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Offseason Targets

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21 minutes ago, Quin said:

Does Sonny Gray really command this price?

This is a genuine question by the way. I might be too clouded by his Yankees days, but I feel like Portillos likes to throw the biggest possible package on the table.

This actually seemed kinda weak to me?  Meaning, i'd probably do it

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Just now, HakunaMachado said:

Anyone think we get some Sox news today?

 

 

I think this is our news.

It makes no sense for us to make a big move when we're still chasing our biggest target.

Maybe a Marquez + Blackmon deal would make a lot of sense (since that is being rumored) if Springer goes elsewhere.

Springer signing here or not will be the biggest determinant on $$$ available for spending, and route of transactions.

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9 minutes ago, HakunaMachado said:

Anyone think we get some Sox news today?

 

 

They will sign players but it’s a matter of when. It’s still relatively early in the offseason. The non tender deadline is coming up next week as well and there should be plenty of players added to the market so we shall see.

Edited by maloney.adam

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We're starting to get a little carried away with the rumor mill here in late November. 

So here's some tenants/comments from a more mellowed prespective:

1) We shouldn't/aren't going to trade any of Madrigal/Kopech/Vaughn/Crochet/Dunning/possibly Cease. The only exception to this is if we trade Kopech or Vaughn in an insane SP deal for like a Marquez or Snell. I put the chance of that happening very very low and it's only sensible if all we are giving up is that one piece + a few more very minor ones. Anyway, I don't think we should go into this offseason mulling over trading these pieces, it won't/shouldn't happen.

2) We aren't signing Bauer. Again, there is a 0% chance this happens. That sucks, because that solves a lot of our issues.

3) This team needs more SP, depth and quality. We aren't going to get quality from free agency, so we are going to have to hope we get a good trade partner. I see us trading with the Rangers, it makes way too much sense. Lynn, should cost very little. He will cost none of our core set. This deal should get done. I'd love to see Joey Gallo come back our way as well as I think he is a big time difference maker. If we do get him involved, I'd love a contract extension. If not the Rangers, maybe the Cubs with Darvish+Heyward but there's some risk involved there with Darvish.

4) Springer, while nice, really doesn't fit our mold IMO. I hate saying it, because I want to see this team fully stocked, but signing Springer to a big time contract I think does more harm than good for the long term outlook of this team. He's a better fit on the Blue Jays who need a primary CFer or the Mets. For our OF acquisition I think we need a defense first candidate. Our Offense is so strong, but seeing Eloy butcher balls all over the field and forcing Robert to play 2/3 the OF sucks. There should be an abundance of ways we can get creative and solve our RF problem without spending big on Springer. While I'd be ecstatic over the announcement of signing Springer, I will be sad knowing that it isn't the right fit. 

 

So for me, a perfect offseason while being realistic might be something like:

-Trade for Lynn+Gallo without giving up the prospect top core. Do whatever else it takes. 

-Sign SP depth (Think Quintana works wonders here)

-Sign the backups (Backup C, RP, maybe even another OF/SP)

That's really all I'm looking for. 1 Quality SP, 1 Quality RF that plays defense well enough, 1-2 SP depth.

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I think the Rays would have a lot of interest in Matt Foster also as part of a Snell deal, likely as a 4th piece, or as a 3rd piece if the first 2 pieces were huge.

I think the deal that the Rays would want, without including Vaughn, would be something like Kopech + Stiever + Bailey + Foster or Kopech + Dalquist + Thompson + Foster, something like that.  And I would be very uncomfortable giving up really any of those guys, but most uncomfortable giving up Kopech, then Stiever, then Bailey, then Dalquist/Thompson.  But I think that either could be a fair best offer and if the Sox made it, I couldn't say they "overpaid" at the time on paper.

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Does anyone have a feel for where the Reds heads are at? 

- They snuck into an expanded playoffs

- The reason they made it is a fantastic pitching staff and they are losing its ace

- Their offense is garbage and I'm not aware of many prospects on their way offensively

With that, they are seeking to trade Gray. 

So do we think the Reds are:

- Looking for MLB ready or close-to-ready players

OR

- Top prospects regardless

I honestly don't know what they can do. I'm glad they got into the playoffs though.

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4 minutes ago, bmags said:

Does anyone have a feel for where the Reds heads are at? 

- They snuck into an expanded playoffs

- The reason they made it is a fantastic pitching staff and they are losing its ace

- Their offense is garbage and I'm not aware of many prospects on their way offensively

With that, they are seeking to trade Gray. 

So do we think the Reds are:

- Looking for MLB ready or close-to-ready players

OR

- Top prospects regardless

I honestly don't know what they can do. I'm glad they got into the playoffs though.

The reds are a god awful organization and are not a serious playoff team as they're constructed right now.

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1 minute ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said:

The reds are a god awful organization and are not a serious playoff team as they're constructed right now.

I know they aren't, but are they trying to stay on track or tear it down?

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If Rays are interested, I'd lead with Kopech. Guessing they would want a meaningful 2nd piece and they love fireballing BP arms so someone like Bummer might be part of their ask. 3rd piece someone like Mercedes (watch him become the next Arozarena). I do not think WS have any interest in dangling Vaughn or Crochet to anyone. I think Cease could potentially headline a package for Darvish but its unclear how Cubs plan to proceed. For Lynn, I'd be reluctant to move any of the aforementioned (except Mercedes) and would consider leading with Stiever but I'm a bit less sanguine about Lynn based on how he finished 2020.

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3 hours ago, Wisebri224 said:

The issue here is how do you trade for a TOR starter without moving one of those guys?  This isn't a video game:).  Either Jerry has to spend money (eat bad contracts to get good players), we bargain basement shop, or we move prospects.  I am a fan of going after Lynn because of the short contract.  It gives you a chance to see if the kids pan out for one more year before you decide if you need to pay big bucks for one more starter.  

I understand it takes one of those guys.  That's why I said I'd rather not trade for one of the Tor starter's.  Just sign a cheaper pitcher or 2 and develop their own guys.  

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2 hours ago, iWiN4PreP said:

We're starting to get a little carried away with the rumor mill here in late November. 

So here's some tenants/comments from a more mellowed prespective:

1) We shouldn't/aren't going to trade any of Madrigal/Kopech/Vaughn/Crochet/Dunning/possibly Cease. The only exception to this is if we trade Kopech or Vaughn in an insane SP deal for like a Marquez or Snell. I put the chance of that happening very very low and it's only sensible if all we are giving up is that one piece + a few more very minor ones. Anyway, I don't think we should go into this offseason mulling over trading these pieces, it won't/shouldn't happen.

2) We aren't signing Bauer. Again, there is a 0% chance this happens. That sucks, because that solves a lot of our issues.

3) This team needs more SP, depth and quality. We aren't going to get quality from free agency, so we are going to have to hope we get a good trade partner. I see us trading with the Rangers, it makes way too much sense. Lynn, should cost very little. He will cost none of our core set. This deal should get done. I'd love to see Joey Gallo come back our way as well as I think he is a big time difference maker. If we do get him involved, I'd love a contract extension. If not the Rangers, maybe the Cubs with Darvish+Heyward but there's some risk involved there with Darvish.

4) Springer, while nice, really doesn't fit our mold IMO. I hate saying it, because I want to see this team fully stocked, but signing Springer to a big time contract I think does more harm than good for the long term outlook of this team. He's a better fit on the Blue Jays who need a primary CFer or the Mets. For our OF acquisition I think we need a defense first candidate. Our Offense is so strong, but seeing Eloy butcher balls all over the field and forcing Robert to play 2/3 the OF sucks. There should be an abundance of ways we can get creative and solve our RF problem without spending big on Springer. While I'd be ecstatic over the announcement of signing Springer, I will be sad knowing that it isn't the right fit. 

 

So for me, a perfect offseason while being realistic might be something like:

-Trade for Lynn+Gallo without giving up the prospect top core. Do whatever else it takes. 

-Sign SP depth (Think Quintana works wonders here)

-Sign the backups (Backup C, RP, maybe even another OF/SP)

That's really all I'm looking for. 1 Quality SP, 1 Quality RF that plays defense well enough, 1-2 SP depth.

Trading for both Lynn + Gallo is going to require a top prospect(s), there is no way around that.

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1 hour ago, bmags said:

Does anyone have a feel for where the Reds heads are at? 

- They snuck into an expanded playoffs

- The reason they made it is a fantastic pitching staff and they are losing its ace

- Their offense is garbage and I'm not aware of many prospects on their way offensively

With that, they are seeking to trade Gray. 

So do we think the Reds are:

- Looking for MLB ready or close-to-ready players

OR

- Top prospects regardless

I honestly don't know what they can do. I'm glad they got into the playoffs though.

I definitely think the Reds would be looking for major league pieces.  IMO, they only trade Gray if they get a ready to go but somewhat unproven pitcher along with something else that fills a major league need (RP or SS).

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1 hour ago, bmags said:

Does anyone have a feel for where the Reds heads are at? 

- They snuck into an expanded playoffs

- The reason they made it is a fantastic pitching staff and they are losing its ace

- Their offense is garbage and I'm not aware of many prospects on their way offensively

With that, they are seeking to trade Gray. 

So do we think the Reds are:

- Looking for MLB ready or close-to-ready players

OR

- Top prospects regardless

I honestly don't know what they can do. I'm glad they got into the playoffs though.

My mind tells me they should be doing what the Sox did when they decided to blow it up: Stock the fucking farm. Try to get MLB ready, but if not it's gravy.

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26 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Trading for both Lynn + Gallo is going to require a top prospect(s), there is no way around that.

I disagree

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11 minutes ago, maloney.adam said:

LOL 😂

LOL Al’s Cheesy Beef is hilarious and alright with me. Anyone who calls out Schins is ok in my book.

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1 hour ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I definitely think the Reds would be looking for major league pieces.  IMO, they only trade Gray if they get a ready to go but somewhat unproven pitcher along with something else that fills a major league need (RP or SS).

Yeah they would have too. I mean the Reds are going to lose Bauer and Gray in the same off season. They absolutely will need something back. That's a lot of innings that just opened up. 

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