Blake Snell and Yu Darvish traded to San Diego

[Harry Chappas]

2 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

I absolutely agree with that.  It is obvious that Hahn had his eye set on Hinch, and from the reactions of the players, had already pitched them on the idea.  JR 100% overruled that.  But that only supports that idea that JR interfered here to create the situation HE wanted, and not the one the front office wanted.

I agree but I think the front office is content with it for now.  I think JR probably had to sell them but if Williams and Hahn were vehemently opposed I think they do go in a different direction.

[Harry Chappas]

3 minutes ago, southsideirish71 said:

Why is Larussa here?  Is he here to run a course or to win championships.  Rick Hahn said we are now in our championship window.  Adam Eaton is not a championship RF.  Championship teams dont fill their RF with platoon players as a major acquisition.  

Eaton was literally a championship RF in 2019. 

[southsider2k5]

1 minute ago, Harry Chappas said:

I agree but I think the front office is content with it for now.  I think JR probably had to sell them but if Williams and Hahn were vehemently opposed I think they do go in a different direction.

That is a pretty generous reading of the situation.  I mean in the world, if your boss tells you to put a hire on the list, how many people out there are going to oppose the guy who signs the checks?  If Jerry told them to put TLR on the list it seems REALLY obvious what he is telling them.

[southsideirish71]

1 minute ago, Tony said:

It’s a very fair question and I’m not saying the Sox shouldn’t move all their chips in at some point. I’ve said it before when it comes to the Bears, I actually respect Pace going all-in on Mitch, and saying “This is my guy, and I’m letting everyone know it.” Terrible execution and I believe he should be fired for that mistake, but I at least can respect the willingness to be aggressive. 

 Now in terms of the Sox...1. As others have mentioned, I’ll be shocked if the Sox don’t figure out a way to lock up Gio. If they don’t, shame on them. 2. If they are “done” with moves this off-season and this is the 2021 squad, then once again, shame on them. I believe they need another SP, a CL and another bat somewhere. I will be disappointed if another SP and CL aren’t brought in. 3. Thinking bigger picture....when you go “all-in” that means you are no longer hedging your bet, you no longer have any “safety net” under you. For the Sox, those safety nets are Andrew Vaughn, Michael Kopech, Madrigal to some extent, and a few others. Given where the Sox are what we we believe they can be...I honestly don’t know what I want them to do. I could be convinced either way. I always stand by the principle that there isn’t an untouchable player in sports, so if Vaughn and Kopech get traded for an ace, so be it. Win and I’m happy. But I think with this core, and the somewhat unique situation Hahn has put them contractually with long-term deals....I also see the side of having those prospect “waves” make impacts with the team over the next 5-7 years. 

That was a long, rambling was of saying I really don’t know what the Sox should do, but going “all-in” when the window opens isn’t always the right call.  The good news is we all get to find out together over the next 4-5 years 

There is another method of getting talent besides trades and losing players.  One just involves money.  Remember all of that money that we saved by tanking for years.  The money that we also wasted on players like Jon Jay, Alonso and other fillers that we signed during the rebuild.  I am not saying just empty the bank.  But picking up Trevor Bauer or Springer immediately makes this team better and in a much better position to win in the short and long term.  

[Chicago White Sox]

2 hours ago, Dick Allen said:

Jerry is going for it with a 76 year old manager, a 34 year old 40 lbs. overweight pitcher on a 1 year contract, and a reclimation project in RF. SD, the NL version of the White Sox signs Machado to a contract the White Sox couldn't afford. They trade for Clevenger at the deadline. Trade for Snell. About to get Darvish and maybe some more. One guy wants to win, one guy wants to die with as much money as possible.

The fact that Adam Eaton is our RF truly sucks.  I get maybe it would have been tough to convince Springer to play RF in Chicago vs. CF for the Mets near his hometown, but Joc Pederson provides a much higher ceiling than Adam and should have been very gettable at a reasonable price.  But we got to pinch pennies to ensure Uncle Jerry takes on no financial risk whatsoever.  He’s obviously not Jeffrey Loria bad, but he’s easily amongst the worst owners in baseball.

[pcq]

4 minutes ago, southsideirish71 said:

Why is Larussa here?  Is he here to run a course or to win championships.  Rick Hahn said we are now in our championship window.  Adam Eaton is not a championship RF.  Championship teams dont fill their RF with platoon players as a major acquisition.  

It was Jerry's input of course for Tony but if JR had a Woodrow for Larue he should have spoken up when U2 was still having hit records.

[fathom]

I’m surprised by how many think it’s a three year window when so many of the core players are locked up longer than that.

[mqr]

2 minutes ago, Harry Chappas said:

Eaton was literally a championship RF in 2019. 

Had a pretty damn good case for WS MVP no less.

[Harry Chappas]

4 minutes ago, Tony said:

It’s a very fair question and I’m not saying the Sox shouldn’t move all their chips in at some point. I’ve said it before when it comes to the Bears, I actually respect Pace going all-in on Mitch, and saying “This is my guy, and I’m letting everyone know it.” Terrible execution and I believe he should be fired for that mistake, but I at least can respect the willingness to be aggressive. 

Now in terms of the Sox...1. As others have mentioned, I’ll be shocked if the Sox don’t figure out a way to lock up Gio. If they don’t, shame on them. 2. If they are “done” with moves this off-season and this is the 2021 squad, then once again, shame on them. I believe they need another SP, a CL and another bat somewhere. I will be disappointed if another SP and CL aren’t brought in. 3. Thinking bigger picture....when you go “all-in” that means you are no longer hedging your bet, you no longer have any “safety net” under you. For the Sox, those safety nets are Andrew Vaughn, Michael Kopech, Madrigal to some extent, and a few others. Given where the Sox are what we we believe they can be...I honestly don’t know what I want them to do. I could be convinced either way. I always stand by the principle that there isn’t an untouchable player in sports, so if Vaughn and Kopech get traded for an ace, so be it. Win and I’m happy. But I think with this core, and the somewhat unique situation Hahn has put them contractually with long-term deals....I also see the side of having those prospect “waves” make impacts with the team over the next 5-7 years. 

That was a long, rambling was of saying I really don’t know what the Sox should do, but going “all-in” when the window opens isn’t always the right call.  The good news is we all get to find out together over the next 4-5 years 

I don't think Snell is the all in kind of move and that is what I find frustrating about this board currently. 

The Padres got him because they had depth in the farm that the Sox may have in a year or two but it was not allowed to play out in 2020.  

[southsideirish71]

2 minutes ago, Harry Chappas said:

Eaton was literally a championship RF in 2019. 

If you think he is a championship RF in 2021 then Jerry has his perfect fan.  Howie Kendrick was a championship player in 2019 maybe we can get him out of retirement next.  

[mqr]

3 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

The fact that Adam Eaton is our RF truly sucks.  I get maybe it would have been tough to convince Springer to play RF in Chicago vs. CF for the Mets near his hometown, but Joc Pederson provides a much higher ceiling than Adam and should have been very gettable at a reasonable price.  But we got to pinch pennies to ensure Uncle Jerry takes on no financial risk whatsoever.  He’s obviously not Jeffrey Loria bad, but he’s easily amongst the worst owners in baseball.

I really don't see why Joc would be any better an acquisition than Eaton. 

Or at least so substantially so that it's worth being upset over. 

Edited December 28, 2020 by mqr

[Sleepy Harold]

Padres can't stop, won't stop.

[Tony]

2 minutes ago, Harry Chappas said:

I don't think Snell is the all in kind of move and that is what I find frustrating about this board currently. 

The Padres got him because they had depth in the farm that the Sox may have in a year or two but it was not allowed to play out in 2020.  

Again, very fair point. 

[Tony]

4 minutes ago, southsideirish71 said:

There is another method of getting talent besides trades and losing players.  One just involves money.  Remember all of that money that we saved by tanking for years.  The money that we also wasted on players like Jon Jay, Alonso and other fillers that we signed during the rebuild.  I am not saying just empty the bank.  But picking up Trevor Bauer or Springer immediately makes this team better and in a much better position to win in the short and long term.  

Don’t disagree at all, and one of my biggest gripes. And I fall victim to it myself. Yes, there isn’t an endless treasure chest of funds available every year, but they’ve never spent like a major-market team. And holes can 100% be filled by simply using money. Now I can’t argue with how money has been allocated thus far for the 2021 roster, they really aren’t holding the bag on any bad deals which is somewhat rare for a team, but in theory that should be more reason for them to spend now. 

[Harry Chappas]

4 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

That is a pretty generous reading of the situation.  I mean in the world, if your boss tells you to put a hire on the list, how many people out there are going to oppose the guy who signs the checks?  If Jerry told them to put TLR on the list it seems REALLY obvious what he is telling them.

My original point when bringing up jerry jones  is that I think JR does get what he wants but I do not think he is forcing the issue and turning off the front office in the process.  That does not seem to be his MO.  I think he has a say but I do not think it is a my way or the highway type of thing.   Did this front office want Abreu back last winter? 

Also as was pointed out why now force TRL on the front office.  There was ample opportunity to do this previously, why do it now?   

[SCCWS]

28 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

The fact that Hahn said that he had a whole interview list that never got to once Jerry latched on to Tony shows otherwise.  I don't know that he gets involved in everything, but JR does get what he wants when he does want something,  That much is clear.  We have other instances in this teams history, such as the contracts which were directly negotiated by Jerry.

I agree. JR said  he wanted TL and Hahn and KW said here is the contract. But that is the owner's prerogative.  It was the same thing in Boston. Bloom had a list as well but once ownership said Cora, Bloom was quick to agree. 

[southsideirish71]

6 minutes ago, mqr said:

I really don't see why Joc would be any better an acquisition than Eaton. 

Or at least so substantially so that it's worth being upset over. 

You might want to check the difference in how many times Eaton has been on the DL versus Pederson. 

[Chicago White Sox]

1 hour ago, southsideirish71 said:

Yeah but they are adding top front line players.  We added Lynn and grindy mcgrinderson in RF.  

To be fair, Lynn has been a better pitcher than Snell the last two years.  I think it should be as clear as day now that if Jerry was unwilling to sign Bauer, that Lynn was probably our best play at a TOR starter given the insane prices for younger guys with more control.  Just sucks that we seem to have a very tight budget for 2021 and went with another reclamation project in RF as a result (this time with a minimal ceiling).

[mqr]

3 minutes ago, southsideirish71 said:

You might want to check the difference in how many times Eaton has been on the DL versus Pederson. 

Eaton has had two significant DL trips from two freak plays. It's not like he's a guy tearing a muscle every year. 

[fathom]

With the Sox making some of their moves earlier than most teams, is the board and Sox twitter going to melt down whenever other teams make a move now?  You know other fan bases were saying they wish their team was as aggressive as the Sox during the Winter Meetings.  I can’t wait for the panic when the Twins start making their moves.

[fathom]

Just now, mqr said:

Eaton has had two significant DL trips from two freak plays. It's not like he's a guy tearing a muscle every year. 

He’s in the Moncada club though of limping every time he has to run hard.

[Harry Chappas]

2 minutes ago, southsideirish71 said:

You might want to check the difference in how many times Eaton has been on the DL versus Pederson. 

Joc is a platoon player.  That seems to be an issue with your construction of a roster as Eaton is serviceable v LHP while Joc is not.

Also Joc has not signed.  While the White Sox could continue to wait him out they moved forward with the certainly to fill a role same with trading for Lynn.

The offseason is not over maybe in April this will be an issue but at this time I think the rumbling over the offseason is a little premature. 

[southsideirish71]

Just now, Harry Chappas said:

Joc is a platoon player.  That seems to be an issue with your construction of a roster as Eaton is serviceable v LHP while Joc is not.

 Also Joc has not signed.  While the White Sox could continue to wait him out they moved forward with the certainly to fill a role same with trading for Lynn.

The offseason is not over maybe in April this will be an issue but at this time I think the rumbling over the offseason is a little premature. 

I wanted Springer, not either of them.  

[mqr]

3 minutes ago, fathom said:

With the Sox making some of their moves earlier than most teams, is the board and Sox twitter going to melt down whenever other teams make a move now?  You know other fan bases were saying they wish their team was as aggressive as the Sox during the Winter Meetings.  I can’t wait for the panic when the Twins start making their moves.

I imagine it plays out much like last year. Make your moves. Have everyone handwring for a month or two, then finish making your moves, have everyone say, well that probably will work. 

[fathom]

Just now, mqr said:

I imagine it plays out much like last year. Make your moves. Have everyone handwring for a month or two, then finish making your moves, have everyone say, well that probably will work. 

That’s how they landed the great Austin Jackson!!