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Trevor Bauer Thread (Mazara Free Zone)

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10 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said:

And why did Stone tweet this about him if “any youngish pitcher is just like Bauer”?  I can totally respect not wanting to overpay him if you think he overachieved this year, but discrediting his drive & willingness to learn is complete bullshit and makes me think you just don’t like the dude.

 

How the f does Steve Stone know how hard Trevor Bauer works? 

Carson Fulmer is on the Trevor Bauer regimen; how's that working out for him? 

You're 100% right too; I don't like Bauer, and most people who have played with him don't like him either. 

He who shouts the loudest about how smart and hard he works is likely not one who works the hardest and/or knows the most. I've said it before, but when your teammates in high school, college, and the pros universally don't like you, it's not because you "speak your mind and are a free thinker." It's because you're an asshole.

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5 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Nolan Ryan was big on long toss.

He was, I didn't say he invented it, but in 2012 when Bauer was doing it it was considered controversial. then you had the entire cubs backfield doing it. Were the cubs doing it because of Nolan Ryan? No.

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2 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

How the f does Steve Stone know how hard Trevor Bauer works? 

Carson Fulmer is on the Trevor Bauer regimen; how's that working out for him? 

You're 100% right too; I don't like Bauer, and most people who have played with him don't like him either. 

He who shouts the loudest about how smart and hard he works is likely not one who works the hardest and/or knows the most. I've said it before, but when your teammates in high school, college, and the pros universally don't like you, it's not because you "speak your mind and are a free thinker." It's because you're an asshole.

Yes Bauer is a jerk. But that doesn't mean his impact on pitching isn't real. Two things can be true, and just because you don't like him doesn't mean that impact needs to be marginalized.

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6 minutes ago, bmags said:

Pitchers have indeed used the tools that were provided to them. That is not what Bauer did. Yes, when you try to take a view from nowhere view that Giolito "changed his delivery", indeed pitchers have done that. But Giolito did that dramatically over the course of one offseason was the big change, and the use of the core velocity belt is now much more widespread. Bauer helped decentralize the pitching knowledge and gave more power to the players to tinker. You are being obtuse about his impact on the last half-decade.

I'm really not; you're giving credit for a guy like Giolito's turnaround to someone who had nothing to do with it what-so-ever. Giolito didn't consult Bauer and certainly didn't use him as a barometer. Giolito made the commitment, sought the help from those he worked with before, put in the work and changed his career. It had nothing to do with Trevor Bauer. 

I've never once met a pitcher who used tech because Trevor did; not discrediting that Trevor MAY have introduced some tech. I also think the impact of tech on pitchers might be the most overblown thing I've ever seen in my life; ode to Harold on this one. It's a tool and resource to help you improve; it in no way makes or breaks your career.

Edited by Look at Ray Ray Run

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Just now, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

I'm really not; you're giving credit for a guy like Giolito's turnaround to someone who had nothing to do with it what-so-ever. Giolito didn't consult Bauer and certainly didn't use him as a barometer. Giolito made the commitment, sought the help from those he worked with before, put in the work and changed his career. It had nothing to do with Trevor Bauer. 

I've never once met a pitcher who used tech because Trevor did. I also think the impact of tech on pitchers might be the most overblown thing I've ever seen in my life; ode to Harold on this one. It's a tool and resource to help you improve; it in no way makes or breaks your career.

A lot of pitchers are using the tech they are using now because their teams bought tech after Bauer and Kyle Boddy's work with introducing tech from golf and biology and a bunch of other places. So no, they may not think they are using tech because of bauer, but their teams bought that tech because of him. 

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1 minute ago, bmags said:

A lot of pitchers are using the tech they are using now because their teams bought tech after Bauer and Kyle Boddy's work with introducing tech from golf and biology and a bunch of other places. So no, they may not think they are using tech because of bauer, but their teams bought that tech because of him. 

Which is an entirely different argument. 

Also, injuries are up in baseball for SP's, not down. Driveline's focus on maximum spin and velocity could very well cause more injuries. We honestly have no idea. While tech helps to catch things like drops in arm angle and velocity - allowing a team to react and help keep a pitcher healthy - it's very possible that the training regimens and etc are having an impact on SP health.

Edited by Look at Ray Ray Run

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16 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Another year = potential lockout. 2 years = free agency at age 32. Big risks.

The Owners could lock the players out this year to bully them into an agreement.  

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Just now, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Which is an entirely different argument. 

Also, injuries are up in baseball for SP's, not down. Driveline's focus on maximum spin and velocity could very well cause more injuries. We honestly have no idea. 

So just to recap, you stated that Bauer's expertise is overblown and every pitcher uses tech. It was pointed out that a lot of that tech used in major league pitching programs was introduced by Bauer and Boddy's work and that's why he gets credit. And now you are saying that's a different argument than what? If every pitcher invented a new tool to use to help train how to pitch at an elite level, then yes, it wouldn't be that impressive that Bauer did it.

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11 minutes ago, bmags said:

So just to recap, you stated that Bauer's expertise is overblown and every pitcher uses tech. It was pointed out that a lot of that tech used in major league pitching programs was introduced by Bauer and Boddy's work and that's why he gets credit. And now you are saying that's a different argument than what? If every pitcher invented a new tool to use to help train how to pitch at an elite level, then yes, it wouldn't be that impressive that Bauer did it.

I just don't by it bmags; we'll agree to disagree. I don't think he came up with "a lot of tech" either. It's not as if he invented the tech either, it was used in golf and etc.

No one wants you to believe that this tech has revolutionized the game more than the guys who are selling it. 

Dylan Cease was paired up to those camera's all last year and last off-season. They identified what his "issue was" but we're 1+ year later and Cease still has no rise on his FB. I love tech and data - I work in the field - but sometimes the impact of tech on athletes is really overblown. 

Rapsado machines are a useful resource, but they don't dictate the success of a pitcher. They merely help evaluate what a pitcher is doing, but people knew Cease's fastball didn't have the life it needed even if there weren't machines telling us the spin and rise. 

EDIT: I don't think anything rubs me the wrong way more than someone proclaiming how hard someone works when they've never been on a team with him or in a room with him.

The hardest workers in my life, typically, have been incredibly quite. They never proclaimed to the world how much harder they were working.

Edited by Look at Ray Ray Run

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3 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Sure, but does that mean every young pitcher in the game is into analytics & biomechanics as much Bauer like Let Ray Ray just claimed?

I didn't say every, I said most... and most young pitchers are into the tech and biomechanics of pitching. It has been provided to them by coaches/trainers. It is just another tool they use to help better themselves. 

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38 minutes ago, Harold's Leg Lift said:

The Owners could lock the players out this year to bully them into an agreement.  

I don’t think that’s legal when they have a contract?

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12 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

I don’t think that’s legal when they have a contract?

How did it happen in 94, were they in between deals?

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1 hour ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

How the f does Steve Stone know how hard Trevor Bauer works? 

Carson Fulmer is on the Trevor Bauer regimen; how's that working out for him? 

You're 100% right too; I don't like Bauer, and most people who have played with him don't like him either. 

He who shouts the loudest about how smart and hard he works is likely not one who works the hardest and/or knows the most. I've said it before, but when your teammates in high school, college, and the pros universally don't like you, it's not because you "speak your mind and are a free thinker." It's because you're an asshole.

But at the same time, how the fuck would you know?  Seems to me that Stone would have access to much better info the matter than you.

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36 minutes ago, bmags said:

How did it happen in 94, were they in between deals?

Yes, the strike started because the previous agreement had lapsed. It is illegal to strike while a labor contract is active in almost all cases in this country.

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1 hour ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

How the f does Steve Stone know how hard Trevor Bauer works? 

Carson Fulmer is on the Trevor Bauer regimen; how's that working out for him? 

You're 100% right too; I don't like Bauer, and most people who have played with him don't like him either. 

He who shouts the loudest about how smart and hard he works is likely not one who works the hardest and/or knows the most. I've said it before, but when your teammates in high school, college, and the pros universally don't like you, it's not because you "speak your mind and are a free thinker." It's because you're an asshole.

You might be on to something here.

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24 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

But at the same time, how the fuck would you know?  Seems to me that Stone would have access to much better info the matter than you.

Maybe, maybe not. 

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1 hour ago, poppysox said:

You might be on to something here.

 THe bottom line with me is, I don't care if the player, especially a pitcher is an asshole or not. All that I care about if I run a team is that the guy shows up every 4-5 days and gives me an 80% chance of winning. Throughout history, the HOF is littered with all time great players who were absolute assholes. If a guy brags about himself, he needs to back it up. I would, however, rather have a guy with an edge like that than someone who is afraid to step out and dominate. Think Gibson wasn't a huge asshole? How about Gooden? Carlton? Bunning? If the guy can pitch. IF a guy can hit. IF a guy is a great defensive player. Find a place for that player on your team and adjust your locker-room accordingly. This is where a manager really earns his paycheck I think.

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3 minutes ago, The Hawk said:

 THe bottom line with me is, I don't care if the player, especially a pitcher is an asshole or not. All that I care about if I run a team is that the guy shows up every 4-5 days and gives me an 80% chance of winning. Throughout history, the HOF is littered with all time great players who were absolute assholes. If a guy brags about himself, he needs to back it up. I would, however, rather have a guy with an edge like that than someone who is afraid to step out and dominate. Think Gibson wasn't a huge asshole? How about Gooden? Carlton? Bunning? If the guy can pitch. IF a guy can hit. IF a guy is a great defensive player. Find a place for that player on your team and adjust your locker-room accordingly. This is where a manager really earns his paycheck I think.

I like to eat eat eat apples and banaynays.

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6 hours ago, poppysox said:

You might be on to something here.

If I'm reading between the lines correctly, then I see what you did there. :lol:

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One thing about Bauer that scares me is he did pitch in the worst hitting division in baseball last year. Terrible hitting teams he faced a lot so his 2020 season could be anomaly. He has good not great stats over his career so I don’t think we should over pay for him. I will take him for sure but at the right price. Just saying 

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On 10/28/2020 at 3:47 PM, knightni said:

Let's drop 25 a year on Bauer and 25 a year on Springer.

2021 Title here we come.

As Jerry emphatically proved today, he doesn't give a fck about this team, our chances, or the fans. All about his wallet and correcting a mistake before he meets his maker. 

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