Sleepy Harold Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 It's official 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 Details a little different than first reported. 4th year is a $20M club option with a $1.5M buyout - not a vesting option. First three years are $18M. not $18.25M. Same $55.5M guarantee though with the buyout. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitown87 Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 (edited) That's a better deal than we thought, right? No need to worry about manipulating innings if he underperforms or is borderline. Just buy him out of the final year for $1.5 mil Edited December 30, 2019 by chitown87 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daggins Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 So maybe the holdup wasn't roster manipulation or the holidays but that the finer points of the deal were just being haggled. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 1 minute ago, chitown87 said: That's a better deal than we thought, right? No need to worry about manipulating innings if he underperforms or is borderline. Just buy him out of the final year for $1.5 mil Significantly better. The negative nancies were all basically calling it a 4 year deal because they read the vesting option as 160 innings combined over 21 and 22. Club option is obviously best case scenario for the Sox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 1 minute ago, daggins said: So maybe the holdup wasn't roster manipulation or the holidays but that the finer points of the deal were just being haggled. Still going to need to manipulate the roster for EE. 40 man is now full. Though Zavala and Medeiros should be easy DFAs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mqr Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 That sounds like it's not a vesting option? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdsox17 Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 This is, as stated above, a great deal. Happy that innings totals are not a part of the option. I hate the idea of the team having to manipulate that, if necessary. This is well done! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitown87 Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 4 minutes ago, mqr said: That sounds like it's not a vesting option? That's my read on it as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 12 minutes ago, chitown87 said: That's a better deal than we thought, right? No need to worry about manipulating innings if he underperforms or is borderline. Just buy him out of the final year for $1.5 mil Way better. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveno89 Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 1 minute ago, SoxAce said: Way better. Agreed^ If it's a club option it is a substantially better deal for the Sox. Keeping it to three years essentially is great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YouCanPutItOnTheBoardYES! Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 The only way it’s a 4 year deal is if Keuchel pitches well enough in the 3rd year to warrant the Sox picking up the club option. Great deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 (edited) From MLBTR: The Scott Boras client also has a fourth-year club/vesting option. Keuchel, the White Sox revealed, will earn $18MM annually, and the Sox hold a $1.5MM buyout on his 2023 option. His option will reportedly vest at $20MM if he pitches 160 innings in years two and three of the contract. Otherwise, it functions as a traditional club option. Soooo...maybe there is still some vesting component, though they could just have bad info or are still trying to incorporate in the old info. Edited December 30, 2019 by ChiSox59 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mqr Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 3 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said: From MLBTR: The Scott Boras client also has a fourth-year club/vesting option. Keuchel, the White Sox revealed, will earn $18MM annually, and the Sox hold a $1.5MM buyout on his 2023 option. His option will reportedly vest at $20MM if he pitches 160 innings in years two and three of the contract. Otherwise, it functions as a traditional club option. Soooo...maybe there is still some vesting component, though they could just have bad info or are still trying to incorporate in the old info. If he gets so bad to the point you can't have that option vest, it won't. Really don't think it's a big deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BackDoorBreach Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 4 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said: From MLBTR: The Scott Boras client also has a fourth-year club/vesting option. Keuchel, the White Sox revealed, will earn $18MM annually, and the Sox hold a $1.5MM buyout on his 2023 option. His option will reportedly vest at $20MM if he pitches 160 innings in years two and three of the contract. Otherwise, it functions as a traditional club option. Soooo...maybe there is still some vesting component, though they could just have bad info or are still trying to incorporate in the old info. A vesting option is not a club option though, so I'm going to assume the WSox twitter has it correct. Which would be a much better deal. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mqr Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 Just now, BackDoorBreach said: A vesting option is not a club option though, so I'm going to assume the WSox twitter has it correct. Which would be a much better deal. It's a vesting option that becomes a team option if it doesn't vest. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 Just now, mqr said: If he gets so bad to the point you can't have that option vest, it won't. Really don't think it's a big deal. I completely agree. Hopefully by 22, he is our clear #5 behind Gio, Cease, Kopech and whoever emerges as the 4th starter out of Lopez, Dunning, Stiever. At that point, you can easily manage his innings with skipped starts, skipping 5th starter early in the season, a quick DL stint, etc. That being said, would be nice to get clarity on if the vesting option is still in play. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Look at Ray Ray Run Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 9 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said: I completely agree. Hopefully by 22, he is our clear #5 behind Gio, Cease, Kopech and whoever emerges as the 4th starter out of Lopez, Dunning, Stiever. At that point, you can easily manage his innings with skipped starts, skipping 5th starter early in the season, a quick DL stint, etc. That being said, would be nice to get clarity on if the vesting option is still in play. Dont think it really matters. If hes so bad in year 3 that sox wouldnt pick up the option then they just throw him under 160 innings - which could still be 26-27 starts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 4 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said: Dont think it really matters. If hes so bad in year 3 that sox wouldnt pick up the option then they just throw him under 160 innings - which could still be 26-27 starts. Yah, I literally just said that Ray. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Abreu Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 51 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said: Still going to need to manipulate the roster for EE. 40 man is now full. Though Zavala and Medeiros should be easy DFAs. Medeiros was actually pretty good out of the pen as the season went on and is relatively close to MLB ready (as a reliever). I think Zavala, Covey, or Engel (assuming we sign another OF) are the clearest candidates Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiSox59 Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 7 minutes ago, Jose Abreu said: Medeiros was actually pretty good out of the pen as the season went on and is relatively close to MLB ready (as a reliever). I think Zavala, Covey, or Engel (assuming we sign another OF) are the clearest candidates There is a zero percent chance Engel is DFA'd before this season. Covey is probably safe for now as well, though he would certainly be on my short list. Zavala is probably gone for EE. Fulmer would be my next guess as he is out of options and is unlikely to last more than a week in the MLB pen, but I could see them giving him one last chance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moan4Yoan Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, ChiSox59 said: Significantly better. The negative nancies were all basically calling it a 4 year deal because they read the vesting option as 160 innings combined over 21 and 22. Club option is obviously best case scenario for the Sox. I thought it was that Keuchel had to pitch 160+ innings in each of the second and third years of the contract for the fourth year option to vest? 😐 If that was the case, it would be reasonable to think Keuchel could get the fourth year to vest unless the Sox manipulated his starts/innings. I don’t think that was being negative. Obviously, this is a much better deal than what was originally being reported. Edited December 30, 2019 by Moan4Yoan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moan4Yoan Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 59 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said: There is a zero percent chance Engel is DFA'd before this season. Covey is probably safe for now as well, though he would certainly be on my short list. Zavala is probably gone for EE. Fulmer would be my next guess as he is out of options and is unlikely to last more than a week in the MLB pen, but I could see them giving him one last chance. If the choice is Covey or Fulmer, I’d still keep Fulmer. Covey is two years older and has 150 more innings pitched of bad than Fulmer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenSox Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 (edited) Covey is the one that needs to go - he's just been awful. And it's not like he strikes out many guys either, such that there is some ray of hope. Madeiros was better as a reliever, but his numbers were still modest: 1.13 WHIP, less than a K per inning in a AA pitchers' park. And then there are the 5+ Walks per 9 innings. No reason to give up on him, but doesn't seem near ready. Engel improved last year. See if he can take another step up. I would keep Zavala around - the Sox have actually been good at developing "rosterable" catchers; these guys have trade value. Zavala may not be one of those, but I'd give him more time to find out. Keep Fulmer - no reason not to with the spin rate, K rate in AAA (13.5/9) and with Covey around. But he needs to speed up between pitches. Edited December 30, 2019 by GreenSox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted December 30, 2019 Share Posted December 30, 2019 1 hour ago, Jose Abreu said: Medeiros was actually pretty good out of the pen as the season went on and is relatively close to MLB ready (as a reliever). I think Zavala, Covey, or Engel (assuming we sign another OF) are the clearest candidates I think the most likely guys to get moved are the following: Zavala (unless we plan on trading one of McCann or Collins) Medeiros (can probably slip through waivers) Guerrero (no options remaining - may try to slip through) Fulmer (no options remaining - will likely try to trade first though) Covey (one option remaining) Ruiz (one option remaining) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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