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COVID-19/Coronavirus thread

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31 minutes ago, Jenksismyhero said:

A fluke terrorist attack that changed how we travel, how we conduct business, how we manage our security, etc. We created a whole new division of our government/military because of it. Our entire worldview changed because of it.

You think we'll keep practicing social distancing after this? Buying more delivery/curbside food? You think sports leagues will close forever? The only change I see sticking is being more mindful of washing our hands. Maybe telecommuting will be more common (businesses have now been forced to try it and they'll likely see productivity doesn't drop at all). That's about it.

It's definitely going to change the way we travel and how nations interact with one another. There's a very good possibility that Covid 19 isn't an isolated pandemic. It could very well be something else next year, or in 2 years. 

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31 minutes ago, Soxbadger said:

I think that this is going to change how we travel, how we conduct business, how we manage biological security. I think you are going to see dramatic changes in how the US looks at virus and other disease research.

Im just saying if the US completely changed life over a fluke terrorist attack, what is society (not just the US) going to do over a pandemic that has brought the world to a standstill.

I don't even get what is going on now. Why is the market up today? 6.6 million jobless claims. That's 10 million in 2 weeks. Using that number there is currently a 9.5% unemployment rate. At the peak of the Great Recession, it was 10%. People are losing their insurance, and it isn't gettng better next week.  When they get sick, what is going to happen? There are many who don't qualify for medicaid, and don't have the means for COBRA. Why aren't they opening up Obamacare other than political reasons?

Apparently people are betting on a fast bounce back, but we have no idea when this ends. Probably at least a month or two after the administrations  worst case scenerio, and if you look at China, while their economy is bouncing back, it's bouncing back very slowly. 

No one has a stimulus check, and that $1200 or so will be gone almost immediately. The small business loans don't even start until tomorrow. How long is it going to take for them to process all of the unemployment claims? And more and more people keep getting sick and dying. 

Edited by Dick Allen
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11 minutes ago, Texsox said:

South Padre does not have 10% of the petro industry as you experienced a few hundred miles north in Galveston. There is a sizable group fighting turning the Port of Brownsville into a Liquid Petroleum Gas (LPG) terminal.  

Interesting, is that a terminal for oil sands and shale "heavy crude"?  One thing I remember from San Padre is that the sun was at like a 70 degree angle around noon in March.  It's pretty god damn south down there.  

With oil crashing like it is might be the death knell for a lot of US projects, refineries, terminals and otherwise.

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6 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

I don't even get what is going on now. Why is the market up today? 6.6 million jobless claims. That's 10 million in 2 weeks. Using that number there is currently a 9.5% unemployment rate. At the peak of the Great Recession, it was 10%. People are losing their insurance, and it isn't gettng better next week.  When they get sick, what is going to happen? There are many who don't qualify for medicaid, and don't have the means for COBRA. Why aren't they opening up Obamacare other than political reasons?

Apparently people are betting on a fast bounce back, but we have no idea when this ends. Probably at least a month or two after the administrations  worst case scenerio, and if you look at China, while their economy is bouncing back, it's bouncing back very slowly. 

No one has a stimulus check, and that $1200 or so will be gone almost immediately. The small business loans don't even start until tomorrow. How long is it going to take for them to process all of the unemployment claims? And more and more people keep getting sick and dying. 

Agreeing with you quite a bit lately.  The market is just batshit irrational and always has been.   There isn't going to be any quick recovery.

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And the other thing is people are going to be dying from other crap. But because the ERs and intensive cares are so taxed, they will not get the immediate care they needed to survive. So while heart attack, stroke, aneurysm, gunshot, stabbing... might be the cause of death, COVID 19 may be the real cause., 

 

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9 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said:

Interesting, is that a terminal for oil sands and shale "heavy crude"?  One thing I remember from San Padre is that the sun was at like a 70 degree angle around noon in March.  It's pretty god damn south down there.  

With oil crashing like it is might be the death knell for a lot of US projects, refineries, terminals and otherwise.

There is really no petro down here. There are a few off shore rigs that logistically it is easier to get to from South Padre, but again, nothing like Galveston. Basically its tourist and Space X. 

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1 minute ago, Dick Allen said:

The IRS has told Congress that some people won't be getting their stimulus checks for 5 months. 

The past couple of years my withholding have been nearly spot on. I've sent checks for less than $50 each time. Which means they do not have my direct deposit information and likely I'll see a check this summer. 

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Just now, mqr said:

We’re looking at worse job loss than the fucking Great Depression dude, on top of WWII level deaths. 

This is one of our worst experiences and the election will be too making this a very bad year. Our collective viral exposure goes way beyond politics and we must defer to the experts. Granted social media magnifies everything. 

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The stock market has been unmoored from the real economy for awhile now. Today's Number Go Up is because the Fed promised infinite money to prop up businesses/shareholder value.

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1 minute ago, StrangeSox said:

The stock market has been unmoored from the real economy for awhile now. Today's Number Go Up is because the Fed promised infinite money to prop up businesses/shareholder value.

Fed should definitely take money out of the economy right now.

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I saw a political cartoon that said on this week's episode of The Apprentice/Governors, you will be playing for ventilators.

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Oh I'm not saying liquidity is bad right now. We don't want tons of businesses cratering due to completely uncontrollable circumstances. But that's why the stock market goes up on a day we announce 6.6 million unemployment claims.

The subtext there is that we're still doing far, far too little for actual everyday people as rent and mortgages come due, and floating SALT deduction rollbacks as your next big policy idea is just shockingly inadequate.

The next wave is going to be tens of millions losing insurance because their jobs evaporated combined with severe state and local austerity as tax receipts collapse, leading to more unemployment. Congress appears to be completely incapable of even conceiving of ways to address this crisis right now let alone put them into action.

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7 minutes ago, StrangeSox said:

The stock market has been unmoored from the real economy for awhile now. Today's Number Go Up is because the Fed promised infinite money to prop up businesses/shareholder value.

it's amazing they are willing to print as much money as they will need, but cut a pandemic team because it's considered wasteful spending.

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2 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

it's amazing they are willing to print as much money as they will need, but cut a pandemic team because it's considered wasteful spending.

The FED =! Federal Government.

I'm unclear why people should be cheering for the FED to not meet the incredible demand for USD globally right now. 

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I'm hoping that as a society, we change the way we view the importance of so many working class jobs. How many "unskilled" workers are putting their health on the line right now for little pay and no sick leave or job security while most of us work from home? Perhaps we should recognize them as essential and important always, and above all as people equally worthy of dignity and respect and living wages.

I hope too we recognize the importance of making our society more resilient to these sorts of crises in the future. We could have been much better prepared and equipped to deal with this, and we will need to deal with more global warming induced crises in the near future.

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Some unfortunately much less positive news on hydroxychloroquine - https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.newyorker.com/news/daily-comment/a-new-study-questions-the-effectiveness-of-a-potential-game-changer-against-the-coronavirus/amp

Another small anecdotal study so can hope that this one is wrong but if the drug was truly a complete game changer I think we’d be seeing better results with patients by now.  

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4 minutes ago, StrangeSox said:

Oh I'm not saying liquidity is bad right now. We don't want tons of businesses cratering due to completely uncontrollable circumstances. But that's why the stock market goes up on a day we announce 6.6 million unemployment claims.

The subtext there is that we're still doing far, far too little for actual everyday people as rent and mortgages come due, and floating SALT deduction rollbacks as your next big policy idea is just shockingly inadequate.

The next wave is going to be tens of millions losing insurance because their jobs evaporated combined with severe state and local austerity as tax receipts collapse, leading to more unemployment. Congress appears to be completely incapable of even conceiving of ways to address this crisis right now let alone put them into action.

I just think this is the best Fed Reserve in our lifetimes. The action they have taken has been more correct and faster than certainly 2008. Powell has been the most responsive to the dual mandate of any FED since the economists took over.

But more, the stock market is down, and it already lost 1/3rd of it's value in a month. But more, I think it's just a reality that much of the growth of the last 4 years has come from the top companies. And those are also the least likely to be hurt by this growth and likely will benefit (maybe not apple, but then again, maybe it gets their terrible streaming off the ground). So I'm not shocked.

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Also, just to be clear, when the fed is "injecting liquidity", they aren't just handing out money to businesses. Banks are trading in good treasuries and getting dollars to pay out short term obligations, including helping firms meet payroll. 

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3 minutes ago, StrangeSox said:

I'm hoping that as a society, we change the way we view the importance of so many working class jobs. How many "unskilled" workers are putting their health on the line right now for little pay and no sick leave or job security while most of us work from home? Perhaps we should recognize them as essential and important always, and above all as people equally worthy of dignity and respect and living wages.

I hope too we recognize the importance of making our society more resilient to these sorts of crises in the future. We could have been much better prepared and equipped to deal with this, and we will need to deal with more global warming induced crises in the near future.

I had a life changing meeting with Dolores Huerta. You are unfamiliar with her name but she co-founded American Farm Workers with Cesar Chavez. I never told my students that they should study so they didn't have to work in the fields, but I avoided that because I didn't want to insult their parents.  But when she spoke about how important those migrant workers were to our LIVES it grabbed me. Not to our economy. To our lives. We can't feed ourselves in American today. We need imported foods and imported workers to keep our grocery stores stocked. 

How many hospital workers are here without documentation? How many undocumented workers touch your food on the way to your grocery store?

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Right, I don't disagree with that. I think the criticism isn't of the Fed itself and it's actions, it's the government's willingness to let the Fed do it's thing to help businesses but the government isn't moving quick at all to truly address the scale and scope of this crisis. Also some calling out hypocrisy of the people who protested very very loudly for years about the Fed doing anything during a deep recession who now don't seem to mind at all.

Maybe it's just more visceral distaste/reaction to stuff like this:

Seeing stock prices rebound quickly, which has little or no impact on the average American (even if you have a nice 401k/IRA, you aren't touching for years), while you have to wait for a small one-time check for possibly months on end just isn't going to sit well with a lot of people. It's not an accurate picture or understand, but people hear "banks got $2T overnight!" and then think "and I'm waiting for my $1200 for weeks when I can't pay my rent?" It's not entirely the Fed, either (hundreds of billions for business in the Phase 3 bill), but it'll all get conflated together in many peoples' minds.

 

Edited by StrangeSox

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10 minutes ago, Texsox said:

I had a life changing meeting with Dolores Huerta. You are unfamiliar with her name but she co-founded American Farm Workers with Cesar Chavez. I never told my students that they should study so they didn't have to work in the fields, but I avoided that because I didn't want to insult their parents.  But when she spoke about how important those migrant workers were to our LIVES it grabbed me. Not to our economy. To our lives. We can't feed ourselves in American today. We need imported foods and imported workers to keep our grocery stores stocked. 

How many hospital workers are here without documentation? How many undocumented workers touch your food on the way to your grocery store?

There are a whole lotta people, with and without legal status, who are in the complex chain that gets a meal on to your table. Most of those people are paid and treated poorly.

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I saw an idea that frontline workers should be able to collect the unemployment benefits in addition to their salary which I think makes sense, but they should also be able to access medicare regardless of income level (should any warehouse or truck driver exceed threshold but lack insurance)

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6 hours ago, StrangeSox said:

6.6M new unemployment claims this week, and that's probably still undercounting because state systems are so overloaded right now

I am seeing a LOT of people talking about how they can't file for one reason or another, but mostly overwhelmed systems.

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5 hours ago, StrangeSox said:

We are doomed

 

(We've known this for months)

Wow, what an idiot.

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