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Dominikk85

The grandal hate is vastly overblown

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Grandal is underperforming a little but he still has a quite solid season. Sure you would want him a bit better and he will likely get there but he always was a streaky hitter who strikes out and gets a lot of his value by walks.

He is only hitting 226 but has a 345 obp and a solid 106 wRC+. He also has 0.7 war which is a 3 war full season pace.

That is not quite what you hoped for but he definitely isn't a black hole and only should get better.

 

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He's not very good with balls in the dirt either. The Sox should think long and hard before they let McCann walk out the door this winter.

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54 minutes ago, Sarava said:

He's not very good with balls in the dirt either. The Sox should think long and hard before they let McCann walk out the door this winter.

100% agree with you

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1 hour ago, Dominikk85 said:

Grandal is underperforming a little but he still has a quite solid season. Sure you would want him a bit better and he will likely get there but he always was a streaky hitter who strikes out and gets a lot of his value by walks.

He is only hitting 226 but has a 345 obp and a solid 106 wRC+. He also has 0.7 war which is a 3 war full season pace.

That is not quite what you hoped for but he definitely isn't a black hole and only should get better.

 

He also has a history of struggling in 2nd half of the season. Now this year is totally different with only a half-season and he is splitting catching time w McCann. But unfortunately he has started slower than he normally does so it is hard to predict how he will finish. 

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He does have some warts as a hitter, for example he also has a 37% career postseason K Rate and seems to struggle against the really good pitchers but overall he still usually has posted like a 115-120 wrc+ and he could get there too.

He also is an elite defensive catcher where the average wRC+ is like 90 so him hitting 110 is basically like a 1b hitting 130 when it comes to plus/minus for your team.

He did slightly underperform this year so far but not that much and it wouldn't surprise me if he ends up with a 115 wrc+ too this year.

If you expected that he hits 300 that was not realistic anyway, he is a 240 hitter who hits 25 bombs with lots of walks in a full season and that will come with some empty weeks.

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A streaky hitter who is currently not hitting should not be in the 3 hole.  That is my current problem with Grandal (actually more with Ricky).  Add to that the case that it does not seem last year was a fluke for McCann, and the frustration is enhanced.

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I would probably be less sick of watching him hit if he was hitting 7th or something. The walk off vs KC was cool, but his hitting this year has been atrocious. 

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19 minutes ago, wegner said:

A streaky hitter who is currently not hitting should not be in the 3 hole.  That is my current problem with Grandal (actually more with Ricky).  Add to that the case that it does not seem last year was a fluke for McCann, and the frustration is enhanced.

Thats the bigger problem.  Ricky seems to think hes a middle of the order bat, which he isnt.  Id be ok with him hitting 2nd (just because of his obp), 7th, or 8th.  But he should never be slotted to hit 3rd-6th on this team with the boppers we have.  

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I wouldn't mind Grandal if we had a competent manager. Slotting him 3rd when he isn't hitting the ball and rarely using the talents of James McCann who has hit well all season is the problem. I have little doubt McCann would have driven in more runs than Grandal given the same opportunities.

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Again, i know this will turn into the resign McCann thread, but there is no way the dude is signing on to be a back up for the next three years.  The sooner people give up that idea, the less miserable they will be this winter when he moves on.

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I don't hate Grandal but I think he was poor allocation of funds. We already had a good, maybe not great but good catcher on the team and several other holes on the team that should have been a higher priority in my opinion. The way he is being used makes it more frustrating. Move him down in the order and maybe some of this goes away.   

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4 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Again, i know this will turn into the resign McCann thread, but there is no way the dude is signing on to be a back up for the next three years.  The sooner people give up that idea, the less miserable they will be this winter when he moves on.

Agreed. 

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Factors working against Grandal:

1) He signed a team record deal at $18 million per season.   People are expecting greatness based on that. 

2) The Dumb Ass manger has him anchored in the 2-3-4 spot of the lineup all year

3)  While McCann is not as good as Grandal, the gap between them is way closer than people think with also factoring the fact that the teams' best pitchers prefer to pitch to McCann. 

 

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3 minutes ago, supernuke said:

I don't hate Grandal but I think he was poor allocation of funds. We already had a good, maybe not great but good catcher on the team and several other holes on the team that should have been a higher priority in my opinion. The way he is being used makes it more frustrating. Move him down in the order and maybe some of this goes away.   

They had a high priority placed on a top end pitcher, even offering 9 figures to get one done.  I have zero doubt they will chase another #1 starter this winter.

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5 minutes ago, HOFHurt35 said:

Factors working against Grandal:

1) He signed a team record deal at $18 million per season.   People are expecting greatness based on that. 

2) The Dumb Ass manger has him anchored in the 2-3-4 spot of the lineup all year

3)  While McCann is not as good as Grandal, the gap between them is way closer than people think with also factoring the fact that the teams' best pitchers prefer to pitch to McCann. 

 

I think another thing working against him is that after the signing he was presented as having this great knowledge in working with pitchers and he was going to be able to get more out of the pitchers. That hasn't seemed to happen so far. He was also an elite framer but for that hasn't shown up yet either. I have read a couple of articles that have said that framing abilities tend to drop off rapidly after age 31 so it is possible that we may never see that elite framing.  

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3 minutes ago, supernuke said:

I think another thing working against him is that after the signing he was presented as having this great knowledge in working with pitchers and he was going to be able to get more out of the pitchers. That hasn't seemed to happen so far. He was also an elite framer but for that hasn't shown up yet either. I have read a couple of articles that have said that framing abilities tend to drop off rapidly after age 31 so it is possible that we may never see that elite framing.  

37 games into the contract.

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15 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

They had a high priority placed on a top end pitcher, even offering 9 figures to get one done.  I have zero doubt they will chase another #1 starter this winter.

I certainly hope they can find a #1 starter this off season. I would expect a regression from Giolito at least for his fist season without McCann. Hopefully they also find a backup catcher that will be able to work with Giolito if he can't click with Grandal. 

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5 minutes ago, Quin said:

37 games into the contract.

Yep, and all I am saying is that so far we haven't seen all that was advertised. 

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10 minutes ago, supernuke said:

I certainly hope they can find a #1 starter this off season. I would expect a regression from Giolito at least for his fist season without McCann. Hopefully they also find a backup catcher that will be able to work with Giolito if he can't click with Grandal. 

Unfortunately #1 starters get paid $200+ million in free agency.  That's not going to happen while JR owns the team.     

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13 minutes ago, Quin said:

37 games into the contract.

If this were a normal season, we'd be around the first of May.

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3 hours ago, ChiSox1917 said:

Hes good but there was a reason that the dodgers let him walk. 

Yeah actually 3, Austin Barnes, Will Smith & Keibert Ruiz. Dodgers are stacked at catcher and had more coming up.

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