Castellanos to Reds , rumored 4/64M

[Steve9347]

Castellanos reminds me too much of JD Martinez before Detroit moved him. If you can get him, you do it. Could be a complete monster in a lineup of complete monsters. 

[Sarava]

3 minutes ago, Steve9347 said:

Castellanos reminds me too much of JD Martinez before Detroit moved him. If you can get him, you do it. Could be a complete monster in a lineup of complete monsters. 

I feel this way a bit as well. In fact I was thinking exactly of JD Martinez.

[Dick Allen]

20 minutes ago, Wisebri224 said:

I agree with this. EE gives us a great lineup for year 1 of “we have arrived”. Have the extra flexibility for the trade deadline or next offseason when we know what we have a bit more

I just think there are too many question marks to lock into NC. EE on the other hand gives you a year, then you see what you have in your prize losing 100 games in Vaughn, and although doubtful,  maybe go after someone like Betts. It looks like most of the big boys won’t be looking for $250 million OFs next year.

[Vote4Pedro]

5 minutes ago, Steve9347 said:

Castellanos reminds me too much of JD Martinez before Detroit moved him. If you can get him, you do it. Could be a complete monster in a lineup of complete monsters. 

I’ve heard this from a few different people. The potential his bat brings to the table would make this offense just so damn good. Not a knock on EE but man he could be something special in our lineup for a few years vs 1 season of EE

Edited December 23, 2019 by HahnsKiddieTable

[Jack Parkman]

6 minutes ago, Steve9347 said:

Castellanos reminds me too much of JD Martinez before Detroit moved him. If you can get him, you do it. Could be a complete monster in a lineup of complete monsters. 

What pitcher are you trading Vaughn for if you sign Castellanos?

 

Edited December 23, 2019 by Jack Parkman

[Sox80]

2 hours ago, soxfan2014 said:

He would definitely make more sense if they didn't stupidly sign Abreu to that extension. 

Bingo! I was going to post the same thing. And I like Abreu.  Just not for 3 years at that price. They definitely bid against themselves on that deal. 

[fathom]

3 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

What pitcher are you trading Vaughn for if you sign Castellanos?

 

Clearly sox (and other teams) feel he can competently play RF.

[Moan4Yoan]

3 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

I just think there are too many question marks to lock into NC. EE on the other hand gives you a year, then you see what you have in your prize losing 100 games in Vaughn, and although doubtful,  maybe go after someone like Betts. It looks like most of the big boys won’t be looking for $250 million OFs next year.

There are a lot of options.  If you sign Castellanos and Mazara is mediocre or bad, you can just non-tender Mazara and keep Castellanos in RF and still have room at DH/1B for Vaughn.  I just don’t believe the Sox will have any shot at Betts or Springer.

[YouCanPutItOnTheBoardYES!]

6 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

What pitcher are you trading Vaughn for if you sign Castellanos?

 

Blake Snell 

[Jack Parkman]

4 minutes ago, Sox80 said:

Bingo! I was going to post the same thing. And I like Abreu.  Just not for 3 years at that price. They definitely bid against themselves on that deal. 

Anyone who doesn't understand that Abreu's contract is more about the long game with Moncada and Robert rather than Abreu himself is just b****ing to b****. 

Edited December 23, 2019 by Jack Parkman

[Vote4Pedro]

2 minutes ago, fathom said:

Clearly sox (and other teams) feel he can competently play RF.

NL teams as well....Cubs, Diamondbacks, Cards have all been rumored to be interested in him

[Sarava]

7 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

What pitcher are you trading Vaughn for if you sign Castellanos?

 

Clevinger? Seriously, you worry about Vaughn and how or where he fits a year from now - if he is ready for the show at that point. It's a non issue in 2020.

[HOFHurt35]

9 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

Anyone who doesn't understand that Abreu's contract is more about the long game with Moncada and Robert rather than Abreu himself is just b****ing to b****. 

Seriously.  We need to get passed this.  

[South Side Fireworks Man]

22 minutes ago, Steve9347 said:

Castellanos reminds me too much of JD Martinez before Detroit moved him. If you can get him, you do it. Could be a complete monster in a lineup of complete monsters. 

 

17 minutes ago, HahnsKiddieTable said:

I’ve heard this from a few different people. The potential his bat brings to the table would make this offense just so damn good. Not a knock on EE but man he could be something special in our lineup for a few years vs 1 season of EE

 

13 minutes ago, fathom said:

Clearly sox (and other teams) feel he can competently play RF.

Screw it, just get both of them then.  EE is clearly the better hitter so you sign him as primary DH for one year.  Castellanos is your regular RFer.  That leaves you a little light on LH bats in the starting lineup, but you have Mazara and Collins coming off the bench as LH hitters.

We know JR and the Sox are never going to spend 300 million dollars on top tier elite FAs, but maybe they will be willing to spend some money on moves like this.  EE's money will be off the books after one year, and Castellanos's contract shouldn't be too large to be a real albatross, and he'll also be off the books when it's time to extend some of the core guys.

I say be a little bold for once and make a splash by signing both.

 

[soxfan49]

33 minutes ago, Steve9347 said:

Castellanos reminds me too much of JD Martinez before Detroit moved him. If you can get him, you do it. Could be a complete monster in a lineup of complete monsters. 

I literally came in here to say this same thing.

Castellanos was awesome after the Cubs got him.

[Sox80]

19 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

Anyone who doesn't understand that Abreu's contract is more about the long game with Moncada and Robert rather than Abreu himself is just b****ing to b****. 

I completely understand what you're saying.  Just my opinion.  I can have one without b***ing to b***.

[caulfield12]

Now the board has gone too far back to drinking the Kool Aid.   We need to find a happy medium until they prove they can at least put together a contender in reality and not just on paper.   Everything certainly looks and feels much better than a year ago, no argument about that. 

There's finally real optimism and a light at the end of a long tunnel of midnight black. 

[Lillian]

4 hours ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

We have people talking about trading Mazara for a RP. This isn't the NBA; the Sox didn't trade for Mazara in hopes of flipping him a week later. 

Sox fans seem uncomfortable accepting Mazara as the starting RF so they've convinced themselves that there's another move there - citing Puig and now Castellanos.

The Sox traded for Mazara to be their every day RF'er; this is why I don't really even buy the Castellanos rumor. It just doesn't make a lot of sense. If they wanted Castellanos, why not just keep Steele Walker and not trade for Mazara? 

Finally, a rational post. Thank you. Regarding Collins, I contend that there is still room for him, if he can become a serviceable catcher. I doubt that McCann comes back for the 2021 season, when he reaches free agency. If he has another decent year, given his work ethic and ability to help pitchers, I would think he would rather sign somewhere to be the regular catcher, rather than Grandal's back up guy. 

Edited December 24, 2019 by Lillian

[Eminor3rd]

1 hour ago, Steve9347 said:

Castellanos reminds me too much of JD Martinez before Detroit moved him. If you can get him, you do it. Could be a complete monster in a lineup of complete monsters. 

 

1 hour ago, Sarava said:

I feel this way a bit as well. In fact I was thinking exactly of JD Martinez.

What? Tigers JD Martinez was WAY better than Castellanos, in a WAY worse offensive environment. Go look at the numbers.

https://www.fangraphs.com/players/jd-martinez/6184/stats?position=OF

https://www.fangraphs.com/players/nicholas-castellanos/11737/stats?position=3B/OF

EDIT: The guy is basically Billy Butler

https://www.fangraphs.com/players/billy-butler/7399/stats?position=1B/DH

 

Edited December 24, 2019 by Eminor3rd

[Sarava]

4 minutes ago, Eminor3rd said:

 

What? Tigers JD Martinez was WAY better than Castellanos, in a WAY worse offensive environment. Go look at the numbers.

https://www.fangraphs.com/players/jd-martinez/6184/stats?position=OF

https://www.fangraphs.com/players/nicholas-castellanos/11737/stats?position=3B/OF

JD is 5 years older than Nick.  Compare Nicks's last 2 seasons with JD from 2014 and 2015 and I think there's some similarities. Maybe he will be more of a doubles guy than a HR guy, and frankly if you insert that in to the Sox lineup, that is just fine with me.

[Sarava]

But that brings up an interesting point. Look at JD's power in 2017, when he spent the first half season in Detroit, then the latter half in Arizona.

DET - 16 HR's in 200 AB's

ARI - 29 HR's in 232 AB's

That goes along with Castellanos' power surge when he left Detroit last year.

DET - 11 HR's in 403 AB's

CUBS - 16 HR's in 212 AB's

[Eminor3rd]

7 minutes ago, Sarava said:

But that brings up an interesting point. Look at JD's power in 2017, when he spent the first half season in Detroit, then the latter half in Arizona.

DET - 16 HR's in 200 AB's

ARI - 29 HR's in 232 AB's

That goes along with Castellanos' power surge when he left Detroit last year.

DET - 11 HR's in 403 AB's

CUBS - 16 HR's in 212 AB's

Wait.

JD Martinez hit 29 homers in 232 ABs, an increase of nearly 100%.

Castellanos hit 16 homers in 212 ABs, and increase of less than 50%, in a year when FOUR teams broke the all-time homerun record at the same time, where the ball is juiced to the point that the MLB is practically lawyering up to deny involvement, the most bonkers homerun year EVER, including the steroid era.

Even OUTSIDE of context, that's TWICE as many homers. It's not even close. When you consider the jucied ball, it's way worse. He had a 167 wRC+ that year -- Castellanos just had a 128 wRC+. Plus, two years prior, in Martinez's most recent full/healthy season, he hit 38 bombs, all while playing for Detroit.

How is that comparable? Martinez was two tiers better than Castellanos. 

Edited December 24, 2019 by Eminor3rd

[caulfield12]

8 minutes ago, Sarava said:

But that brings up an interesting point. Look at JD's power in 2017, when he spent the first half season in Detroit, then the latter half in Arizona.

DET - 16 HR's in 200 AB's

ARI - 29 HR's in 232 AB's

That goes along with Castellanos' power surge when he left Detroit last year.

DET - 11 HR's in 403 AB's

CUBS - 16 HR's in 212 AB's

The problem is we're probably looking at peak Castellanos...and paying a premium price, when we can't be sure if will settle in at somewhere between Cubs' Castellanos and Billy Butler at his peak.  

Perhaps it's just human nature to be at least a little skeptical of players that hit their peak the year before getting a huge payday in free agency.

That outcome (Butler-esque, but at least able to play in the outfield) is still much more likely than him becoming another JD Martinez.

[caulfield12]

3 minutes ago, Eminor3rd said:

Wait.

JD Martinez hit 29 homers in 232 ABs, an increase of nearly 100%.

Castellanos hit 16 homers in 212 ABs, and increase of less than 50%, in a year when FOUR teams broke the all-time homerun record at the same time, where the ball is juiced to the point that the MLB is practically lawyering up to deny involvement, the most bonkers homerun year EVER, including the steroid era.

Even OUTSIDE of context, that's TWICE as many homers. It's not even close. When you consider the jucied ball, it's way worse. He had a 167 wRC+ that year -- Castellanos just had a 128 wRC+. Plus, two years prior, in Martinez's most recent full/healthy season, he hit 38 bombs, all while playing for Detroit.

How is that comparable? Martinez was two tiers better than Castellanos. 

You just hit on yet another concern here...if they change the baseballs again, we're MUCH better off relying on the proven power of an Encarnacion over the more suspect power increase from Castellanos, if you look at his historical numbers.   If you look closely into launch angle and flight path, he has always been more of a doubles/gap hitter than a 30+ homer guy.

[Sarava]

1 minute ago, Eminor3rd said:

Wait.

JD Martinez hit 29 homers in 232 ABs, an increase of nearly 100%.

Castellanos hit 16 homers in 212 ABs, and increase of less than 50%, in a year when FOUR teams broke the all-time homerun record at the same time, where the ball is juiced to the point that the MLB is practically lawyering up to deny involvement, the most bonkers homerun year EVER, including the steroid era.

Even OUTSIDE of context, that's TWICE as many homers. It's not even close. He had a 167 wRC+ that year -- Castellanos just had a 128 wRC+. Plus, two years prior, in Martinez's most recent full/healthy season, he hit 38 bombs, all while playing for Detroit.

How is that comparable? Martinez was two tiers better than Castellanos. 

Alright let's clear one thing up. I don't think anyone is saying he is as good of a hitter as JD. he's not. It was that there's potential similarities of 2 guys that left Detroit, and possibility went on to bigger and better things.

Second - your math is off. Castellanos had a lot more at-bats in Detroit than Chicago. Almost twice as many - yet he still hit more HR's than in Detroit. In Detroit he hit one HR every 36.6 at-bats. In Chicago he hit one HR every 13.25 at bats. That's almost trippling his rate in Detroit.

And finally - as I said, he doesn't at this point (probably ever) have the power that JD has. But he hits a shit-ton iof doubles, which would be amazing in our lineup.