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Official: McCann is a Met, $40/4 years

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33 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Time will tell if Lucas will want to work with Grandal, or start working in Spring Training with the presumptive number 2 and work with them through the season.

Hopefully the Sox can pick up a solid defensive number 2 catcher, who can work with young pitchers. Don't care if they bat .150 like Perez in Cleveland, defense and game management far more important from a catcher, the bat is just an added bonus.

Not saying you’re doing this, but I think there’s a tendency on here to make more out of Giolito’s preference for McCann than there really was.  
 

I doubt it was any horrible dislike of working with Grandal overall.  Probably just had a great relationship with James who was there to help turn him into one of the best pitchers in the game.  Sure James might be a little better at stuff than Grandal, but this idea that Gio is going to refuse to work with Grandal like some snobby b**** just doesn’t seem likely to me- seems totally out of his character.  He’ll put his big boy pants on just like everybody else and get to work with Tony LaRussa and Grandal and fight for championships

 

 

 

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He was awesome for us. Was an all star, caught Giolito's no no and now will get paid. I wish him the absolute best. 

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1 hour ago, Jerksticks said:

Not saying you’re doing this, but I think there’s a tendency on here to make more out of Giolito’s preference for McCann than there really was.  

I doubt it was any horrible dislike of working with Grandal overall.  Probably just had a great relationship with James who was there to help turn him into one of the best pitchers in the game.  Sure James might be a little better at stuff than Grandal, but this idea that Gio is going to refuse to work with Grandal like some snobby b**** just doesn’t seem likely to me- seems totally out of his character.  He’ll put his big boy pants on just like everybody else and get to work with Tony LaRussa and Grandal and fight for championships

I agree, and don't necessarily see a "dislike" or issue between the two, but Lucas was obviously more comfortable with McCann. However, the White Sox also used McCann over Grandal for nearly every rookie start, and Lopez could have benefited from additional starts with McCann as well. I believe the team chose McCann over Grandal in these games for his game management and pregame work and game plan, and it's clear they responded well.

  • Dunning = McCann 5 games, Collins 1, Grandal 1 (Grandal's start the only game the Sox lost with Dunning starting).
  • Stiever = McCann caught his "good game", Grandal his shellacking. 
  • Lopez = His best start, facing Cleveland on the road, was with McCann.

Lucas didn't mention Grandal among the key 2020 acquisitions during his Score interview after the playoffs, though not necessarily reading anything into the omission.

Stone said and tweeted on multiple occasions Grandal doesn't bring the same level of game preparation or attention to detail as McCann did. If true, hopefully he will commit to that aspect of the game with McCann gone.

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3 hours ago, poppysox said:

Could of/should of been with us.

Sorry Poppy it's my pet peeve .Could've should've is correct and when pronounced sounds like should of and could of, so is very very often written that way. Don't hate me. Learning contractions in 5th grade just stuck with me.

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48 minutes ago, YouCanPutItOnTheBoardYES! said:

 

Sounds like this is a done deal within the next day or so. 

Edited by maloney.adam

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1 hour ago, SoxAce said:

He was awesome for us. Was an all star, caught Giolito's no no and now will get paid. I wish him the absolute best. 

Couldn't agree more. Happy for him. Although I do wonder just how much he'll be able to maintain his bat as a starter. We saw him wear down at the end of 2019, and I am not overly convinced his bat is going to hold up.

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1 hour ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

Sorry Poppy it's my pet peeve .Could've should've is correct and when pronounced sounds like should of and could of, so is very very often written that way. Don't hate me. Learning contractions in 5th grade just stuck with me.

Correct...need to slow up sometime.

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Personally, I live in NYC and a bunch of my friends are Mets fans, so at least I'll get to see James a few times in person a year.  If it can't be the Sox, the Mets are fine by me.

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1 hour ago, maloney.adam said:

Sounds like this is a done deal within the next day or so. 

Seems like a very fair deal. I'm happy for James but will miss him and I'm sure he wouldn't have taken that same deal with Sox (if it is true) just because this enables him a bigger opportunity from a playing time perspective.  

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7 minutes ago, Timmy U said:

Personally, I live in NYC and a bunch of my friends are Mets fans, so at least I'll get to see James a few times in person a year.  If it can't be the Sox, the Mets are fine by me.

I’ve always liked the Mets as NY’s Sox-equivalent. Plus David Wright seemed like a cool guy when I was growing up

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McCann is going to be a better overall player on a better overall contract than Grandal.  Sox fucked up with this one.

I wish the Sox had an owner like Cohen.  Then he'd respond by signing Realmuto and Bauer and we'd be better off anyway.

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McCann probably would have signed easily for 3/21 before 2020, maybe even 4/24 or 4/26 with the 4th year being an option.

Grandal will be Hahn's new Melky Cabrera: solid player, not the best, good hitter, not worth the contract.

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I'm more than happy for him, but I still don't know how good he is. I wouldn't be surprised if he fell off the face of the earth just as much as I wouldn't be surprised if he became a perennial above average player. 

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33 minutes ago, YourWhatHurts said:

McCann probably would have signed easily for 3/21 before 2020, maybe even 4/24 or 4/26 with the 4th year being an option.

Grandal will be Hahn's new Melky Cabrera: solid player, not the best, good hitter, not worth the contract.

Please stop. Grandal is a top 2 catcher in baseball period. Do some research. Look up some advanced stats. Stop it.

Edited by Orlando
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45 minutes ago, Orlando said:

Please stop. Grandal is a top 2 catcher in baseball period. Do some research. Look up some advanced stats. Stop it.

Except McCann has a higher WAR since beginning of 2019. Doesn't necessarily mean McCann is as good, but it raises the question. And the first part of his post is certainly true. McCann could have been had at probably 7-8 mil a year vs Grandal at 18.5.

People say McCann would have been over exposed with more playing time, but he would have had to hit .140 with a .250 slugging in those extra at bats to equal Grandal. Granted, losing ten points on his obp is easier to imagine, but that's still speculative. In actual performance we know for sure, McCann outperformed him over the last 222 games.

Edited by Vulture
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1 hour ago, Vulture said:

Except McCann has a higher WAR since beginning of 2019. Doesn't necessarily mean McCann is as good, but it raises the question. And the first part of his post is certainly true. McCann could have been had at probably 7-8 mil a year vs Grandal at 18.5.

People say McCann would have been over exposed with more playing time, but he would have had to hit .140 with a .250 slugging in those extra at bats to equal Grandal. Granted, losing ten points on his obp is easier to imagine, but that's still speculative. In actual performance we know for sure, McCann outperformed him over the last 222 games.

Not to mention Grandal is 1 1/2 years older, with age a significant factor for catchers versus other positions.

My problems with the signing remain:

  • The Sox had much more pressing needs than upgrading the catcher position, needs that remain (RF and SP).
  • It was unlikely any out-performance by Grandal (assuming it occurs) over McCann was worth more than double the contract money the Sox are paying Grandal ($18.25M / year) over McCann's reported deal.
  • McCann's work with the pitching staff was as, if not more valuable than any upgrade in pitch framing Grandal offered. McCann worked during the off-season to improve his pitch framing, and it paid off, one of the reasons his WAR was higher.
  • Time will tell, but I don't think Grandal will age well or be able to catch 120 + games a year over the final few years (age 32-34 years) of his contract, and will suffer a drop-off in production due to age/attrition. He will need to play DH/1B more with each year, negating his offensive value from the catcher spot and taking playing time from the backlog the Sox already have at those two positions (Abreu, Vaughn, Jimenez and other prospects).

Keuchel was the only signing I liked last off-season, because the contract was good and it fit a need. Money spent on Parrot and Grandal was better spent on more SP and a RF. The Sox were running on fumes and couldn't find a viable third playoff starter 60 games into the year.

 

Edited by South Side Hit Men
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McCann at half the price of Grandal would of been the better route as we look at this a year later. But that ship has sailed.

Grandal is hard to figure out. His defense gets high grades from the analytics people, but often fails the eye test. And now I understand why we heard these negative things from Dodger and Brewer fans about his defense. He makes some real basic errors and often times has trouble catching breaking balls. But he also brings a lot to the table - particularly offensively, and the pitch framing.

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6 hours ago, YourWhatHurts said:

McCann is going to be a better overall player on a better overall contract than Grandal.  Sox fucked up with this one.

I wish the Sox had an owner like Cohen.  Then he'd respond by signing Realmuto and Bauer and we'd be better off anyway.

The real Cohen doesn’t appear to be signing Realmuto.

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6 hours ago, YourWhatHurts said:

McCann probably would have signed easily for 3/21 before 2020, maybe even 4/24 or 4/26 with the 4th year being an option.

Grandal will be Hahn's new Melky Cabrera: solid player, not the best, good hitter, not worth the contract.

This is a laughable comparison.

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6 hours ago, TaylorStSox said:

I'm more than happy for him, but I still don't know how good he is. I wouldn't be surprised if he fell off the face of the earth just as much as I wouldn't be surprised if he became a perennial above average player. 

Exactly.  We know he calls a good game and handles the staff well, but he has some flaws defensively and the bat is still a huge question mark.  I was a hater turned supporter, but some people here act like he’s a proven super-star

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5 hours ago, Vulture said:

Except McCann has a higher WAR since beginning of 2019. Doesn't necessarily mean McCann is as good, but it raises the question. And the first part of his post is certainly true. McCann could have been had at probably 7-8 mil a year vs Grandal at 18.5.

People say McCann would have been over exposed with more playing time, but he would have had to hit .140 with a .250 slugging in those extra at bats to equal Grandal. Granted, losing ten points on his obp is easier to imagine, but that's still speculative. In actual performance we know for sure, McCann outperformed him over the last 222 games.

Higher WAR based on what?  Grandal put up more fWAR in 2019 than McCann did in 2019 & 2020 combined.  If you’re looking at bWAR, then you’re completely ignoring framing which is a big piece of what Grandal brings to the table.  And let’s not ignore the massive track record Yasmani has with the bat whereas James has only recently shown signs of being more than a platoon bat.  It’s possible that McCann suddenly is a star hitter, but I’d wager lots of money he is line for some serious regression if used as a starting catcher.

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I am happy for James but remember that Grandal hitting lefty really helped balance our lineup. 

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