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White Sox are still a World Series Contender


vilehoopster
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It was reported they they offered Pederson.  They offered him more than they offered Eaton.  They offered him more than he ended up getting.  Yeah, would have been nice to get him, but I think Joc had a say in it.  He didn't sign the Sox offer.  It isn't worth crying about.  They legitimately made him a better offer than he got, what do you want them to do, hold a gun to his head and make him sign?  

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1 minute ago, chetkincaid said:

I see people here are drunk on optimism. Nevermind the obvious flaws we have I guess.

Of course there are obvious flaws..  Back end of rotation, rotation depth, depth should we lose another big bad, major league catcher depth.. Of course there are flaws.. Just less flaws than other teams.  This is still an AL contender.

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16 minutes ago, turnin' two said:

It was reported they they offered Pederson.  They offered him more than they offered Eaton.  They offered him more than he ended up getting.  Yeah, would have been nice to get him, but I think Joc had a say in it.  He didn't sign the Sox offer.  It isn't worth crying about.  They legitimately made him a better offer than he got, what do you want them to do, hold a gun to his head and make him sign?  

Part of free agent negotiations are understanding timing and the maturity of the market. The sox being in a hurry to sign a mid to low level player is nonsense when holding out in that space for the past ten years has been the smart move, that is not something to excuse away. There was no reason they had to rush to sign Eaton. Being a bad negotiator and market analyst isn't a viable excuse for missing out on a player.

Edited by Look at Ray Ray Run
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11 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Part of free agent negotiations are understanding timing and the maturity of the market. The sox being in a hurry to sign a mid to low level player is nonsense when holding out in that space for the past ten years has been the smart move, that is not something to excuse away. There was no reason they had to rush to sign Eaton. Being a bad negotiator and market analyst isn't a viable excuse for missing out on a player.

Good thing we have experts on here to tell us what’s up. 

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9 minutes ago, Greydawgfan1 said:

Good thing we have experts on here to tell us what’s up. 

Better to just gratefully listen to what Hahn tells us through Sox friendly media than to dare question him...he has only once admitted being wrong, on a certain transaction with the Padres.

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34 minutes ago, Greydawgfan1 said:

Good thing we have experts on here to tell us what’s up. 

You can look at the market for yourself if you'd like. Holding out in that space has been the smart strategic move for a decade. Rushing to sign Adam Eaton was a misjudgement of the way the low level FA market has worked. 

Hahn offered pederson more than Eaton so he liked him more ha. Then he doesn't play the market correctly and misses out on the guy he wanted.

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10 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

You can look at the market for yourself if you'd like. Holding out in that space has been the smart strategic move for a decade. Rushing to sign Adam Eaton was a misjudgement of the way the low level FA market has worked. 

Hahn offered pederson more than Eaton so he liked him more ha. Then he doesn't play the market correctly and misses out on the guy he wanted.

But how do we know this is true?  All indications are Joc wanted to play everyday.  Maybe Hahn wanted him in more of a platoon role

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2 hours ago, ptatc said:

It's not optimism. It's not saying they are going to be good regardless of the team. It's not pessimism and only looking for the problems of the team. It's just enjoying the game.  Of course every fan wants to see wins. It doesn't mean you can't enjoy the game for the game.

Point is it does get harder. I'm tired of seasons like 2007 and would like more seasons like 2005, or even 2008.

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57 minutes ago, Greydawgfan1 said:

Good thing we have experts on here to tell us what’s up. 

Actual insight, analysis and breakdown is worth something. Unlike, frankly, most of the posts I've seen you make in this thread which is just sheer complaining without contributing much of anything. 

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1 hour ago, Greydawgfan1 said:

Good thing we have experts on here to tell us what’s up. 

That's actually true in a lot of cases. I've been a Sox fan for many years and follow the team very closely. I willingly admit there are people who follow college baseball and the draft a lot more than I do. I learn a lot about modern stats and trust the offensive ones  more than the defensive ones or pitch framing due to my own investigations on them but also know there are some I do not fully grasp. Stat- Cast is also very good and not just for how far HR's travel.

  People also being people will use one or 2 stats to support an argument but many have to be taken into consideration in order to get a complete picture. Being a message board people also make arguments in short bursts so lengthy posts are deemed unreadable though a much longer argument may make more sense to the reader to fully grasp the others opinion.

It's best to keep an open mind instead of planting the roots of your knowledge so deeply in the ground. We can all learn from each other.

Edited by CaliSoxFanViaSWside
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38 minutes ago, RagahRagah said:

Point is it does get harder. I'm tired of seasons like 2007 and would like more seasons like 2005, or even 2008.

Who wouldn't? Everyone wants them to win more. Doesn't mean you can't enjoy the games. Only enjoying wins or winning seasons shouldn't be the overall goal if you are a fan of the game as opposed to a fan of winning. Doesn't mean you don't want them to win.

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4 hours ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Part of free agent negotiations are understanding timing and the maturity of the market. The sox being in a hurry to sign a mid to low level player is nonsense when holding out in that space for the past ten years has been the smart move, that is not something to excuse away. There was no reason they had to rush to sign Eaton. Being a bad negotiator and market analyst isn't a viable excuse for missing out on a player.

Ok, fine and true, but are you going to hold up the rest of your offseason waiting for Joc Pederson?  How long do you leave that offer out there?  If you make your final offer, and then just hang around waiting, well that isn't good negotiating.  Whatever your views on it, the Sox clearly abide by a pretty rigid budget.  And they clearly wanted Hendriks.  It could have been they they wanted their more minor moves out of the way so they knew exactly what they had to offer to Hendriks.  

And sometimes guys don't move off their numbers.  That has happened a lot recently too.  Heck, JBJ still got 2/24, and he waited.  

Edited by turnin' two
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19 minutes ago, turnin' two said:

Ok, fine and true, but are you going to hold up the rest of your offseason waiting for Joc Pederson?  How long do you leave that offer out there?  If you make your final offer, and then just hang around waiting, well that isn't good negotiating.  Whatever your views on it, the Sox clearly abide by a pretty rigid budget.  And they clearly wanted Hendriks.  It could have been they they wanted their more minor moves out of the way so they knew exactly what they had to offer to Hendriks.  

And sometimes guys don't move off their numbers.  That has happened a lot recently too.  Heck, JBJ still got 2/24, and he waited.  

We've been over this, but you leave that offer out there until the other options are dwindling. This year the outfielders included: Brantley, Springer, Eaton, Pederson, Grossman, Pillar, Ozuna, Schwarber, Rosario, Gardner, Profar. 

Ignoring the quality outfielders since a quality OF wasn't what the White Sox wanted...Schwarber and Eaton signed in December for larger contracts than they generally were expected to get. Pederson, Pillar, Rosario, Gardner all waited until late January to mid-February, and got smaller contracts than they were hoping for. Bradley was available until March. 

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4 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

There is still an awful lot of potential in that lineup. 

Moncada bouncing back (it looks like he is going to), and Robert taking a step forward (idk maybe, maybe not) would probably more than make up for the Eloy sized hole in the lineup year over year. 

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4 minutes ago, mqr said:

Moncada bouncing back (it looks like he is going to), and Robert taking a step forward (idk maybe, maybe not) would probably more than make up for the Eloy sized hole in the lineup year over year. 

I'm not going to go on record with any guess about how this year is going to go other than "The Dodgers aren't a team, they're using a Game Genie". Because every one who might have a really high ceiling also has a worrisome floor and/or health worries of some sort that could crop up. I'd say "get excited because winter's over and we might all live through the last 13 months", don't get too down, don't get too high, enjoy the first games, and be ready to be angry at LaRussa for something because that'll take a few days at most.

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2 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

I'm not going to go on record with any guess about how this year is going to go other than "The Dodgers aren't a team, they're using a Game Genie". Because every one who might have a really high ceiling also has a worrisome floor and/or health worries of some sort that could crop up. I'd say "get excited because winter's over and we might all live through the last 13 months", don't get too down, don't get too high, enjoy the first games, and be ready to be angry at LaRussa for something because that'll take a few days at most.

No I'm in the same boat, I'm just not hitting the panic button is all. 

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6 hours ago, ron883 said:

I wish some of you big shots with your holier-than-thou opinions would put your money where your mouth is and place ban bets, if you are so damn confident. 

What, so you can welch again.

That said, I had no takers when I offered a ban bar after posters were claiming Grandal would catch over 120 games, or the Sox would win over 105 games, this upcoming season.

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People aren’t applying the same critical eye to other teams apparently to be so negative on the Sox. Let’s look at the Yankees. Two of their best hitters never make it through a season. Voit goes down they replace him with Bruce. Which means they have poor middle infield depth, otherwise they just move DJLM over for the time being. Their bullpen after Aroldis and Green garbage compared to ours. After Cole every member of their rotation is questionable. Would you trade Kluber,  German, Taillon and Montgomery for Lynn, Keuchel, Cesase and Rodon? I sure wouldn’t. If you don’t trust Cease and Rodon how you gonna trust German and Montgomery? Same issues without the upside. Maybe Kluber rebounds I’d rather take my chances with Lynn. Keuchel or Taillon. Taillon is pure projection. Keuchel actually gets the job done. They’ve got one the worst defensive catchers in the game who also forgot how to hit. He isn’t going to help that shaky staff any. Torres is one the worst shortstops defensively. Sox have the better team

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5 hours ago, ptatc said:

Who wouldn't? Everyone wants them to win more. Doesn't mean you can't enjoy the games. Only enjoying wins or winning seasons shouldn't be the overall goal if you are a fan of the game as opposed to a fan of winning. Doesn't mean you don't want them to win.

That feeling would be a bit different if we won a division every few years or so. It's a little different when you seem to do nothing but lose. In that case enjoyment fades.

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