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COVID-19/Coronavirus thread

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1 minute ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

The US is talking about ending the shut down in like 4 days which is way sooner than any other country did.

Open the economy!

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Our people want to return to work. They will practice Social Distancing and all else, and Seniors will be watched over protectively & lovingly. We can do two things together. THE CURE CANNOT BE WORSE (by far) THAN THE PROBLEM! Congress MUST ACT NOW. We will come back strong!

Just amazing incompetence and denial about the severity of this thing. 

I'm not a financial doomsday kind of guy, but if he reopens the economy and tells everyone to go back to work and many states/governors listen and businesses follow lead (hopefully they won't), you are looking at a depression level economic downturn worse than we've seen in my lifetime. Reopening wouldn't save the economy, it would destroy it.

Edited by Look at Ray Ray Run
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3 minutes ago, StrangeSox said:

Singapore and Hong Kong are now re-instituting restrictive measures as a second wave hits.

 

Also aren't asymptomatic people spreading the disease like crazy? And China and Italy have temporarily "won" with measures far more restrictive than anything we've seen in this country. If our hope for curbing US deaths and suffering is what they did, we need to lock down much more tightly across the entire country starting last week.

Glad someone is paying attention!

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2 minutes ago, StrangeSox said:

Singapore and Hong Kong are now re-instituting restrictive measures as a second wave hits.

 

Also aren't asymptomatic people spreading the disease like crazy? And China and Italy have temporarily "won" with measures far more restrictive than anything we've seen in this country. If our hope for curbing US deaths and suffering is what they did, we need to lock down much more tightly across the entire country starting last week.

Those are largely tourism based infections. Second waves will happen, and containment measures will go back in place. What is your argument here...that shelter in place is bad because it is keeping people from getting immune? Because that's jerksticks argument. 

 

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2 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Our people want to return to work. They will practice Social Distancing and all else, and Seniors will be watched over protectively & lovingly. We can do two things together. THE CURE CANNOT BE WORSE (by far) THAN THE PROBLEM! Congress MUST ACT NOW. We will come back strong!

Just amazing incompetence and denial about the severity of this thing. 

Let’s just pass a new law to set the DJIA back to 29,600.   Or, better yet, 30,000.   Problem solved!!!

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40 minutes ago, bmags said:

Those are largely tourism based infections. Second waves will happen, and containment measures will go back in place. What is your argument here...that shelter in place is bad because it is keeping people from getting immune? Because that's jerksticks argument. 

 

No, just that we should probably expect subsequent periods of restrictive measures at least on a state or local level until vaccines are broadly available even if we do get this thing under control and ramp up testing.

 

But also it doesn't look like we're doing nearly enough to get this thing under control, even to Italy levels, and are instead openly musing about "well really, is a few million dead Americans too high a price to pay to make the stock market go back up?"

 

 

In global news, Modi has announced at all of India, 1.4B people, are going on hard lockdown starting in a matter of hours. India has been reporting few cases thus far.

Edited by StrangeSox

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40 minutes ago, bmags said:

Those are largely tourism based infections. Second waves will happen, and containment measures will go back in place. What is your argument here...that shelter in place is bad because it is keeping people from getting immune? Because that's jerksticks argument. 

 

No my argument is it’s ridiculous that only 65,000 Italians have the virus and the other 59,935,000 are okay.  This shit spreads like the flu.  It’s airborne in coughs.  It’s on surfaces for days.  People are supposedly asymptomatic for days or weeks but infectious.  It’s fucking everywhere people, and it’s been everywhere and back.  The idea that there is this front line that each country is currently fighting just doesn’t add up.  If it’s as infectious and mortal as the numbers indicate, where are the bodies?   How come 99.89% of Italians have miraculously avoided this super infectious virus?  
 

either things are really good or they are going to be really really bad.  There’s no middle ground.  There’s no “cases going down in Italy” while 59,935,000 Italians wait to be infected like sheep.  

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5 minutes ago, Jerksticks said:

No my argument is it’s ridiculous that only 65,000 Italians have the virus and the other 59,935,000 are okay.  This shit spreads like the flu.  It’s airborne in coughs.  It’s on surfaces for days.  People are supposedly asymptomatic for days or weeks but infectious.  It’s fucking everywhere people, and it’s been everywhere and back.  The idea that there is this front line that each country is currently fighting just doesn’t add up.  If it’s as infectious and mortal as the numbers indicate, where are the bodies?   How come 99.89% of Italians have miraculously avoided this super infectious virus?  
 

either things are really good or they are going to be really really bad.  There’s no middle ground.  There’s no “cases going down in Italy” while 59,935,000 Italians wait to be infected like sheep.  

I have no idea what your point is. That it's not that bad right now and these lockdowns are unnecessary because the numbers are too low?

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13 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

I have no idea what your point is. That it's not that bad right now and these lockdowns are unnecessary because the numbers are too low?

Yes I think that’s possible.  It’s definitely possible to some extent, due to 99.89% completely unaffected against a super infectious virus that spreads as easily as the flu.   Or they totally locked it down like badasses.  
 

My main point is I think there are interesting data points now that open up many possible questions.  And to not ask the obvious questions disqualifies somebody from having informed opinions.  
 

There are so many important things we should be discussing on here instead of partisan politics and some idiot drinking chemicals.  Why not ask the questions?  
 

What does a 99.89% uninfected rate in Italy and a 99.9999999989% uninfected rate in China tell us?  That they simply clamped it down?  “Virus STOP!”
 

Bullshit my ass man, bullshit my ass.  
 

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1 hour ago, bmags said:

I'm not advocating the US open in 4 days.

Hopefully someone asks the President how many dead Boomers is the economy worth.

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1 hour ago, bmags said:

I'm not advocating the US open in 4 days.

This makes zero sense. We are going to ignore all science.  

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We can do this. A handful of weeks of shutdown, continue to manufacture resiratores, masks, tests, etc, to ensure mass testing in place and than we can at least be better prepared to manage through it with a plan for isolated shutdowns where appropriate until we get to a vaccine. Its manageable and not utterly disruptive. 

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2 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Hopefully someone asks the President how many dead Boomers is the economy worth.

It’s not just boomers. A 35 year old died in New York yesterday. A healthy 42 year in Chicago died two days ago. 

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Just now, mqr said:

It’s not just boomers. A 35 year old died in New York yesterday. A healthy 42 year in Chicago died two days ago. 

Correct, but the best way to get the attention of the generation most at risk is to phrase the question for maximum attention.

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We’ve been fucked from the start. 
 

But now that ‘getting corona virus to own the libs’ has become a thing we’re doubly so. 

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I'm all for a careful study of ramping back to work. It seems plausible that we could start with workers who are least at risk and move to the most at risk instead of waiting for it to be safe for the most at risk group. 

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Just now, Chisoxfn said:

This makes zero sense. We are going to ignore all science.  

Troubled times call for troubled leaders. Trust that not only will things resolve but there will be a shift in electoral votes. 

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Dr. Fauci sidelined again.  SIGH.

Here’s the thing.   Even with 400 respirators here from stockpiles, Musk contributing around 1000 to California....they’re tens of thousands from having enough for NYC.

Which is 30,000 more that are needed to save lives.   Not needed in May or six weeks from now, critical to survival 2-3 weeks from now.  We’re supposed to be the greatest country on earth and we’re relegated to experimenting with split respirators and ventilators to take care of two patients simultaneously. 

Analogies to car accidents or flu deaths are completely beside the point.

Gov. Cuomo had it right, channeling his father’s immigrant roots.   That’s not who we are as a country...to just accept 1-2% of our fellow Americans dying, not without fighting until the very end to save each and every life.  They’re not just numbers on an actuarial table.   

Edited by caulfield12

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how can anyone possibly defend this? It’s absolute insanity. 

Edited by mqr

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4 minutes ago, mqr said:

how can anyone possibly defend this? It’s absolute insanity. 

Hopefully for each death this causes, Falwell gets charged with a count of murder.

 

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12 minutes ago, Texsox said:

I'm all for a careful study of ramping back to work. It seems plausible that we could start with workers who are least at risk and move to the most at risk instead of waiting for it to be safe for the most at risk group. 

Even then, everywhere between the coasts but perhaps Illinois...without 43% of the country, you’re not going to be able to get the economy humming along like it needs to.

You still have huge issues with energy industry there in Texas, hotels, airlines (opening up more flights just spreads it to the middle of the country)...the biggest area is the restaurant industry, with so many jobs interconnected.  If you can invest into delivery and carry out systems that are safe but ultimately prevent 2/3 or 3/4 restaurants from shutting down permanently, you have to at least look at that.

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29 minutes ago, Jerksticks said:

What does a 99.89% uninfected rate in Italy and a 99.9999999989% uninfected rate in China tell us?  That they simply clamped it down?  “Virus STOP!”
 

Bullshit my ass man, bullshit my ass.  
 

Yes, that is literally what it tells us. They stopped it in China by shutting down hundreds of millions of people for 3 months.

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7 minutes ago, mqr said:

how can anyone possibly defend this? It’s absolute insanity. 

Texas is probably going to end up with something similar...based on comments from Gov. Abbott and especially the Lt. Governor.

Wonder if GOP governors and states are indemnified when this massive gamble goes south?

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24 minutes ago, Texsox said:

I'm all for a careful study of ramping back to work. It seems plausible that we could start with workers who are least at risk and move to the most at risk instead of waiting for it to be safe for the most at risk group. 

I don't think there's any plausible format for ramping up back to work because it depends on what the situation is when we get to that. Right now the US is on a path accelerating in cases faster than Italy and China. If this explodes beyond what happened in China because places won't shut down or because they insist on reopening too soon...

China's an interesting case because it seems like they're slowly opening as community transmission stops, but they're doing so when countries on their border are about to start exporting cases back to them. They're an extreme case in the shutdown an d in number of transmissions, but so far who knows? 

For the US, there's already some obvious potential issues. Stop transmission in New York, but transmission ongoing in prisons in Texas and it gets exported right back to New York. Or, stop transmission in california and uninsured people in Texas keep transmission going.

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