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COVID-19/Coronavirus thread

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13 hours ago, greg775 said:

I think you guys are insane (I say that in a kind way). For some reason I'm supposed to be perfect. Heaven help me cause I moaned and groaned about not being able to get a haircut when my guy, the barber, had a pristine shop and was willing to work with government to make sure everybody saw it was totally safe/clean. I don't know why I'm supposed to be perfect.

Hmmm ... Pelosi today caught getting haircut and blowdry indoor salon breaking the rules in SF. ... Lori Lightfoot got haircut in Chicago at time nobody else could. And greg is bad? Crickets.

G7 once again your buddy Tex is here to explain it.  If those ladies posted here we'd be discussing their hair habits as well. But they don't. We have you. You have pulled that hole card and you're working it like a stripper and his pole. No one else grabbed the salon card, they grabbed scissors and clippers. Once again this is why we need you. Nanc and Lori won't respond and keep the discussing going like you will. And bless your heart for it. 

We don't want you to be perfect. We need your quirky ways. We need you to be that slightly odd friend you don't know why is hanging out but you don't want him to leave. Yes, everyone makes fun of him when he's not there, but you'd miss him if he stopped hanging out. 

Greg isn't bad, Greg is great. You represent every salon going runway model with great hair. You are the lone voice sticking up for the Nancy and Loris of the world who need great hair. We salute you G7!

Edited by Texsox
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13 hours ago, greg775 said:

I think you guys are insane (I say that in a kind way). For some reason I'm supposed to be perfect. Heaven help me cause I moaned and groaned about not being able to get a haircut when my guy, the barber, had a pristine shop and was willing to work with government to make sure everybody saw it was totally safe/clean. I don't know why I'm supposed to be perfect.

Hmmm ... Pelosi today caught getting haircut and blowdry indoor salon breaking the rules in SF. ... Lori Lightfoot got haircut in Chicago at time nobody else could. And greg is bad? Crickets.

We're all different people, so I won't keep going back and forth on this because i know it's not going to change anything. But i grew up in a family that kind of closely mirrors how you phrase/talk (as much as you can assume on a message board right?). If something is out of your control, just  make the best of it that you can. 

Simply put the bad things always happen to the same people and good things always happen to the same people, when in reality, the same things are happening to everybody. Life is what you make of it.

 

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A few not-good-news studies on longer term heart impacts

 

Quote

COVID-19 Can Wreck Your Heart, Even if You Haven’t Had Any Symptoms

A growing body of research is raising concerns about the cardiac consequences of the coronavirus

By Carolyn Barber on August 31, 2020

Beyond its scientific backing, the notion that a COVID-19 patient might wind up with long-term lung scarring or breathing issues has the ring of truth. After all, we hear the stories, right? The virus can leave survivors explaining how they struggled to breathe, or how it can feel, in the words of actress Alyssa Milano, “like an elephant is sitting on my chest.”

We’ve also known for a while that some COVID-19 patients’ hearts are taking a beating, too—but over the past few weeks, the evidence has strengthened that cardiac damage can happen even among people who have never displayed symptoms of coronavirus infection. And these frightening findings help explain why college and professional sports leagues are proceeding with special caution as they make decisions about whether or not to play.

From an offensive lineman at Indiana University dealing with possible heart issues to a University of Houston player opting out of the season because of “complications with my heart,” the news has been coming fast and furiously. More than a dozen athletes at Power Five conference schools have been identified as having myocardial injury following coronavirus infection, according to ESPN; two of the conferences—the Big Ten and the Pac-12—already have announced they are postponing all competitive sports until 2021. And in Major League Baseball, Boston Red Sox ace pitcher Eduardo Rodriguez told reporters that he felt “100 years old” as a result of his bout with COVID, and  of MLB’s shortened season because of myocarditis—an inflammation of the heart muscle, often triggered by a virus. Said Rodriguez: “That’s [the heart is] the most important part of your body, so when you hear that … I was kind of scared a little. Now that I know what it is, it’s still scary.”

Why are these athletes (and their leagues and conferences) taking such extreme precautions? It’s because of the stakes. Though it often resolves without incident, myocarditis can lead to severe complications such as abnormal heart rhythms, chronic heart failure and even sudden death. Just a few weeks ago, a former Florida State basketball player, Michael Ojo, died of suspected heart complications just after recovering from a bout of COVID-19 in Serbia, where he was playing pro ball.

Here’s the background: Myocarditis appears to result from the direct infection of the virus attacking the heart, or possibly as a consequence of the inflammation triggered by the body’s overly aggressive immune response. And it is not age-specific: In The Lancet, doctors recently reported on an 11-year-old child with multisystem inflammatory syndrome (MIS-C)—a rare illness—who died of myocarditis and heart failure. At autopsy, pathologists were able to identify coronavirus particles present in the child’s cardiac tissue, helping to explain the virus’ direct involvement in her death. In fact, researchers are reporting the presence of viral protein in the actual heart muscle, of six deceased patients. Of note is the fact that these patients were documented to have died of lung failure, having had neither clinical signs of heart involvement, nor a prior history of cardiac disease.

Ossama Samuel, associate chief of cardiology at Mount Sinai Beth Israel in New York, told me about a cluster of younger adults developing myocarditis, some of them a month or so after they had recovered from COVID-19. One patient, who developed myocarditis four weeks after believing he had recovered from the virus, responded to a course of steroid treatment only to develop a recurrence in the form of pericarditis (an inflammation of the sac surrounding the heart). A second patient, in her 40s, now has reduced heart function from myocarditis, and a third—an athletic man in his 40s—is experiencing recurring and dangerous ventricular heart rhythms, necessitating that he wear a LifeVest defibrillator for protection. His MRI also demonstrates fibrosis and scarring of his heart muscle, which may be permanent, and he may ultimately require placement of a permanent defibrillator.

This is an incredibly tricky diagnosis. Patients with myocarditis often experience symptoms like shortness of breath, chest pain, fever and fatigue—while some have no symptoms at all. J.N., a health care provider who asked that his full name not be used, told me that COVID-19 symptoms first appeared in his case in late March. He ultimately was hospitalized at Mount Sinai Medical Center after developing unrelenting fevers spiking to 104 degrees, chest tightness, nausea, vomiting and diarrhea.

“Even the Advil and acetaminophen wouldn’t help my fevers,” said J.N. Just 34 years old, he was diagnosed with COVID-induced myocarditis and severe heart failure. Doctors admitted him to the intensive care unit and placed him on a lifesaving intra-aortic balloon pump due to the very poor function of his heart. He spent two weeks in the hospital, has suffered recurrences since his discharge, and now says, “I’m very careful. I’m very concerned about the length of time I’ve been feeling sick, and if these symptoms are lifelong or will go away anytime soon.” J.N. said that everyday activities, like carrying his one-year-old daughter up a flight of stairs, leave him feeling winded and fatigued. He has been unable to work since March.

According to some reports, as many as 7 percent of deaths from COVID-19 may result from myocarditis. (Others feel that estimate is too high.) The arrhythmia that sometimes accompanies it is also worrisome, and researchers have found that to be fairly common among COVID-19 patients. In J.N.’s case, he noticed his heart racing on several occasions into the 130 beats per minute range. And while the prevalence of this in virus patients is not known exactly, a study found that ventricular arrhythmias occurred in 78 percent of patients without COVID-19, with up to 30 percent of them experiencing serious arrhythmias 27 months later.

Experts estimate that half of myocarditis cases resolve without a chronic complication, but several studies suggest that COVID-19 patients show signs of the condition months after contracting the virus. One non–peer reviewed study, involving 139 health care workers who developed coronavirus infection and recovered, found that about 10 weeks after their initial symptoms, 37 percent of them were diagnosed with myocarditis or myopericarditis—and fewer than half of those had showed symptoms at the time of their scans.

Any such cardiac sequelae lingering weeks to months after the fact is clearly concerning, and we’re seeing more evidence of it. A German study found that 78 percent of recovered COVID-19 patients, the majority of whom had only mild to moderate symptoms, demonstrated cardiac involvement more than two months after their initial diagnoses. Six in 10 were found to have persistent myocardial inflammation. While emphasizing that individual patients need not be nervous, lead investigator Elike Nagel added in an e-mail, “My personal take is that COVID will increase the incidence of heart failure over the next decades.”

Taking on myocarditis is a chore. Thankfully, some acute cases resolve on their own, requiring only hospital monitoring and possibly some heart medications. We’ve learned that steroids and immunoglobulins—useful elsewhere—aren’t effective in acute viral myocarditis, although Samuel said there may be a role for steroids in younger COVID-19 patients who seem to present with more of an autoimmune type of the condition. And, of course, an effective vaccine could help prevent cases in the first place.

Samuel called it “extremely dangerous” for athletes diagnosed with myocarditis to play competitive sports for at least three to six months, because of the risk of serious arrhythmia or sudden death, and several athletes already have made the decision to heed those dire warnings. We’ll likely see more such decisions in the very near future, as each sport enters its peak season.

And for the rest of us? Wear a mask, social distance, avoid large gatherings, and spend more time in the great outdoors. I would echo the advice of J.N.: “Be careful. Just don’t get the virus in the beginning.” As of today, it’s still the best defense we’ve got.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2020/07/01/coronavirus-autopsies-findings/

Coronavirus autopsies: A story of 38 brains, 87 lungs and 42 hearts

Quote

Heart cells
The next organ studied up close was the heart. One of the most frightening early reports about the coronavirus from China was that a significant percentage of hospitalized patients — up to 20 to 30 percent — appeared to have myocarditis that could lead to sudden death. The condition involves the thickening of the muscle of the heart so that it can no longer pump efficiently.

Classic myocarditis is typically easy to identify in autopsies, pathologists say. It occurs when the body perceives the tissue to be foreign and attacks it. In that situation, there would be large dead zones in the heart, and the muscle cells known as myocytes would be surrounded by infection-fighting cells known as lymphocytes. But in the autopsy samples taken so far, the dead myocytes were not surrounded by lymphocytes — leaving researchers scratching their heads.

Fowkes, from Mount Sinai, and her colleague, Clare Bryce, whose work on 25 hearts has been published online but not yet peer reviewed, said they saw some “very mild” inflammation of the surface of the heart but nothing that looked like myocarditis.

NYU Langone’s Rapkiewicz, who studied seven hearts, was struck by the abundance in the heart of rare cells called megakaryocytes. The cells, which produce platelets that control clotting, typically exist only in the bone marrow and lungs. When she went back to the lung samples from the coronavirus patients, she discovered those cells were too plentiful there, too.

“I could not remember a case before where we saw that,” she said. “It was remarkable they were in the heart.”

Vander Heide, from LSU, who reported preliminary findings on 10 patients in April and has a more in-depth paper with more case studies under review at a journal, explained that “when you look at a covid heart, you don’t see what you’d expect.”

He said a couple of patients he performed autopsies on had gone into cardiac arrest in the hospital, but when he examined them, the primary damage was in the lungs — not the heart.

 

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And an update from UIUC's testing:

https://www.news-gazette.com/coronavirus/after-uptick-in-cases-ui-stepping-up-enforcement-asking-students-to-limit-in-person-gatherings/article_a231c4bb-a380-5bba-affb-d69ca8e5ae31.html

Finding a lot of new cases initially, as was expected.

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Quote

 

URBANA — After more than 330 COVID-19 cases were found at the University of Illinois in two days, the school said it is stepping up enforcement and is asking students to limit in-person activities for the next two weeks.

“Starting today at 5 p.m., for the next two weeks for their own protection, we expect all undergraduate students to limit their in-person interactions to only the most essential activities,” Chancellor Robert Jones wrote in a mass email. "These include things like taking twice weekly COVID-19 tests, attending class, purchasing groceries and food, going to work, engaging in individual outdoor activity, attending religious services and seeking medical attention."

About 800 people are currently in quarantine, according to the university.

Jones blamed the uptick on the "recent unacceptable behavior by a small number of students.”

“Over these past few days, the irresponsible actions of a small number of students have created the very real possibility of ending an in-person semester for all of us,” Jones wrote.

He cited students going out even when testing positive, avoiding contact tracers, trying to circumvent the Safer Illinois app, and large gatherings.

“Students who do not comply with campus COVID-19 rules or who fail to follow any instructions from Champaign-Urbana Public Health District will face immediate suspension,” Jones wrote.

The Office of the Vice Chancellor for Student Affairs has also "substantially increased staffing" to monitor for parties, Jones said, and party hosts face immediate suspension.

While the first week of testing matched university expectations for how many cases would be brought into the community, the numbers haven't decreased since then, as was expected, according to the university.

"The number of new cases we have seen in the past several days has been progressing at a rate that will double every seven days without the actions we are asking of you," Jones said.

At that pace, as many as 8,000 people could be infected this semester, according to the UI, and 300 to 400 people would need to be added to the quarantine each day.

Despite the spread among students, Jones said, "there is no evidence of any spread from students to instructors or to the broader local community."

 

 

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16 hours ago, Texsox said:

G7 once again your buddy Tex is here to explain it.  If those ladies posted here we'd be discussing their hair habits as well. But they don't. We have you. You have pulled that hole card and you're working it like a stripper and his pole. No one else grabbed the salon card, they grabbed scissors and clippers. Once again this is why we need you. Nanc and Lori won't respond and keep the discussing going like you will. And bless your heart for it. 

We don't want you to be perfect. We need your quirky ways. We need you to be that slightly odd friend you don't know why is hanging out but you don't want him to leave. Yes, everyone makes fun of him when he's not there, but you'd miss him if he stopped hanging out. 

Greg isn't bad, Greg is great. You represent every salon going runway model with great hair. You are the lone voice sticking up for the Nancy and Loris of the world who need great hair. We salute you G7!

You are the one who is the master poster on here. Your sarcastic paragraphs are epic. Not just average, but A-plus. Your sarcasm is beautiful. I will say even you got me with this one head scratcher, though. I need to use my 29 ACT score brain and try to figure out your motive for this sentence: "You are the lone voice sticking up for the Nancy and Loris of the world who need great hair. We salute you G7!" Now of course I am very upset at Lori and Nancy P for their hair behavior. In my case, it was a matter of 3.5 months with no haircut and greg simply couldn't take it. I decided to include my angst on here and got reamed for it even though I didn't go get a haircut til my shop opened. Guess what? There was a renegade barber in Lawrence I coulda gone to and didn't. Yet NO PRAISE on here for me. Only no soup for me.

Also not sure if you meant my presence was welcome on the board. Several members have put me on ignore and I think I have 3 popular posters on ignore. If I had to bet big bucks I'd say more would want me to leave than stay. Which reminds me, where is El Rockin?? Caulfield hasn't been around much either.

Edited by greg775
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7 hours ago, greg775 said:

You are the one who is the master poster on here. Your sarcastic paragraphs are epic. Not just average, but A-plus. Your sarcasm is beautiful. I will say even you got me with this one head scratcher, though. I need to use my 29 ACT score brain and try to figure out your motive for this sentence: "You are the lone voice sticking up for the Nancy and Loris of the world who need great hair. We salute you G7!" Now of course I am very upset at Lori and Nancy P for their hair behavior. In my case, it was a matter of 3.5 months with no haircut and greg simply couldn't take it. I decided to include my angst on here and got reamed for it even though I didn't go get a haircut til my shop opened. Guess what? There was a renegade barber in Lawrence I coulda gone to and didn't. Yet NO PRAISE on here for me. Only no soup for me.

Also not sure if you meant my presence was welcome on the board. Several members have put me on ignore and I think I have 3 popular posters on ignore. If I had to bet big bucks I'd say more would want me to leave than stay. Which reminds me, where is El Rockin?? Caulfield hasn't been around much either.

You might be upset by their hair behavior but I am not. You taught me to consider their mental health and how it can teeter on their hair. So without trying you provided for them the best defense possible.

I appreciate the compliment. Seriously, one day I would like to meet the person behind the G7 persona. You've created quite the character which has taken on a tortuous life that so many posters here find morbidly interesting. Diary of a Wimpy Kid pales in comparison to what you have created with Greg775. With your obvious writing talents you should finish that novel or play that you no doubt have started.

 

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16 minutes ago, StrangeSox said:

Yikes

 

For guys who are hoping to go pro, that is just scary, let alone for the real life implications here.

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That thread is just a cesspool, so many people playing doctor and refusing to trust the science.  But that's how we got here 

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6 hours ago, Kyyle23 said:

That thread is just a cesspool, so many people playing doctor and refusing to trust the science.  But that's how we got here 

 

 

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3 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

 

 

Lol, you would think that "Students will party" would be the first rule of the model

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Welp RIP uiuc's plans, I guess. Is there any more arrogant group of professors than physicists?

 

edit: perfect encapsulation of physicists' reduction of reality to models

 

Edited by StrangeSox
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10 hours ago, Kyyle23 said:

Lol, you would think that "Students will party" would be the first rule of the model

Seems like a good time to repost this.

 

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4 hours ago, StrangeSox said:

Welp RIP uiuc's plans, I guess. Is there any more arrogant group of professors than physicists?

 

edit: perfect encapsulation of physicists' reduction of reality to models

 

Economists, probably.

OT: love the Jorbs tweet. One of my favorite streamers.

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https://www.politico.com/news/2020/09/05/college-coronavirus-outbreaks-sick-kids-home-409262
 

Colleges’ dilemma:  Fight outbreak or send sick kids home?

As of Friday, at least 51,000 students have been infected and thousands more are quarantined, according to a survey from The New York Times. Public health experts fear the numbers could surge when the weather turns cold, forcing students to spend more time indoors where the virus can spread more easily .

Experts caution that mass testing of student populations needs to be done as part of a larger strategy with contact tracing and isolation in order to prevent outbreaks.

“Testing is very important, but it has important limitations,” said Tom Frieden, the former CDC director in the Obama administration. “It's only as useful as what gets done with the testing results.”

Some schools have hired their own contact tracers and isolated infected students in hotels. But that plan doesn't account for what happens afterward, said Tom Inglesby, director of Johns Hopkins University’s Center for Health Security.

“There isn’t a good strategy beyond that,” he said. “Unfortunately, that does mean people going home and bringing the virus with them.”

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It's only a matter of time until some of these kids die. 1900 people in like 3 weeks. How on Earth do they think they're going to avoid lawsuits over this? McConnell?

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I am a French citizen teaching at an International Bilingual School in the U.S.A. (I’ll keep my identity and location confidential to not put my job in jeopardy.) I’m writing today because the overreaction  among a group of parents regarding students being required to wear face masks is something I never would have imagined from Americans. I’m disillusioned. Here’s a little background:

Last week we had what you call a “town hall.”  About 20% of the parents came without masks. They argued it’s their constitutional right to potentially infect the rest of us with the Covid virus. They didn’t say it quite like that, but that’s the takeaway. One parent said something about God protecting their child. The mask-wearing group tried to stress civic responsibility, children’s’ safety and respect. A few angry parents shouted them down. It was like they literally and figuratively removed their masks. It was ugly.

This degree of a sense of entitlement, lack of empathy and responsibility is something I haven’t seen before in America. I don’t understand why putting a piece of cloth over the mouth to help stop the spread of a deadly disease is too much to ask. You would think parents were being asked to sacrifice their first-born, which in the end they may be doing by denying them masks. The U.S. Constitution grants its citizens rights, but using those rights in a way that could cause the death of other citizens is inconsistent with what I know of America.

 

from internationalschoolsreview.com

 

response in same discussion thread:

Those who oppose masks refuse the science of community spread. I have an example or two that is not too publicized. The state of Alaska refuses to mandate mask wearing, although some jurisdictions have enforced the practice due to emergency health conditions. In regions where masks occurs, the population is predominantly urbanized and the infection rates are low.. In regions where masking is not practiced nor required, the population is predominantly conservative and Anglo and poorer. Native villages have closed themselves off from the rest of the state because of the feat of the spread of COVID 19 into those areas. There are hotbeds of community transmission of COVID 19 in Alaska that are not publicized. The age groups that have the greatest number of cases are 10-40. There is no public outreach to stop the spread.None whatsoever.

My point here is that non mask wearing areas are the hotspots of the virus. Twenty two cases today, three cases a few days ago,two high school football teams, the University of Alaska Fairbanks hockey team – all of these are examples of people spreading the virus before being put into quarantine The case of the Sturgis South Dakota motorcycle rally is a great case in point about community spread and not wearing masks. I would argue that the school i question put themselves in legal jeopardy by not requiring non mask wearing parents to leave their facility during this meeting. May nature help anyone in that room who was had corona virus passed on to them.

I want everyone in society to show solidarity with the medical community and socially distance, cover coughs properly mask, and stay home when sick.

Edited by caulfield12

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Face masks are a weird topic. I always wear mine. Seems to me everybody's got them on in my neck of the woods. But then I go on Facebook and see a friend's wedding and nobody's wearing a mask. Perhaps people are only wearing them where they must wear them to get served: stores and restrants.

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9 hours ago, greg775 said:

Face masks are a weird topic. I always wear mine. Seems to me everybody's got them on in my neck of the woods. But then I go on Facebook and see a friend's wedding and nobody's wearing a mask. Perhaps people are only wearing them where they must wear them to get served: stores and restrants.

It is a weird subject. People complain about their rights, but after 9/11 hardly anyone complained about W reading their e-mails. And no, God is not going to protect anyone. The mask has more of a chance to protect someone.

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The irony with masks is that the people that place energizing the economy above all else are, more often than not, the same subset that resists doing the one thing that will help stop the virus and therefore open the economy.  

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My grandpa's funeral was Saturday. My mom talked to the undertaker and he said that he gets offered $300 from hospitals to say the cause of death is COVID (hospitals receive $1,500 each case so they offer 20%). I would imagine this is going on everywhere.

Edited by soxfan2014

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