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ESPN Lineup Ranking

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Hey guys. New to the board. Hopefully I didn't miss this already being posted, but ESPN just released their lineup rankings going into 2020.

The White Sox are ranked #13. Seems much lower than I would expect. There are also several that seem very over-ranked at the top. What are your thoughts?

Link: Way Too Early 2020 MLB Starting LIneup Rankings - ESPN

Comments about the White Sox:

13. Chicago White Sox (86.1)

chw.png?w=110&h=110&transparent=true1. Yoan Moncada (B)
2. Luis Robert (R)
3. Jose Abreu (R)
4. Edwin Encarnacion (R)
5. Eloy Jimenez (R)
6. Yasmani Grandal (B)
7. Nomar Mazara (L)
8. Tim Anderson (R)
9. Nick Madrigal (R)

Contact: 16 | Patience: 26 | Power: 9 | Speed: 7 | Balance: 1
Core hitters: 3 | Lineup holes: 0

Last season, gaping lineup and roster holes wiped out any hopes Chicago had of rising to at least mediocrity. In terms of everyday players, those holes have been filled by the White Sox's frenzied offseason. This projection is exciting on the face of it -- a powerful, athletic group with the kind of balance that should allow Rick Renteria to run out the same group just about every day, with Mazara's weakness against lefties being the exception. Encarnacion's age is a concern. So is the number of free swingers. But Chicago also has the dynamic group of Robert, Moncada, Jimenez and Madrigal, all of whom have better days ahead and a hopefully steep growth curve.

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Welcome,

I think #13 is fair because there are still question marks. Nobody should expect Robert to be putting up his minor league numbers in his rookie season. Mazara could very well be replacement level. Nobody has any idea what Madrigal will do. 1/3rd of our lineup is a mystery right now.

The article is behind a paywall so I can't see who is listed ahead of us

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I'd swap Mazara and Anderson in their scenario but w/e.

Unless there are set backs from Moncada and Eloy, I don't see how this lineup is not near top 5.  I assume Grandal, Abreu and Encarnacion will be the same they've always been. Conservatively think Mazara will be the same he's always been and Anderson steps back to a .270-.280 hitter. Robert and Madrigal have to just be "fine". That is still a top 5-8 lineup imo. There really are no holes.

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4 minutes ago, reiks12 said:

Welcome,

I think #13 is fair because there are still question marks. Nobody should expect Robert to be putting up his minor league numbers in his rookie season. Mazara could very well be replacement level. Nobody has any idea what Madrigal will do. 1/3rd of our lineup is a mystery right now.

The article is behind a paywall so I can't see who is listed ahead of us

1. Astros

2. Dodgers

3. Mets

4. Angels

5. Cubs

6. A's

7. Braves

8. Red Sox

9. Yankees

10. Padres

11. Nationals

12. Twins

13. US

14. Brewers

18. Indians

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Twins being 12 just totally invalidates this list lol...how in the hell is that lineup worse than the Cubs??? Or Angles or A's or Braves even. Set an MLB record for HRs and added Donaldson.  Preposterous.

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17 minutes ago, username said:

Twins being 12 just totally invalidates this list lol...how in the hell is that lineup worse than the Cubs??? Or Angles or A's or Braves even. Set an MLB record for HRs and added Donaldson.  Preposterous.

Because its the ESPN east coast bias. They've already forgotten what the Twins did last year.  And it looks like they haven't cared what the Reds have done this offseason.  I'm surprised they have us as high as 13 honestly. 

Edited by smellysox

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Didn't open the link. If I see Mets ranked 3rd and Yankees ranked 9th, it's not worth my time. Also they don't have a criteria for usage of advanced technology, to which Astros are clearly above the rest.

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13 probably a little low, but perhaps fair due to question marks and lack of track record.  But real curious to see which teams made the list above the Sox.

 

edit: yeah, that list is real bad.

Edited by SouthWallace
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10 minutes ago, SouthWallace said:

13 probably a little low, but perhaps fair due to question marks and lack of track record.  But real curious to see which teams made the list above the Sox.

It's posted above.

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Just so you all know, there were 7 categories they used to rank the lineups, and they ranked teams by those categories. I included our MLB rank next to the category. Lineup holes is not a rank, but they are saying once Magical comes up, we have no holes, although Mazara is very marginal. 

 

Sox

Contact - 16

Patience - 26

Power  - 9

Speed- 7

Balance - 1

Core Hitters - 3

Lineup Holes - 0

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4 minutes ago, SonofaRoache said:

Just so you all know, there were 7 categories they used to rank the lineups, and they ranked teams by those categories. I included our MLB rank next to the category. Lineup holes is not a rank, but they are saying once Magical comes up, we have no holes, although Mazara is very marginal. 

 

Sox

Contact - 16

Patience - 26

Power  - 9

Speed- 7

Balance - 1

Core Hitters - 3

Lineup Holes - 0

Mazara at 8 though I would assume is very strong if not one of the tops in the league.

 

They're saying we have really good balance?  interesting..

Edited by cjgalloway

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4 minutes ago, cjgalloway said:

Mazara at 8 though I would assume is very strong if not one of the tops in the league.

 

They're saying we have really good balance?  interesting..

You are correct, but he is a marginal talent thus far, but he did get the benefit of the doubt. We don't have really good balance, we have the best. I actually agree with this as we have power, speed, handedness, youth, veteran, contact, etc. My only concern is that we don't walk much or steal many bases just yet. 

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Super confused how the Sox are 7th in speed. Also confused how the team #1 in lineup balance can rank so low.

Also, how is it possible that one of the better offenses in MLB history is 12th while the NY Mets are third?

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5 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Super confused how the Sox are 7th in speed. Also confused how the team #1 in lineup balance can rank so low.

Also, how is it possible that one of the better offenses in MLB history is 12th while the NY Mets are third?

I'd have to look at all 30 teams projections and shit but just on Fangraphs the Mets' offense looks pretty loaded.  They don't have a regular projected below an OPS+ of 98 and they have a couple guys above 130.

By comparison the White Sox don't have a guy over 128 (Eloy) and while we might think the projection for Moncada is light (121) (and maybe we are right based on his statcast data) ZIPS thinks he's going to regress into "just really good" on BABIP instead of what it was last year.

It's getting people talking, that's good.   I'd say the two weeks before pitchers and catchers and then the two weeks before real games, when spring training is long boring, are the 4 worst weeks of the year baseball wise.  So yea good time to release a controversial article.

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12 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Super confused how the Sox are 7th in speed. Also confused how the team #1 in lineup balance can rank so low.

Also, how is it possible that one of the better offenses in MLB history is 12th while the NY Mets are third?

They'll have guys like Anderson, Moncada, Robert and Madrigal that can run. But the other 5 guys in the lineup will be slow af.

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4 minutes ago, soxfan2014 said:

They'll have guys like Anderson, Moncada, Robert and Madrigal that can run. But the other 5 guys in the lineup will be slow af.

Mazara is about average, and they have 4 guys who have 60-70 grade speed.

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9 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said:

I'd have to look at all 30 teams projections and shit but just on Fangraphs the Mets' offense looks pretty loaded.  They don't have a regular projected below an OPS+ of 98 and they have a couple guys above 130.

By comparison the White Sox don't have a guy over 128 (Eloy) and while we might think the projection for Moncada is light (121) (and maybe we are right based on his statcast data) ZIPS thinks he's going to regress into "just really good" on BABIP instead of what it was last year.

It's getting people talking, that's good.   I'd say the two weeks before pitchers and catchers and then the two weeks before real games, when spring training is long boring, are the 4 worst weeks of the year baseball wise.  So yea good time to release a controversial article.

I'm confused why the Mets are about the Twins; not us.

The Twins being so low is baffling, and I'm one of those who isn't buying all-in on last year for the Twins, but 12th is still stupid low.

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7 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

I'm confused why the Mets are about the Twins; not us.

The Twins being so low is baffling, and I'm one of those who isn't buying all-in on last year for the Twins, but 12th is still stupid low.

That one is a head scratcher.  ZIPS loves the Twins.

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8 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

I'm confused why the Mets are about the Twins; not us.

The Twins being so low is baffling, and I'm one of those who isn't buying all-in on last year for the Twins, but 12th is still stupid low.

They said they see regression for the Twins. 

 

Contact: 19 |

Patience: 8 |

Power: 10 |

Speed: 23 |

Balance: 10
Core hitters: 3

Lineup holes: 1

 

The Mets

 

Contact: 9 |

Patience: 20 |

Power: 4 |

Speed: 24 |

Balance: 4

Core hitters: 5

 Lineup holes: 0

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14 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Mazara is about average, and they have 4 guys who have 60-70 grade speed.

Not to mention, Grandal and EE are the only "slow" guys. Abreu is closer to average by sprint speed, and Eloy is actually deceptively fast 

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1 minute ago, Jose Abreu said:

Not to mention, Grandal and EE are the only "slow" guys. Abreu is closer to average by sprint speed, and Eloy is actually deceptively fast 

Eloy was quietly +1.8 runs on the bases last year.  He's fast in a straight line and gets good jumps.  Hopefully he worked on his agility this year that's where he gets tripped up on in LF.

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