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2 hours ago, soxfan3530 said:

Any chance they bring back Yolmer on a cheaper deal to be the 2B stopgap then utility infielder/defensive sub? 

I think they roll with Leury and Engel until Madrigal and Robert are up, backed up by guys they can send back down or easily cut.  I don't see them bringing Yolmer back for that.  There's already a bit of a roster crunch with Collins and Yolmer would only add to that.  

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I'm not sure where to put this post - not sure there is a perfect fit, so I'll throw it in here. As most are I'm super excited that our front office is finally doing something to move the needle and put this franchise in the position to compete and for the fans to have some fun at the ballpark/watching at home. So this is going to be kind of a 3 part post, mostly for my own enjoyment - I like to look back on what I wrote in the future and see if it held up. Optimistic/pessimistic/realistic views. 

 

Optimistic viewpoint: Although I've had my differences with Hahn in the past and really think he screwed up the potential to sign nice 1-2 year stop gaps to flip in the last 3 years of the rebuild. I think it was pretty obvious that the likes of Engel, Cordell, the trash at the back-end of the rotation, etc. had no shot of producing on our hopeful upcoming window. I think those years should have been spent trying to find flip candidates that MAY have produced a few more depth pieces in the minors + a few more wins and fun as a fan in 2016-2019. THAT BEING SAID - here comes the optimistic part of the paragraph - I LOVE what he has done this off season, mostly. I really love that these deals are all very meaningful in terms of output, but also reserved in the terms of duration which shouldn't block our prospects and/or future payroll flexibility when needed. i.e - i was a big proponent of signing EE or Justin Smoak this off-season and we go the more meaningful one with a 1 year deal w an option. That really allows Vaughn to take a natural path in the minors and not force him early. Also if things don't go well it allows you to be able to resign EE and move Vaughn up even slower which is nice for both this and next years major league success. Likewise, although Mazara is not the answer and I think it likely doesn't work out - you really didn't make a big commitment to him. 2020 isn't any year we're winning a WS, and although I think Mazara is Avi Garcia 2.0 (which is to say, up and down, flashes of good and bad, but more so, tantalizingly disappointing) it's at least worth the roll of the dice rather than signing up for the likes of Castanellos who although has his positives, also has warts to the point where i wouldn't want to sign up for 4/70mm or more. There's a chance Mazara figures it all out in a new situation and you have a MASHING RF or possible future DH. Gio Gonzalez is the perfect innings/veteran signing that we needed. I wasn't a huge fan of the Abreu money and extension, however I get it to a point - as long as new JR is here to play, that money shouldnt handcuff us and is really more or less paying him for his past contract... at the end of the day this game is about having fun and doing it the right way, and Abreu does just that & when i'm 70 I'll remember the decade fondly with Jose rather than the few million too much JR spent. JA should produce okay throughout the contract and i'm thankful to have him for 3 more years.  Grandal was a bit of an overpay, but again, he was the first of signings and deserved it for the risk and attitude we were setting ... also it solidifies our C position for 4 years and with a young staff this can't be understated. Which bring us to the last signing of Keuchel -- a ground ball guy, a vet AND just 3 years. I wasn't the biggest fan of Keuechel, but you have to tip your cap to just 3 years.  Hahn has done basically everything i could have hoped for without sacrificing our future which is about as perfect as one could ask. This team isn't winning it all, but it certainly is competing with the Twins and Indians for the division and we should enjoy 83-87 wins assuming a few more small deals are made. It also puts us in just a great position moving forward to go out and sign Betts or Springer next off season in RF which (call me crazy) I sincerely think will happen.. the first and last big splash of JR career. 

 

Pessimistic viewpoint: as you may been able to tell, even in the optimistic viewpoint, pessimism sneaks in, my natural state. I truly do love the EE signing and think it made a ton of sense, so i'll take that one though I'll have a different take to fit a negative take below. Gio same, not much to dislike there. Grandal? I think when you fast forward and we're paying him $18mm for the last two years of a contract and there are computerized strike zones negating a decent amount of his worth. I think he ends up a half time DH hitting .240 with 17HR we're going to be a bit disappointed we're carrying that weight during a WS push. I get the deal had to be done, but I'm not sure I really want to allocate those types of funds when you have a notoriously cheap owner. That type of money could go a long way into resigning a Moncada to an early extension or to acquiring a high salaried pitcher. Likewise Keuchel has a decent shot of hitting a 4/74mm deal.... yikes. You have a guy who doesn't have his stuff and who's FIP has been declining. The good is that he's a groundball pitcher.. the bad is Timmy Anderson while rangy, doesn't grade out very well for his profile, nor does Jose. There's very likely chance that Keuchel is just Gio Gonzalez and is getting paid much more and for many more years. For a team with not a lot of money you may have James Shields 2.0. We just seem to love to go out and get guys who are 31+ years old and seem to be on the decline. There's an argument to be made that none of these guys win you a WS, or even put you in serious contention to be more than a WC team in a BEST case scenario this year .. which is very White Sox. If you're going to win you need to get true difference makers, not has beens. You look last year and we spent $50mm on absolutely trash... save that $50mm and it pays for actual talent when needed (which is next off season). I like that we're trying to win this year, but there's an argument to be made that save that $18mm on Keuchel, that $50mm last offseason, that $12mm on EE, etc. and you have yourself $80mm to spend in 2020-21 offseason to get MEANINGFUL guys in a MEANINGFUL off season when winning the WS in a true possibility. $80mm spread out over 8 years is $10mm more to allocate towards Mookies Betts. Instead of 8/250mm offer to Betts and enjoying  Jon Jay, Nova, Herrera, EE, Keuchel, Yonder Alonso, etc during 2019 and 2020, now you have an 8/330mm offer to betts and you have the worlds best OF for the next 6-7 years. Allocation of funds are important and Hahn continues to mess that up. I'd much rather have Betts for 8 years than the likes of EE and the other trash for useless years. 

 

Realistic viewpoint: It's somewhere in the middle. Glad to see we're competing. I'm glad that this will be a fun team to watch. I was okay with taking it a bit slower than this, but I'm just as okay that we should be over .500 this year & probably playing meaningful baseball into late August. I do think we're not winning the division this year for a number of reasons, but think we'll see flashes throughout the year that will be a glimpse into what may be. I think you have an above average offense, but there is going to be some frustrating times where it's reminiscent of 2006 type years... which is to say ... you get 3 singles in a row, but no runs. I don't know about you guys, but it was frustrating at times to see Thome, Konerko, AJ, Dye to each hit singles and lumber around one base at a time, hit a decent sac fly ball and hold up at third. It was just a trudging and slow team. I think the baseball this year reverts back and you see less HR, so you're going to have innings when Abreu singles, then EE, then Grandal, then a sac fly by Eloy and no runs are scored. A strikeout by Timmy and the inning is over with zero runs & 3 hits. I just wish the middle wasn't SO one dimensional. On the flip side you'll see innings of back to back homers and back to back doubles too, so it's not to say that the 2006 team or this team is bad, quite the opposite, you just kind of have a slow trodding middle. I also think you'll see up and downs of the rookies which is more than expected as well as some frustrating times on the pitching staff with the young guys, again to be expected. So among all this excitement, I'm happy, I just think this is a 84-78 type team. Which in the end, I'll take because we're finally moving forward and this off season hasn't hamstrung us too much for next off season and beyond, so for that i'm excited. 

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8 minutes ago, aeichhor said:

 

Unless you are getting a guy like Iglesias or maybe Mercer, there aren’t many infielders that are likely to be worth nabbing over sticking with Mendick.

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6 minutes ago, Moan4Yoan said:

Unless you are getting a guy like Iglesias or maybe Mercer, there aren’t many infielders that are likely to be worth nabbing over sticking with Mendick.

Give me Harris, McHugh, & Holt and I’m feeling pretty dam good.

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Iglesias, Hudson and Cishek would be a solid, unspectacular end to the offseason. My dream trade is McCann and a higher prospect like Adolfo to Houston for James.

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1 hour ago, Mbs1969 said:

Sounds like Zobrist checks all the boxes.   His family is from Eureka as well.  Will start at 2b until Madrigal comes up. 

Are you saying this is happening?

Edited by Chicago White Sox

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On 12/22/2019 at 10:22 PM, ChiSoxJon said:

So amazing to me that a team with 0 HOFers (Frank was out) swept a team with Clemens, Pettite, Bagwell, Biggio, Oswalt, and Berkman

Keuchel isn't an ace, and he's really not even a #2 but he's a solid #3 and will probably give you more consistency than Zach Wheeler for a lot less...I'm satisfied

This team needed an innings eater that gives you a chance to win and they got it...for fair value

Hopefully Lopez proves himself this year, would be so major   Giolito, Kopech, Kuechel, Cease, Lopez, Gonzalez, Lopez, Rodon is depth I haven't seen here in a long time

He was always hitting mid-.200's which is better than what we're typically accustomed to

Not a big Mendick guy either, but it seems the FO is big on him, we'll get a bigger glimpse of him in Spring

If you were expecting anyone on a 9 digit deal that's on you

The defense of our Rfer will make or break this team...

The starting pitching and bullpen will make or break this team...

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12 hours ago, thxfrthmmrs said:

I’ve been beating the Asdrubal Cabrera drum pretty hard. He would be a perfect utility infielder off the bench.

It'll be 2020

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I would like a top reliever. The pen isn't terrible (last year they were 8th in pen WAR in the AL, so about average) but adding another 1.5-2 war too this pen would turn an average AL pen into a top5 pen.

Question is how you do it. Maybe a trade? Or sign two 1 war guys?

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16 hours ago, fathom said:

Iglesias, Hudson and Cishek would be a solid, unspectacular end to the offseason. My dream trade is McCann and a higher prospect like Adolfo to Houston for James.

Fathom, Iglesias would be interesting. Does Cincy have the depth to trade him and, if so, what do you think they would  be looking for in return?

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2 minutes ago, Saufley said:

Fathom, Iglesias would be interesting. Does Cincy have the depth to trade him and, if so, what do you think they would  be looking for in return?

Iglesias the SS, not closer

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I'd like Zobrist, Harris, and Hudson. Doesn't sound sexy but I think they'd give us tremendous value for our buck. I'd still kick the tires on Ozuna because he may fall to a prove it deal plus a good paying option year if teams aren't biting. 

 

 

Edited by SonofaRoache

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36 minutes ago, SonofaRoache said:

I'd like Zobrist, Harris, and Hudson. Doesn't sound sexy but I think they'd give us tremendous value for our buck. I'd still kick the tires on Ozuna because he may fall to a prove it deal plus a good paying option year if teams aren't biting. 

 

 

The White Sox won’t forfeit the 49th pick on a short term commitment. Ozuna might be in some trouble. 

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