Madrigal.

[reiks12]

24 minutes ago, beautox said:

Is it just me or does it feel like he "hasn't" really gotten it going?

Finally in the positive with regards to base running and defense



 

I like how you wrote "finally" as if hes a 5 year veteran. He has 81 games to his name

[South Side Hit Men]

3 hours ago, chitownsportsfan said:

He's getting it done.  Kudos to him.  Hope he proves all his doubters wrong, including myself.  His defense has improved to tolerable as well and tolerable defense with a 110 wRC+ or therabouts from 2B is a solid starter.  Really looks like the Sox nailed their rebuild draft picks.

 

43 minutes ago, beautox said:

Is it just me or does it feel like he "hasn't" really gotten it going?

Finally in the positive with regards to base running and defense



 

Yes, he has avoided a lot of flat out stupid baserunning and fielding plays which were too commonplace last year (very costly in the playoffs) and April this year.

 If he can keep the contact rate near / at where it is, will at least be a decent 2B while under team control.

Glad I listen to games and only have to hear Benetti yell "Nicky Two Strikes" while watching condensed games.

[EloyJenkins]

26 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

 

just saw that. 0-39 is truly unbelievable. I thought he didn't have a hole in that swing? I hope this kid can recover. his Psyche has to be smashed. 

[Dick Allen]

Robin Ventura was 0-40 and got over. I am sure if this kid is as good as most think, he will get over it too.

[southsider2k5]

3 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

Robin Ventura was 0-40 and got over. I am sure if this kid is as good as most think, he will get over it too.

I really wonder how much the front office mess, with his name being right in the center of it, led him to press too much to try to prove to the world and the Mariners that they screwed up with how the handled him.

[reiks12]

29 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said:

 If he can keep the contact rate near / at where it is, will at least be a decent 2B while under team control.

4.2WAR pace is better than 'decent', thats allstar level. 

[chitownsportsfan]

Just now, reiks12 said:

4.2WAR pace is better than 'decent', thats allstar level. 

It is but we'll see if he can keep it up.  He has def traded some contact for power, which I didn't think he could do.  A .119 ISO with his contact rate is very impressive.  If he can start pulling the ball a bit more this summer he might be able to sustain that.

[reiks12]

On 5/16/2021 at 10:09 PM, chitownsportsfan said:

It's amazing how much grace he gets around here.  No, being a 1 WAR player isn't "fine" or "what he was expected to be".  I've praised the guy because he's played well at times but overall he's underwhelming and physically after watching him everyday for 60 or so games now he just doesn't have a lot of ways he can improve.  Defensively there's just not a lot of "there there".  He really needs to hit 320 to be an average starter.  That's going to be hard.  Hope he proves me wrong.

lol

[reiks12]

Just now, chitownsportsfan said:

It is but we'll see if he can keep it up.  He has def traded some contact for power, which I didn't think he could do.  A .119 ISO with his contact rate is very impressive.  If he can start pulling the ball a bit more this summer he might be able to sustain that.

in 3 years you will say the same, "can he keep it up"? you will probably be saying it until the end of his career.

[chitownsportsfan]

1 minute ago, reiks12 said:

in 3 years you will say the same, "can he keep it up"? you will probably be saying it until the end of his career.

 

3 minutes ago, reiks12 said:

lol

Never understood this genre of post and never will.  As if predicting things on inference is easy and not something experts (highly paid as well) fail at time and time again.  Better to be in the arena and have skin in the game then just mindlessly parrot a position.  His xWOBA is 50 points lower than his actual wOBA, there is def some luck involved in his line so far.  Doesn't mean he's not a good player, but it does mean that at some point he will regress and he will have to improve his true talent level.

he's already improved his baserunning to basically average and his defense, while not good, isn't horrible anymore, so sure, give him credit, as I have, uh done, time and time again as more data points emerge.  

[South Side Hit Men]

30 minutes ago, reiks12 said:

4.2WAR pace is better than 'decent', thats allstar level. 

For the umpteenth time, "pace" is meaningless. Check back at season end (for every player), after the full grind and ebbs and flows of a season.

If he registers a 4+ fWAR season in any year  it will be a major cause for celebration. A 3 win season would be solid. I think he can consistently hit 2-3 fWAR win seasons, making him a solid selection. Not doing stupid shit to cost the White Sox wins is a huge improvement, regardless of the fWAR impact.

In terms of the Jarred Kelenic start, he's 21, too early to fret. Most players, including Madrigal, are in college or Rookie/A ball at that age. Playing for that horseshit organization is a challenge in an of itself.

Edited June 7, 2021 by South Side Hit Men

[Harry Chappas]

8 minutes ago, reiks12 said:

in 3 years you will say the same, "can he keep it up"? you will probably be saying it until the end of his career.

Softest 3,115 hits you will ever see 

[chitownsportsfan]

2 minutes ago, Harry Chappas said:

Softest 3,115 hits you will ever see 

Why aim so low? I think Pete Rose needs to look out.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

11 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said:

 

Never understood this genre of post and never will.  As if predicting things on inference is easy and not something experts (highly paid as well) fail at time and time again.  Better to be in the arena and have skin in the game then just mindlessly parrot a position.  His xWOBA is 50 points lower than his actual wOBA, there is def some luck involved in his line so far.  Doesn't mean he's not a good player, but it does mean that at some point he will regress and he will have to improve his true talent level.

he's already improved his baserunning to basically average and his defense, while not good, isn't horrible anymore, so sure, give him credit, as I have, uh done, time and time again as more data points emerge.  

Doesn't understand the genre of post that calls out idiotic posts from two months ago.

It's all just GOOD NATURED RIBBING!

Edited June 7, 2021 by Look at Ray Ray Run

[chitownsportsfan]

2 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

Doesn't understand the genre of post that calls out idiotic posts from two months ago.

It's all just GOOD NATURED RIBBING!

Spoiler

 

[Squirmin' for Yermin]

15 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said:

For the umpteenth time, "pace" is meaningless. Check back at season end (for every player), after the full grind and ebbs and flows of a season.

If he registers a 4+ fWAR season in any year  it will be a major cause for celebration. A 3 win season would be solid. I think he can consistently hit 2-3 fWAR win seasons, making him a solid selection. Not doing stupid shit to cost the White Sox wins is a huge improvement, regardless of the fWAR impact.

In terms of the James Kelenic start, he's 21, too early to fret. Most players, including Madrigal, are in college or Rookie/A ball at that age. Playing for that horseshit organization is a challenge in an of itself.

Who is James?

[ptatc]

1 minute ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said:

Who is James?

Owww! I feel good. Like i knew that I would, now.

[South Side Hit Men]

7 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said:

Why aim so low? I think Pete Rose needs to look out.

I'm waiting for him to become the all time White Sox leader in hits among players named Nick/Nicky/Nicholas first.

(All time White Sox hit rank) / Player / Hits

1. (333) Nicky Delmonico 114
2. (342) Nick Swisher 109 - "I hate Nick Swisher with my heart." - Ozzie Guillen 8/5/2020
3. (373) Nick Madrigal 94
4. (400) Nick Altrock 84 - Played for the 1906 World Championship Team

 

[South Side Hit Men]

4 minutes ago, ptatc said:

Owww! I feel good. Like i knew that I would, now.

True story, worked a james Brown concert at the Rosemont Horizon in 1986. He looked out at the very small crowd, turned around and refused to perform.

Apparently the show must not always go on.

Edited June 7, 2021 by South Side Hit Men

[ptatc]

5 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said:

True story, worked a james Brown concert at the Rosemont Horizon in 1986. He looked out at the very small crowd, turned around and refused to perform.

Apparently the show must not always go on.

Awesome.

[oldsox]

Meanwhile, the guy we did not draft in Madrigal's spot, Jerrod Kelenic, was optioned today, after an 0 for 39 slump.

[South Side Fireworks Man]

13 minutes ago, South Side Hit Men said:

True story, worked a james Brown concert at the Rosemont Horizon in 1986. He looked out at the very small crowd, turned around and refused to perform.

Apparently the show must not always go on.

I went to just about every James Brown concert in the Chicagoland area from 1977 until 2003, including one time at the Rosemont Horizon in the mid '80's (don't remember the exact year but definitely '84 to '86 during some kind of carnival/festival they were having there) and I don't remember him ever refusing to perform.

[Dominikk85]

1 hour ago, EloyJenkins said:

just saw that. 0-39 is truly unbelievable. I thought he didn't have a hole in that swing? I hope this kid can recover. his Psyche has to be smashed. 

Mike trout hit 220 his first cup of coffee (150 PAs or so), that stuff happens. 

Maybe if he was striking out 50% I would be worried but while his 28% k rate is a bit high but his swinging strike and contact rate is actually slightly better than average so his K rate actually should be more like low 20s.

His batted ball quality was pretty bad but it was 92 PAs. Not very worried at all

[caulfield12]

1 hour ago, South Side Hit Men said:

For the umpteenth time, "pace" is meaningless. Check back at season end (for every player), after the full grind and ebbs and flows of a season.

If he registers a 4+ fWAR season in any year  it will be a major cause for celebration. A 3 win season would be solid. I think he can consistently hit 2-3 fWAR win seasons, making him a solid selection. Not doing stupid shit to cost the White Sox wins is a huge improvement, regardless of the fWAR impact.

In terms of the Jarred Kelenic start, he's 21, too early to fret. Most players, including Madrigal, are in college or Rookie/A ball at that age. Playing for that horseshit organization is a challenge in an of itself.

It didn’t seem to effect Kyle Lewis, who had his share of doubters on draft day...and still does, between injuries and swing and miss issues.  Hasn’t seemed to impact Julio Rodriguez, either.

“Baseball is ninety percent mental. The other half is physical.”  Yogi Berra

[South Side Hit Men]

32 minutes ago, South Side Fireworks Man said:

I went to just about every James Brown concert in the Chicagoland area from 1977 until 2003, including one time at the Rosemont Horizon in the mid '80's (don't remember the exact year but definitely '84 to '86 during some kind of carnival/festival they were having there) and I don't remember him ever refusing to perform.

It was one of the a carnival show(s). The Horizon refunded the tickets, at least for the date I worked the show. Perhaps there were multiple dates/years, but the one I worked the show was ultimately cancelled after we let in the few folks with tickets. Got paid to go home early, but would have liked to have seen the show as well. 

Two years later, there was pandemonium, but no ticket refunds, when the Horizon hosted a closed circuit broadcast of the Tyson vs. Spinks fight. Tyson won by knockout 91 seconds into the first round. Many fans were still coming in (skipping the undercard) and were markedly pissed off that they spent good money yet missed the fight. Those who did see it didn't see much either.