South Side Hit Men Posted February 26, 2021 Share Posted February 26, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Bad Hombre said: https://www.radio.com/670thescore/podcasts/best-of-the-score-20603/tony-la-russa-on-rejoining-the-white-sox-357967190 TDLR: "So Crochet, Kopech, uh, are, uh, the organization's attitude is that, what's best now. And there's no doubt that Kopech, and probably, possibly Crochet, as a starter later. But for this year, for them and for us, that they start the year in the bullpen. and it makes it deeper and deeper." So there is hedging and or thinking through what he wanted to reveal there. I believe most people will interpret that direct quote to mean is development of the two primary SP prospects in the White Sox organization takes a back seat to the bullpen needs of 2021. If the plan is to eventually work both 2-3 + innings well into the season for a good number of appearances to reach 100-120 innings, on the road to becoming starters in 2022, it's a good / acceptable plan, though I can also see an argument to stretch them out in the minors to start the season. If they are going 70-80 innings in 2021, with the sole/primary consideration during the season being how do we win "today", be it July 3 or April 29, or September 15, then this will be a long term waste of valuable assets. Edited February 26, 2021 by South Side Hit Men Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted February 26, 2021 Share Posted February 26, 2021 14 minutes ago, Tony said: I don’t totally like it and think they could have signed some guys to fairly cheap deals to allow Kopech time in AAA, but look at it this way......what you’re obviously getting at is this speeds up the service time clock for Kopech, he’ll reach Arb status and FA status sooner.......if cost is an issue with Kopech and as fans we believe the Sox won’t spend enough to keep Kopech around, something went VERY right in the development process and we are probably talking about a World Series with the Sox over the next three years. Honestly, my big concern with Kopech is if he’s so constrained innings wise this year that he’ll likely also be constrained next year. He can be a piece of the equation, don’t get me wrong, but I don’t think he’ll be fully unleashed until 2023. And if that is the case, having that extra year of control at the tail-end of our window would be incredibly valuable. IMO, having Michael pitch out of the bullpen for two months at Charlotte makes way more sense, especially if we’re committed to Crochet being in the major league bullpen. The bullpen should already be a strength and we can survive with one of these youngsters in AAA to start the season. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted February 26, 2021 Share Posted February 26, 2021 12 minutes ago, flavum said: It’s a puzzle to distribute 1460 innings. Kopech and Crochet can both get 100 innings out of the pen/spot starting and be fresh for October too. But so can Lopez & Rodon. Kopech could make 20 four inning starts if called up June 1st. We can someone to fill in the missing 20 innings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YourWhatHurts Posted February 26, 2021 Share Posted February 26, 2021 Putting Vaughn at 1B and Kopech and Crochet in the pen to open the season is a huge Sox olive branch to the players union. That's the only thing that makes sense, because losing 1 year control on each of these players is just not anywhere near worth whatever the "reward" here is. If the Sox are making moves like this, then hopefully other clubs do it also, and hopefully this means we get a full 2022 season. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rounding_Third Posted February 26, 2021 Share Posted February 26, 2021 1 minute ago, Chicago White Sox said: Honestly, my big concern with Kopech is if he’s so constrained innings wise this year that he’ll likely also be constrained next year. He can be a piece of the equation, don’t get me wrong, but I don’t think he’ll be fully unleashed until 2023. And if that is the case, having that extra year of control at the tail-end of our window would be incredibly valuable. IMO, having Michael pitch out of the bullpen for two months at Charlotte makes way more sense, especially if we’re committed to Crochet being in the major league bullpen. The bullpen should already be a strength and we can survive with one of these youngsters in AAA to start the season. If Kopech has no health issues and get his full innings limit, he'll start in 2022 with unlimited innings. If I remember correctly, both Buehrle & Sale did just one bullpen year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted February 26, 2021 Share Posted February 26, 2021 I'd rather Kopech started the year in the minors and then came up to start (if there was a spot open) or pen after we got the extra year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Posted February 26, 2021 Share Posted February 26, 2021 5 minutes ago, YourWhatHurts said: Putting Vaughn at 1B and Kopech and Crochet in the pen to open the season is a huge Sox olive branch to the players union. That's the only thing that makes sense, because losing 1 year control on each of these players is just not anywhere near worth whatever the "reward" here is. If the Sox are making moves like this, then hopefully other clubs do it also, and hopefully this means we get a full 2022 season. I do think there is something that plays into that, especially with what went down in Seattle. 8 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: Honestly, my big concern with Kopech is if he’s so constrained innings wise this year that he’ll likely also be constrained next year. He can be a piece of the equation, don’t get me wrong, but I don’t think he’ll be fully unleashed until 2023. And if that is the case, having that extra year of control at the tail-end of our window would be incredibly valuable. IMO, having Michael pitch out of the bullpen for two months at Charlotte makes way more sense, especially if we’re committed to Crochet being in the major league bullpen. The bullpen should already be a strength and we can survive with one of these youngsters in AAA to start the season. At this point, we have to hope Katz and the Front Office knows better than we do. I would put money on the fact they do.....but we'll see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rounding_Third Posted February 26, 2021 Share Posted February 26, 2021 Just now, manbearpuig said: I'd rather Kopech started the year in the minors and then came up to start (if there was a spot open) or pen after we got the extra year. The problem I see with that it then they'd have to plug someone in his slot when he retired for the year and most likely earlier than the current plan. This plan may allow him to pitch all year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigHurt3515 Posted February 26, 2021 Share Posted February 26, 2021 I would guess they will build Kopech up to end up starting come July possibly? So he still has enough innings for September/October I don't hate the idea of Rodon/Kopech in the 5th spot to begin with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirmin' for Yermin Posted February 26, 2021 Share Posted February 26, 2021 28 minutes ago, Rounding_Third said: If Kopech has no health issues and get his full innings limit, he'll start in 2022 with unlimited innings. If I remember correctly, both Buehrle & Sale did just one bullpen year. but they also pitched the year before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirmin' for Yermin Posted February 26, 2021 Share Posted February 26, 2021 5 minutes ago, BigHurt3515 said: I would guess they will build Kopech up to end up starting come July possibly? So he still has enough innings for September/October I don't hate the idea of Rodon/Kopech in the 5th spot to begin with. IDK how you build up his innings in a bullpen role to then let him start fully this year. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rounding_Third Posted February 26, 2021 Share Posted February 26, 2021 3 minutes ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said: but they also pitched the year before. Buehrle didn't; just 1 second half year in pen with 3 July starts then all pen after. For Sale 1 & 1/2 years; maybe extra cautious due to his thin frame & arm. Also was use primarily as closer and setup so maybe he's not the good comparison for Kopech I thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted February 26, 2021 Share Posted February 26, 2021 28 minutes ago, BigHurt3515 said: I would guess they will build Kopech up to end up starting come July possibly? So he still has enough innings for September/October I don't hate the idea of Rodon/Kopech in the 5th spot to begin with. Not the Rodon is likely to even be healthy or anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted February 26, 2021 Share Posted February 26, 2021 2 hours ago, Rounding_Third said: Buehrle didn't; just 1 second half year in pen with 3 July starts then all pen after. For Sale 1 & 1/2 years; maybe extra cautious due to his thin frame & arm. Also was use primarily as closer and setup so maybe he's not the good comparison for Kopech I thought. Sale should always be used as a cautionary tale rather than a comparison. He was almost turned into a permanent reliever when he had arm problems in his first season as a starter, the team even announced they were permanently turning him into their closer when he returned from injury, and he had to have a screaming match with KW and co to be let back into the rotation . Not exactly the way you want to handle things professionally, and teaching Sale that the way to get what he wanted from this team was to have a giant tantrum also probably not great in hindsight. Thank goodness the team listened though. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rounding_Third Posted February 26, 2021 Share Posted February 26, 2021 12 minutes ago, Balta1701 said: Sale should always be used as a cautionary tale rather than a comparison. He was almost turned into a permanent reliever when he had arm problems in his first season as a starter, the team even announced they were permanently turning him into their closer when he returned from injury, and he had to have a screaming match with KW and co to be let back into the rotation . Not exactly the way you want to handle things professionally, and teaching Sale that the way to get what he wanted from this team was to have a giant tantrum also probably not great in hindsight. Thank goodness the team listened though. Man, I completely forgot about that 1st Sale tantrum. So funny now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaliSoxFanViaSWside Posted February 26, 2021 Share Posted February 26, 2021 4 hours ago, Chicago White Sox said: Honestly, my big concern with Kopech is if he’s so constrained innings wise this year that he’ll likely also be constrained next year. He can be a piece of the equation, don’t get me wrong, but I don’t think he’ll be fully unleashed until 2023. And if that is the case, having that extra year of control at the tail-end of our window would be incredibly valuable. IMO, having Michael pitch out of the bullpen for two months at Charlotte makes way more sense, especially if we’re committed to Crochet being in the major league bullpen. The bullpen should already be a strength and we can survive with one of these youngsters in AAA to start the season. Any time I see these kind of announcements my 1st thought is nothing is written in stone. That's how we all should view it. We don't really know if Kopech or Crochet will start the season in the bullpen. The bullpen isn't bad without them. It just doesn't matter what they are saying now. Seems just as likely they start in the minors depending on how they look in the spring. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poppysox Posted February 26, 2021 Share Posted February 26, 2021 5 hours ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said: all season because Crochet and Kopech won't have the stamina to start.. I guess they could piggyback them? Rodon, Crochet, and Kopech will all be involved in games as openers or in tandem with openers IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raBBit Posted February 26, 2021 Share Posted February 26, 2021 Personally I would start with Kopech in the minors but I am not going to be upset about having his arm in the pen. Our bullpen should be of the very best in the league. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShoeLessRob Posted February 26, 2021 Share Posted February 26, 2021 Knowing this now makes their lack of pursuit of starting pitching depth looks even more stupid. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sambuca Posted February 27, 2021 Share Posted February 27, 2021 Is the minor league season starting on time? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjusttyped Posted February 27, 2021 Share Posted February 27, 2021 17 minutes ago, Sambuca said: Is the minor league season starting on time? AAA - Begins April 6th AA & A Ball - Begins May 4th Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjusttyped Posted February 27, 2021 Share Posted February 27, 2021 39 minutes ago, ShoeLessRob said: Knowing this now makes their lack of pursuit of starting pitching depth looks even more stupid. I agree, but Hahn specifically mentioned Kopech is on a plan similar to that of Julio Urias of the Dodgers. He's going to start and pitch in relief at various points this season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted February 27, 2021 Share Posted February 27, 2021 2 hours ago, raBBit said: Personally I would start with Kopech in the minors but I am not going to be upset about having his arm in the pen. Our bullpen should be of the very best in the league. I'd be ok pitching him out of the pen after keeping down about 2 months or whatever if is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boopa1219 Posted February 27, 2021 Share Posted February 27, 2021 Every pitcher has a limited number of bullets in their arms. I want as many of those bullets as possible spent in the major leagues. Smart move by the Sox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chick Mercedes Posted February 27, 2021 Share Posted February 27, 2021 (edited) For the most part, teams don’t take their best rotation prospects and stack them in their MLB bullpen. I don’t get it. We don’t even need them. If you’ll pitch them out of the pen this year, then why not instead get them ready in the minors to start later in the season if bad things happen? If they are still thought of as starters. Edited February 27, 2021 by Fernando Tatis Jr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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