maxjusttyped Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 12 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: I think people are going to be disappointed when Eloy only hits .260-.275. I don't think he's always going to hit 45+ HR but I think 35+ is a safe bet. I think .265/.340/.900+ with 35-45 HRs is where he settles in. Still a very good offensive player but not an MVP candidate. Prime JD Martinez, he is not. That is what I think the fanbase expects from him. This is, of course if his power isn't affected by his injury. That batting average just doesn't seem realistic at all to me. Eloy hit .267 during his rookie season, at age 22, despite being completely overwhelmed for the first 2 months. Last year he hit .296 with an xBA of .282 and his statcast page is covered in more red than just about any hitter in baseball. You can't shift him because he's arguably the best opposite field hitter in baseball (https://blogs.fangraphs.com/eloy-jimenez-is-strong/) and he keeps his strikeout rate manageable enough where that's never going to be a major sink on his BA. Basically everything about Eloy's profile supports the notion he has an elite hit tool + will consistently post high BA's, and that's without getting into the fact he cut his strikeout rate last year and posted elite strikeout rates as a prospect. Maybe he'll get back to that, maybe he won't, but that isn't even necessary for him to be a consistent .280+ hitter. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Parkman Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 Just now, maxjusttyped said: That batting average just doesn't seem realistic at all to me. Eloy hit .267 during his rookie season, at age 22, despite being completely overwhelmed for the first 2 months. Last year he hit .296 with an xBA of .282 and his statcast page is covered in more red than just about any hitter in baseball. You can't shift him because he's arguably the best opposite field hitter in baseball (https://blogs.fangraphs.com/eloy-jimenez-is-strong/) and he keeps his strikeout rate manageable enough where that's never going to be a major sink on his BA. Basically everything about Eloy's profile supports the notion he has an elite hit tool + will consistently post high BA's, and that's without getting into the fact he cut his strikeout rate last year and posted elite strikeout rates as a prospect. Maybe he'll get back to that, maybe he won't, but that isn't even necessary for him to be a consistent .280+ hitter. Eloy chases too much crap for me to believe that is sustainable. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South Side Fireworks Man Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 20 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: I think people are going to be disappointed when Eloy only hits .260-.275. I don't think he's always going to hit 45+ HR but I think 35+ is a safe bet. I think .265/.340/.900+ with 35-45 HRs is where he settles in. Still a very good offensive player but not an MVP candidate. Prime JD Martinez, he is not. That is what I think the fanbase expects from him. This is, of course if his power isn't affected by his injury. He'd make a pretty good DH, but his play in LF lowers his value. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan49 Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 (edited) 36 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: I've always been the low man on Eloy. To me, Eloy is Jorge Soler with a few more hits. We know. You compared him to Delmon Young last year, and a month after, you were apologizing for being such a dope Edited April 18, 2021 by soxfan49 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjusttyped Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 1 minute ago, Jack Parkman said: Eloy chases too much crap for me to believe that is sustainable. His career chase rate is 1% higher than JD Martinez, the player you said he'll never become. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxfan49 Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 Anyone else still trying to figure out why the fuck Collins got the start today? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsideirish71 Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 6 minutes ago, soxfan49 said: Anyone else still trying to figure out why the fuck Collins got the start today? Because this is our manager. 1 1 4 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chick Mercedes Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 7 minutes ago, soxfan49 said: Anyone else still trying to figure out why the fuck Collins got the start today? Who knows. TLR is weird. Sometimes there is an over deference to veterans, and other times for some reason the team thinks Collins is a major league catcher and DH. They have been waiting for years for the guy to hit, and now that he can catch to the point he isn’t a total liability, thats gonna be enough for him to play and be the backup. As far as anyone can see, the Sox have a backup that isn’t known as a defender, a game caller or a hitter. Mercedes has better bonfides to be the backup at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg775 Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 1 hour ago, Chick Mercedes said: Who knows. TLR is weird. Sometimes there is an over deference to veterans, and other times for some reason the team thinks Collins is a major league catcher and DH. They have been waiting for years for the guy to hit, and now that he can catch to the point he isn’t a total liability, thats gonna be enough for him to play and be the backup. As far as anyone can see, the Sox have a backup that isn’t known as a defender, a game caller or a hitter. Mercedes has better bonfides to be the backup at this point. Collins 4 for 28 for a .143. BA with two walks and 5 RBI. Vaughn 4 for 25 with six walks and 1 RBI Jose hitting .208 with two HRs, 10 walks, 10 RBI. Eight of the RBI are off his two grand slams. I could go on, but I'm disappointed in some of the guys' hitting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCCWS Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 2 hours ago, soxfan49 said: Anyone else still trying to figure out why the fuck Collins got the start today? TLR figures he has to catch a doubleheader tomorrow?..................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShoeLessRob Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 5 minutes ago, SCCWS said: TLR figures he has to catch a doubleheader tomorrow?..................... Wouldn’t it make sense for the starter to start one game and the backup start the other............. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 10-20 in their last thirty games....need to go no worse than 2-3 on the rest of this brief road trip. 1-4 would cause lots of alarm bells to start ringing. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 I don't want to make a new thread but trading Dunning looks really stupid right now. It's early, but it looks fucking stupid. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, chitownsportsfan said: I don't want to make a new thread but trading Dunning looks really stupid right now. It's early, but it looks fucking stupid. It looks like another version of the Samardzija deal, not that it would have worked out well for the Sox to have awarded him that final long term deal for around $100 million. We definitely helped the A’s make an extended run of post-season appearances with those 4 guys, though. https://theathletic.com/2006926/2020/08/19/why-dane-dunning-always-had-the-fortitude-to-make-his-white-sox-debut/ https://www.si.com/mlb/whitesox/features/deserving-dane-dunning-needs-to-be-third-starter-in-the-playoffs Halfway through Spring Training now, Dunning thinks repetition and executing pitches are the two biggest things he needs to work on. Dunning is likely to be a piggyback option for the Rangers, and less of a traditional starter, as he works his way up to throwing more innings. Manager Chris Woodward said one of the main points he communicated to Dunning was attacking the strike zone early in counts. “I know [Jose] Trevino was working with him in the dugout in between innings,” Woodward said. “I guess the last inning, he struck out the side and it was basically nine pitches or 10 pitches. So it was good to see him progress through the outing and still have a good one. To finish the way he did was very encouraging.” Kyle Gibson, the Rangers' 33-year-old starter, credits Dunning for his delivery and the tight spin he has on his breaking ball. He also praised Dunning for his preparation and his willingness to learn as a young player throughout Spring Training. Gibson said Dunning’s mindset is that he always knows what he wants to take to the mound in each outing. “He's obviously a well-thought-of prospect and a highly regarded guy to come in and make an impact soon,” Gibson said. “So for a guy to still be trying to work on his craft, and to get a little bit better in that position where he's pretty good. I think that shows a lot about him.” Dunning echoed those sentiments, saying he’s happy to be in a position to learn from players with a lot more experience than him. He said he’s picked the brains of various pitchers on the staff and even started using a water bag workout routine he learned from Gibson. “I’m just fortunate to be in the situation I am,” Dunning said. “Just being able to talk and be able to learn with the people who have had years of service time. Me, being a rookie and coming up, I'm trying to establish myself and be successful. I'm trying to surround myself with that environment. Being able to talk with every guy and learn simple things, I really love it.” https://www.mlb.com/news/dane-dunning-learning-from-rangers-veterans Edited April 18, 2021 by caulfield12 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RagahRagah Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 3 hours ago, chitownsportsfan said: I don't want to make a new thread but trading Dunning looks really stupid right now. It's early, but it looks fucking stupid. It just goes back to the ineptitude of this FO that we traded control of a solid prospect for a 1 year rental without even remotely optomizing the team for the use of said 1 year rental. If the current trajectory continues and then Lynn walks we are going to go through the same motion next year with needing Kopech back in the rotation and trying (and likely failing) to extend Gio. Rotating door just continues spinning. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, RagahRagah said: It just goes back to the ineptitude of this FO that we traded control of a solid prospect for a 1 year rental without even remotely optomizing the team for the use of said 1 year rental. If the current trajectory continues and then Lynn walks we are going to go through the same motion next year with needing Kopech back in the rotation and trying (and likely failing) to extend Gio. Rotating door just continues spinning. They’ve got two years, if they don’t make it to the post-season this year. Really 1 1/2 from 2022 through midseason 2023 when they face the same decisions the Cubs are with Baez, Rizzo and Bryant. The difference is the Cubs are bottoming out after a window ending from 2015-2021. Those guys might have all peaked, and they devastated their future with trades and bad FA deals, but that’s as good as it gets unless you have the budget of the Dodgers, Yankees and Red Sox. The problem the White Sox is the timing, obviously. They can’t afford to go backwards, it will devastate the fanbase. It will be the equivalent of the Indians trading Lindor, or the Marlins trading Christian Yelich. Moncada has to perform like peak Bryant...and soon. Cease has to perform. Robert has to be a 4-5 fWAR CFer. Eloy has to come back as a 900ish OPS hitter. Otherwise, they’re miss timing the veterans with the first and second waves of talent. Their veterans will get old or depart (Lynn) before the second wave of youth is 100% ready (Kopech, Madrigal, Vaughn, Crochet). That’s the massive inherent risk right now. And they might have to start over with a new manager and a ticking clock to midseason of 2023, then another year later with TA. The only short term way to dig out it is spending more money/taking on additional salary obligations. Edited April 18, 2021 by caulfield12 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCCWS Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 10 hours ago, ShoeLessRob said: Wouldn’t it make sense for the starter to start one game and the backup start the other............. Grandal's family had gotten tickets in advance for Friday and Sunday's games, so TLR figured Grandal should catch both. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 7 hours ago, caulfield12 said: It looks like another version of the Samardzija deal, not that it would have worked out well for the Sox to have awarded him that final long term deal for around $100 million. We definitely helped the A’s make an extended run of post-season appearances with those 4 guys, though. https://theathletic.com/2006926/2020/08/19/why-dane-dunning-always-had-the-fortitude-to-make-his-white-sox-debut/ https://www.si.com/mlb/whitesox/features/deserving-dane-dunning-needs-to-be-third-starter-in-the-playoffs Halfway through Spring Training now, Dunning thinks repetition and executing pitches are the two biggest things he needs to work on. Dunning is likely to be a piggyback option for the Rangers, and less of a traditional starter, as he works his way up to throwing more innings. Manager Chris Woodward said one of the main points he communicated to Dunning was attacking the strike zone early in counts. “I know [Jose] Trevino was working with him in the dugout in between innings,” Woodward said. “I guess the last inning, he struck out the side and it was basically nine pitches or 10 pitches. So it was good to see him progress through the outing and still have a good one. To finish the way he did was very encouraging.” Kyle Gibson, the Rangers' 33-year-old starter, credits Dunning for his delivery and the tight spin he has on his breaking ball. He also praised Dunning for his preparation and his willingness to learn as a young player throughout Spring Training. Gibson said Dunning’s mindset is that he always knows what he wants to take to the mound in each outing. “He's obviously a well-thought-of prospect and a highly regarded guy to come in and make an impact soon,” Gibson said. “So for a guy to still be trying to work on his craft, and to get a little bit better in that position where he's pretty good. I think that shows a lot about him.” Dunning echoed those sentiments, saying he’s happy to be in a position to learn from players with a lot more experience than him. He said he’s picked the brains of various pitchers on the staff and even started using a water bag workout routine he learned from Gibson. “I’m just fortunate to be in the situation I am,” Dunning said. “Just being able to talk and be able to learn with the people who have had years of service time. Me, being a rookie and coming up, I'm trying to establish myself and be successful. I'm trying to surround myself with that environment. Being able to talk with every guy and learn simple things, I really love it.” https://www.mlb.com/news/dane-dunning-learning-from-rangers-veterans The king of grand proclamations based on small sample size has weighed in Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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