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the TLR managing thread

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Team had 0 RBIs, the offense in scoring position is just as bad as last year. They had no business winning this game. The other two  games however were thrown away. 

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12 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said:

I mean RR used literally the worst pitcher on the roster in the highest leverage inning of the season.  For now, TLR hasn't done that.

And Ricky's Boys blew one game after having the lead after 7 innings. Tony's team blew 2 within the first three games.

Bullpen loses 2020 after sixty games (10):  Anderson (1); Burdi (1); Cordero (2); Detwiler (1); Foster (1); Fry (1); Gonzalez (1); Marshall (1); Rodon (1).

Bullpen loses 2021 after four games (3): Bummer (1); Marshall (1); Ruiz (1).

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3 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said:

And Ricky's Boys blew one game after having the lead after 7 innings. Tony's team blew 2 within the first three games.

Bullpen loses 2020 after sixty games (10):  Anderson (1); Burdi (1); Cordero (2); Detwiler (1); Foster (1); Fry (1); Gonzalez (1); Marshall (1); Rodon (1).

Bullpen loses 2021 after four games (3): Bummer (1); Marshall (1); Ruiz (1).

Ricky got lucky with an elite bullpen. Imagine TLR with the bullpen performing that well. The Sox may have been in the world series last year if TLR was manager. 

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Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, ron883 said:

Ricky got lucky with an elite bullpen. Imagine TLR with the bullpen performing that well. The Sox may have been in the world series last year if TLR was manager. 

Dude, La Russa has Kopech, Crochet and Hendriks at his disposal, Ricky had none of these guys except Crochet for 6 innings.

The Bullpen had mostly unproven rookies last year, the bullpen this year is the one touted as "elite". What does Tony care about? Winning Saving his guy for a save opportunity.

tony.jpg?cb=1459655054

Edited by South Side Hit Men
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2 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Dude, La Russa has Kopech, Crochet and Hendriks at his disposal, Ricky had none of these guys.

The Bullpen had mostly rookies last year, the bullpen this year is the one touted as "elite". What does Tony care about? Winning Saving his guy for a save opportunity.

tony.jpg?cb=1459655054

Stop it. Last year Foster and Marshall wouldn't blow those games. Those guys were absolute nails last year. Ricky got extremely lucky with the bullpen quality last year, and he still manager to blow it. TLR gets this team past the A's, without question. 

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Just now, ron883 said:

Stop it. Last year Foster and Marshall wouldn't blow those games. Those guys were absolute nails last year. Ricky got extremely lucky with the bullpen quality last year, and he still manager to blow it. TLR gets this team past the A's, without question. 

Seriously, with the horseshit staff Hahn had for him by the time Game 3 happened? They literally did not have a starting pitcher for Game 3, after a "grueling 60 game season". 

Stop trolling already, you're wrong. Admit it or slink away.

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24 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Seriously, with the horseshit staff Hahn had for him by the time Game 3 happened? They literally did not have a starting pitcher for Game 3, after a "grueling 60 game season". 

Stop trolling already, you're wrong. Admit it or slink away.

Keep carrying water for Ricky. 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, ron883 said:

Keep carrying water for Ricky. 

Ricky's gone, there is no need. The consensus here proclaimed Tony's bullpen "skillz" would certainly lead to the Sox to superior bullpen management. The consensus also was the GM of the year, if not the upcoming decade or century, went out and acquired a legitimate third starting pitcher, and an elite bullpen, pitchers the worst manager in baseball did not have.

Yet here we are. Tony pwned by Joe Maddon to open the season. Delusional apologists like you posting ludicrous statements quoted above, claiming Ricky had better pitchers at his disposal. A barely able to speak Tony La Russa claiming "This was one of the most impressive losses I can remember being a part of".

https://www.mlb.com/video/tony-la-russa-on-tough-loss

  • A game where the Sox' lone offense was the result of errors and passed balls.
  • A game La Russa saved his $54M closer for a save, instead of facing the heart of the lineup, because he wants his guy to get saves.
  • Tony asleep at the wheel and having to stall just to get a reliever in the game, with nobody warming up.
  • Bringing in a lessor option to give up the game winning home run, the third bullpen loss in four games played.
  • Joe Maddon 2-3 steps ahead of this fool the entire series.

If Ricky Renteria, or any other White Sox manager pulled this crap, the game thread would have at least 100 fire Ricky posts, just like last year. Instead we have posters like you carrying the Pacific Ocean for Tony La Russa.

 

Edited by South Side Hit Men

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LaRussa can't call every pitch and he doesn't hit.

I was wondering why Grandal called for a fastball on 2-0 count to Jared Walsh who kills fast balls, especially from a RH pitcher.

OK, that was a mistake, but then he makes the same mistake on another 2-0 count to Walsh and he hits the walk-off home run.

So Walsh gets flat fastballs served up by Sox pitchers but  Luis Robert gets nothing but dirty sliders low and outside.

Maybe Collins or Mercedes  can call a better game.

 

 

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Posted (edited)

The fact of the matter is, if the previous guy was still here, he would be taking a lot of heat on this board after this series. The defense was bad. The bullpen certainly didn't look as good as advertised. Marshall and Ruiz getting Ls. Not good. I was laughing at Steve Stone the other night when he was jerking Tony off saying individual numbers didn't matter, it was all about the team, specifically pointing out Lance Lynn didn't get his 38th consecutive start with at least 100 pitches. He must have missed how he left Hendricks in a blowout just so he could get a save, and might have cost the Sox a game the next night.

Edited by Dick Allen
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5 hours ago, ron883 said:

The players play. The managers don't. The players blew this game, not La Russa. 

Aaron Bummer on Saturday - DNP/CD.

Liam Hendricks on Sunday - DNP/CD.

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5 hours ago, JuliusO1274 said:

 Nothing La Russa has done is irrational. Sometimes a manger deserves criticism for bullpen management but most the time it is just hindsight criticism where no one had any problems with the choice until the pitcher gives up runs.

The problem is you’re right it’s not irrational- it’s just the managing style from the 2000s. Save your best reliever for innings that turn out to not come was how things were handled then. Put your best players out there in situations that are high leverage and if they can’t hold like Thursday, that’s Madrigal’s fault.

Joe Maddon’s moves yesterday were confusing. He left Ohtani in when he was clearly gassed, and that turned into walks that turned into runs. But he got Iglesias into the game, and even though he gave up a run and Maddon asked a lot of him, he won the game. 

Managing in the 2020s just beat managing in the 2000s. Twice.

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2 hours ago, tray said:

LaRussa can't call every pitch and he doesn't hit.

I was wondering why Grandal called for a fastball on 2-0 count to Jared Walsh who kills fast balls, especially from a RH pitcher.

OK, that was a mistake, but then he makes the same mistake on another 2-0 count to Walsh and he hits the walk-off home run.

So Walsh gets flat fastballs served up by Sox pitchers but  Luis Robert gets nothing but dirty sliders low and outside.

Maybe Collins or Mercedes  can call a better game.

 

 

If you would like to make a thread about the pitch calling, that is...totally appropriate! That could be on the pitching coach prepping those guys for the game also. That Tony LaRussa is getting called out for his moves doesn’t mean no one else made mistakes. It also...doesn’t excuse them.

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If Robin Ventura or Ricky Renteria were managing a White Sox team that lost 3 games in 4 days, 2 when they were leading in the 8th inning, and 1 when it was tied in the 9th, this place would be hopping with posts calling for their heads. And they managed shitty teams.

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3 hours ago, tray said:

LaRussa can't call every pitch and he doesn't hit.

I was wondering why Grandal called for a fastball on 2-0 count to Jared Walsh who kills fast balls, especially from a RH pitcher.

OK, that was a mistake, but then he makes the same mistake on another 2-0 count to Walsh and he hits the walk-off home run.

So Walsh gets flat fastballs served up by Sox pitchers but  Luis Robert gets nothing but dirty sliders low and outside.

Maybe Collins or Mercedes  can call a better game.

 

 

Well cease was missing sliders by 3 feet. He threw a few good ones too but he was missing so many that it is understandable that grandal didn't want to fall back 3-0. 

Calling games is not just theory, sometimes a pitcher doesn't have the feel for a pitch and then you have to go with plan B even if it can mean that you get nuked. 

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Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, Dominikk85 said:

Well cease was missing sliders by 3 feet. He threw a few good ones too but he was missing so many that it is understandable that grandal didn't want to fall back 3-0. 

Calling games is not just theory, sometimes a pitcher doesn't have the feel for a pitch and then you have to go with plan B even if it can mean that you get nuked. 

This totally.  What people always forget is that the truly great pitchers are great even with their worst stuff, and unhittable with their good stuff.  
 

Everyone else in MLB is great with their good stuff and has to battle through their worst stuff.  The degree of battle is different with everybody.  

Edited by Jerksticks

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The majority of the blame for the 1-3 start is on the players.  The manager didn't make Madrigal make a bad play.  LaRussa did not cause a fly ball to smack Robert in the melon.  TLR was not batting when there were runners in scoring position.  These are professional god damn baseball players making dumb mistakes and not executing when the damn well needed to.

If this sort of play continues, it's evidence that the manager is not addressing the shortcomings and not holding the players accountable.

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Posted (edited)

From mlb.com

 

White Sox: Tony La Russa may have a learning curve
La Russa is a Hall of Famer, and this may all work out. But his first series showed some rust, from a misunderstanding of a new rule about how much time he had to challenge a call to intentionally walking Albert Pujols like it’s 2011. It is not 2011.

Edited by caulfield12

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didnt think la russa was good... but for the most part the games were decided by player blunders.

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I overall don't blame the management of tlr but I wonder why he didn't pinch hit for leury and Hamilton the last two innings. I know Billy hit well that game but he still is a bad hitter as is leury and they had Vaughn and collins on the bench. 

If you carry 3 DHs on the roster then use them to pinch hit as much as you can late in the game. 

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4 hours ago, tray said:

LaRussa can't call every pitch and he doesn't hit.

I was wondering why Grandal called for a fastball on 2-0 count to Jared Walsh who kills fast balls, especially from a RH pitcher.

OK, that was a mistake, but then he makes the same mistake on another 2-0 count to Walsh and he hits the walk-off home run.

So Walsh gets flat fastballs served up by Sox pitchers but  Luis Robert gets nothing but dirty sliders low and outside.

Maybe Collins or Mercedes  can call a better game.

 

 

On the walk off HR Walsh got a change up on the 2-0 count and swung through it . He hit the walk off HR on a 2-1 count. I don't think he had great command of his change up however but maybe he should have doubled up on it. The fastball to Walsh was up and away. The one he blew by Trout was down. In a situation with 2 runners on and 1 out . pitches just have to be down even with good low ball hitters because you want a DP.

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“I just told them upstairs, this is one of the most impressive losses that I can remember being a part of,” said La Russa in his postgame Zoom with reporters. “You look at all the stuff that went on in that game. I’m not going to say hero, I reserve that for the veterans, but the courageous stuff, the way Dylan [Cease] battled, you can go on and on.

 

😂🤣😂🤣

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1 hour ago, Dominikk85 said:

I overall don't blame the management of tlr but I wonder why he didn't pinch hit for leury and Hamilton the last two innings. I know Billy hit well that game but he still is a bad hitter as is leury and they had Vaughn and collins on the bench. 

If you carry 3 DHs on the roster then use them to pinch hit as much as you can late in the game. 

This. For any of the slap hitters.

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6 hours ago, tray said:

LaRussa can't call every pitch and he doesn't hit.

I was wondering why Grandal called for a fastball on 2-0 count to Jared Walsh who kills fast balls, especially from a RH pitcher.

OK, that was a mistake, but then he makes the same mistake on another 2-0 count to Walsh and he hits the walk-off home run.

So Walsh gets flat fastballs served up by Sox pitchers but  Luis Robert gets nothing but dirty sliders low and outside.

Maybe Collins or Mercedes  can call a better game.

 

 

After the Trout strikeout, Foster was praying to get anything over for a strike.    I can't blame Grandal on just putting his glove over the plate at that point. 

 

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1 hour ago, Dominikk85 said:

I overall don't blame the management of tlr but I wonder why he didn't pinch hit for leury and Hamilton the last two innings. I know Billy hit well that game but he still is a bad hitter as is leury and they had Vaughn and collins on the bench. 

If you carry 3 DHs on the roster then use them to pinch hit as much as you can late in the game. 

Well, first of all, Iglesias seems like a really bad matchup for Vaughn. Iglesias worked over Abreu with offspeed stuff yesterday in the 8th with offspeed stuff at the bottom of the zone, and Vaughn was absolutely flailing at those same pitches on Saturday. 

I guess you could use Collins to PH for Hamilton and then put Vaughn out in LF, but that does leave only Lamb on the bench afterwards - no one else, so Collins better have done some damage. You really didn't want to PH for Leury unless you had to because moving Moncada or Madrigal to SS and putting Lamb in - you really can't hide a guy out of position at shortstop very easily.

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