Jack Parkman Posted January 7, 2021 Share Posted January 7, 2021 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Chisoxfn said: No there is not evidence that a bunch of cops just colluded with Trump to let these madmen in. None, zilch, zero. Does that mean the officers behaved perfect, was there the right security in place etc? No that isn’t the case but I don’t think the cops said hey I like trump - let’s allow all these bastards in, nor do I think there was some collective decision made by leadership at top of the police department who said - hey let’s let all these people in and be terrorist. Now maybe that did happen Jack - but your statement right now is complete shit and unfounded and is a disgrace to plenty of good cops who risk their lives every day, including i am sure many who were there today in fear of their lives and whose families were watching what happened live on tv who were likely in fear of their loved one who was in uniform today. I do not doubt that there are good cops. Unfortunately, they have to prove it because the bad ones are not held accountable and get away with murder regularly. I absolutely sympathize with those who were just trying to do their job today. In my opinion the evidence that a bunch of cops colluded with Trump to let the madmen in is that it happened at all......it was easily preventable if there had been proper security precautions taken. There's no way what happened today was possible without the police being complicit. None whatsoever. I cannot believe we're actually having this discussion. I have a problem with people just blindly believing that the cops are justified in their behavior just because they're cops. They've 100% earned skepticism. One bad cop is one too many. I do not think that anybody here thinks that what happened today was ok by any means........but please, I ask you to go read the 2006 DOJ report about PDs being infiltrated by fascist groups. Edited January 7, 2021 by Jack Parkman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted January 7, 2021 Share Posted January 7, 2021 2 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: For the love of god Pence, do just one good thing as VP and invoke the 25th! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vulture Posted January 7, 2021 Share Posted January 7, 2021 https://www.tiktok.com/@marcus.dipaola/video/6914723446496840965?sender_device=mobile&sender_web_id=6914888154462979590&is_from_webapp=1 They literally wave them in here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShoeLessRob Posted January 7, 2021 Share Posted January 7, 2021 (edited) I’m assuming this is what people want to see. Edited January 7, 2021 by ShoeLessRob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast Posted January 7, 2021 Share Posted January 7, 2021 (edited) McConnell appeared to shut down the PA debate (I think, unless nobody had anything to say) and seven senators voted yea. Sounds like they won’t reconvene for business until tomorrow. Edited January 7, 2021 by The Beast Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted January 7, 2021 Share Posted January 7, 2021 (edited) With all of the shit that Hillary got for Benghazi, there better be 10 times as many hearings about today than there were about that incident. Edited January 7, 2021 by Jack Parkman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Abreu Posted January 7, 2021 Share Posted January 7, 2021 (edited) 38 minutes ago, ron883 said: Love the hypocrisy of people who will jump down your throat for making broad generalizations about a certain group of people, but then make broad generalizations about another group of people. For sure, because people are born as a specific race just as they're born as police officers. Totally comparable Edited January 7, 2021 by Jose Abreu 6 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Abreu Posted January 7, 2021 Share Posted January 7, 2021 To clarify because I'm not sure if the sarcasm will come across, the Blue Lives Matter folks love to pretend that police officers are some marginalized group, while ignoring that, unlike actual marginalized groups, they typically have the option to leave their group (i.e. get a different job, retire, etc). Even if you want to argue that the status of their group is irrelevant, I'm not sure how one can call police officers marginalized when they consistently receive little or no punishment for murder. If anything, they're usually above the law. Trying to equate criticism of them to racism (or insert prejudice here) is a great way of demonstrating that you've never thought critically about a race-related issue 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted January 7, 2021 Share Posted January 7, 2021 7 minutes ago, Jose Abreu said: To clarify because I'm not sure if the sarcasm will come across, the Blue Lives Matter folks love to pretend that police officers are some marginalized group, while ignoring that, unlike actual marginalized groups, they typically have the option to leave their group (i.e. get a different job, retire, etc). Even if you want to argue that the status of their group is irrelevant, I'm not sure how one can call police officers marginalized when they consistently receive little or no punishment for murder. If anything, they're usually above the law. Trying to equate criticism of them to racism (or insert prejudice here) is a great way of demonstrating that you've never thought critically about a race-related issue Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron883 Posted January 7, 2021 Share Posted January 7, 2021 22 minutes ago, Jose Abreu said: For sure, because people are born as a specific race just as they're born as police officers. Totally comparable I was actually thinking of protestors and people generalizing them as looters and rioters, but I see you jumped straight to race despite it not even being mentioned. You shouldn't do that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Abreu Posted January 7, 2021 Share Posted January 7, 2021 3 minutes ago, ron883 said: I was actually thinking of protestors and people generalizing them as looters and rioters, but I see you jumped straight to race despite it not even being mentioned. You shouldn't do that. Right, so it's a race issue. They were protesting racially-motivated police shootings, in case you weren't aware. If you think that's akin to people attempting to overthrow the government because their preferred candidate lost an election, everything I said applies 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron883 Posted January 7, 2021 Share Posted January 7, 2021 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Jose Abreu said: Right, so it's a race issue. They were protesting racially-motivated police shootings, in case you weren't aware. If you think that's akin to people attempting to overthrow the government because their preferred candidate lost an election, everything I said applies I think people with the ACAB mindset are as bad as those who refer to the all the protestors as looters and rioters. If you weren't aware, the protestors come in all races, genders and shapes. Same with police officers. Edited January 7, 2021 by ron883 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted January 7, 2021 Share Posted January 7, 2021 (edited) 2 minutes ago, ron883 said: I think people that say all cops are bad are as bad as those who refer to the all the protestors as looters and rioters. If you weren't aware, the protestors come in all races, genders and shapes. Same with police officers. Nobody said all cops were bad. I assumed that was implied, but I guess that I gave everyone too much credit. These are not protestors, they're fucking terrorists. There are wayyyyyy too many bad cops. One anywhere in the country is one too many. Edited January 7, 2021 by Jack Parkman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron883 Posted January 7, 2021 Share Posted January 7, 2021 Just now, Jack Parkman said: Nobody said all cops were bad. I assumed that was implied, but I guess that I gave everyone too much credit. These are not protestors, they're fucking terrorists. There are wayyyyyy too many bad cops. One anywhere in the country is one too many. You just said that all cops are bad until proven otherwise. Regarding your last sentence - any solutions to meet your threshold of 0 bad cops in the entire country? Let's stop throwing out ridiculously unachievable utopian fantasies here. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted January 7, 2021 Share Posted January 7, 2021 (edited) 7 minutes ago, ron883 said: You just said that all cops are bad until proven otherwise. Regarding your last sentence - any solutions to meet your threshold of 0 bad cops in the entire country? Let's stop throwing out ridiculously unachievable utopian fantasies here. Of course it's ridiculously unachievable, but I want those who are outed as bad to be held accountable. Apparently that's too much to ask. When I said that, that is my personal opinion in an encounter with a police officer. Even if I know a person personally, that might be a cop, I have no idea what they do on the job. Cops are bad until proven otherwise, means that I have to assume they're potentially bad until proven otherwise. They want that to change? Hold bad cops accountable. It's up to them to do it. The police department is not the fucking mafia. I refuse to give the police the benefit of the doubt until they have some sort of accountability. How can I trust them to police my neighborhood when I cannot trust them to police themselves? Edited January 7, 2021 by Jack Parkman 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted January 7, 2021 Share Posted January 7, 2021 1 hour ago, southsider2k5 said: Marc Short is his name...haven't gotten to the final page of this yet, but FOUR (4) are now dead, not just that lone woman who was critically wounded/shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcq Posted January 7, 2021 Share Posted January 7, 2021 (edited) 9 hours ago, StrangeSox said: Easy starting list of people to expel: Edited January 7, 2021 by pcq Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted January 7, 2021 Share Posted January 7, 2021 (edited) ACAB=had to look that one up There has to be some degree of nuance, here. Obviously, not all cops are bad/bastards, whatever. That said, if people of all races and creeds witnessed the same exact response to these riots/protests as what we saw in Lafayette Park over the summer, we wouldn't be having such an argument. In that situation, the Secret Service and National Guard were assertive/aggressive, and pretty much instigated all the action, as well as choreographing a series of coordinated tear gas attacks...which were ostensibly to clear a path so Trump could pull his Bible stunt in front of that church, and the good 'ol law and order show of force. Here, you had so many issues with the security lines/defensive perimeter (granted, a much bigger area to provide coverage) that it was almost impossible to stop the protest advance without using deadly force. So when clearly the Lafayette Park situation, where you had protestors surrounded/hemmed in and outnumbered....here you had officers in an impossible tactical situation where they were simply overwhelmed or gave way intentionally. Even the officer with only a baton trying to protect the Senate lobby...you could almost see him thinking that striking one of the first protesters up the stairs would 1) not stop the mob behind him, and 2) likely injure himself in the process/inflame the crowd, and 3) that a delaying/stalling approach while waiting for reinforcements was the wisest course of action. Had he opened fire with a sidearm into the crowd, one can only imagine how much worse things would have gotten. All these things are understandable enough. The problem is that it's almost inconceivable that BLM/Antifa protesters wouldn't have been violently assaulted were the situation reversed. Taking selfies with those guys? Not cracking them over the head with batons and bombarding them with pepper spray? The body count would have been in the high teens or even 100's. Yet these protesters were almost treated with deference and there was even a common bond/camaraderie evident in some of the reactions or interactions. Just watch videos of the Chicago Democratic Convention in 1968 or The Trial of the Chicago Seven. It had nothing like that feel, it was more like unruly college kids who'd somehow burst through security, couldn't believe they'd gotten so far...and tore down the goal posts just for the heck of it (the mob mentality setting in and subsuming individual ethics or morality.) Edited January 7, 2021 by caulfield12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted January 7, 2021 Share Posted January 7, 2021 Apparently Rudy Giuliani called Tommy Tuberville yesterday to tell him to slow the process down and object to as many as 10 states, so they can buy Thump some time. Turns out Rudy left a message on the wrong senators phone and he is becoming an internet sensation. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted January 7, 2021 Share Posted January 7, 2021 52 minutes ago, Dick Allen said: Apparently Rudy Giuliani called Tommy Tuberville yesterday to tell him to slow the process down and object to as many as 10 states, so they can buy Thump some time. Turns out Rudy left a message on the wrong senators phone and he is becoming an internet sensation. https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/rudy-giuliani-accidentally-leaves-voicemail-042600037.html Full recording of call included... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted January 7, 2021 Share Posted January 7, 2021 (edited) Edited January 7, 2021 by StrangeSox 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hogan873 Posted January 7, 2021 Author Share Posted January 7, 2021 A lot more talk last night and this morning on news outlets about the police (or some of them anyway) being involved in the incident yesterday. There's plenty of video evidence of the police either letting the mob in or not trying to stop them. It's frustrating because everyone knew this was coming. The police were either not prepared or the planning was lax on purpose. Now four people are dead and there is a huge black mark in history. On a side note, Morning Joe went on a tirade this morning on MSNBC and dropped the F-bomb, saying that the police just opened the fucking doors for the mob. I'm sure there's a suspension coming, but he's right to be infuriated. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hogan873 Posted January 7, 2021 Author Share Posted January 7, 2021 4 minutes ago, StrangeSox said: I was listening to this as I was getting ready for work. He's usually loud and brash, but he was REALLY pissed this morning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NWINFan Posted January 7, 2021 Share Posted January 7, 2021 Many have been saying that we need to have a dialogue with Trump supporters to understand what they think and want. What kind of dialogue can we have now? And you Trumpies: How would you like it if a mob stormed the White House to terrorize Trump, his family, and his staff? Would that make America great again? We have a god damned thug in power, and we shouldn't have to wait 13 days to rid the country of him. He should be prosecuted as soon as possible. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted January 7, 2021 Share Posted January 7, 2021 What is going to be great is we will survive this. Life will go on and this will be forgotten. What is going to be horrible is we will survive this. Life will go on and this will be forgotten. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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