have been slightly more, we don't know if the present day value was more or the tax ramifications, deferred payments, which probably both offers had, or other things.  It could just be that he thinks the Phillies are closer to winning but wants to be classy. But OK, assume his fiances family is the legit reason.  And I have never said players take the most money always. Ultimately the offers were too similar to blow that off, But if you bet on it, you will win a lot more than you lose.    In fact, if you read this thread, one person mentioned geography as an issue where the Sox may have to bump their offer a bit higher. That poster was me. 

You are taking the $20 million figure someone just threw out there as gospel. I wouldn't blame the White Sox for that. But $10 million over 5 years?  Admittedly, that is a bit much too, but the price of business. If it's time to win, let's get the best horses. 

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

So people are stupid for trusting the report on why Wheeler made the decision, and you're a genius for drawing your own conclusions that insinuate the White Sox are cheap failures again. Got it.

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Just now, mqr said:

Yup, all over, pack it in. 

It's not over, but it was a big hit. You are allowed to get back up after the first few. 

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The Sox stepped up and put the money down. We just need to figure out closing and stop letting last second lurkers steal our fish. 

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7 minutes ago, bmags said:

Unfortunately it's different because nats fans had a good GM and so it was just disappointment in getting a player they liked, not the constant thrashing sox fans have of hoping that luck will align to overcome their FAs incompetence.

Haven't spent much time over at wnff.net before this year, have you?: https://www.wnff.net/index.php?topic=20772.0

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One thing the white sox should learn is they need to stop worrying about "negotiating against yourselves". That is what all the smart business posters say and the sox say and everyone knows. But I'd bet if they were comfortable with 120 and dropped it earlier wheeler they'd have been more likely to sign.

There was a retrospective today on the dodgers failed bid to re-sign greinke. They had one number and dbacks dropped the hammer at like $50 mill more and he signed. If it had been a gradual one bid over the other, who knows.

The sox let everyone know they'll match...they may try to beat it, but they have to play the game where they need another offer to play ball. Because the worst thing they could do is negotiate against themselves.

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6 minutes ago, bmags said:

And, in a good example of why fans should stop being so terrified of everything, dombrowski got out of that contract, got ian kinsler, the rangers went on to win at least 88 games 3 of the next 4 years. 

Are you saying paying Prince Fielder that much worked out well for Detroit and then Texas?

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1 minute ago, asindc said:

Haven't spent much time over at wnff.net before this year, have you?: https://www.wnff.net/index.php?topic=20772.0

oh wow a forum post from 2010 before they even had stras and harper and were about to make their first wild card, before he had signed some of the best free agent deals of the decade and then stole trea turner. 

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Just now, bmags said:

One thing the white sox should learn is they need to stop worrying about "negotiating against yourselves". That is what all the smart business posters say and the sox say and everyone knows. But I'd bet if they were comfortable with 120 and dropped it earlier wheeler they'd have been more likely to sign.

There was a retrospective today on the dodgers failed bid to re-sign greinke. They had one number and dbacks dropped the hammer at like $50 mill more and he signed. If it had been a gradual one bid over the other, who knows.

The sox let everyone know they'll match...they may try to beat it, but they have to play the game where they need another offer to play ball. Because the worst thing they could do is negotiate against themselves.

Why?

Again with this E-Bay, buy-it-now, auction stuff.

The Sox came out with a big offer, yet people are still critical and said it should have been bigger?

No one presents their absolute top offer in any negotiation at the start; that would be terrible negotiating. 

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