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Steve Stone / Yoan Moncada's "Lack of Effort and Interest"

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Posted (edited)

Sounds like Stone has reached the DGAF portion of his White Sox broadcasting career.  This could get interesting.  For me, I like when people bring their honest opinions, whether I agree with them or not.  I hate the "taking the company line" speak, as it's so transparent.

Edited by Big Hurtin
fixed typo
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20 minutes ago, fathom said:

I’m fine with him dogging it to avoid injury 

I disagree with this take in general. I have no personal knowledge of this situation but in general if players in any sport are dogging it in games they are doing it moreso in the offseason and that is where those types of injuries come from.

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Just now, Lillian said:

I have no idea what is inside Yoan Moncada's head and heart. I just hope that he is able to take advantage of his exceptional natural talent and athleticism, to become the great player that he likely has the potential to become. So far, the results are underwhelming.

He had a great year in 2019. He struggled in 2020, but this was such a small sample size even without the whole Covid-thing. He is on pace for another 6ish WAR season this year. Offense is down all around the league, he is 24% better than your average hitter coupled with elite defense at §B.

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Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, Lillian said:

Demonstrable emotion and burning intensity are not necessarily the same thing. One can be very driven, but not outwardly emotional.  

Roberto Clemente was arguably the most misunderstood Latin player of all time.   This stuff about Moncada is par for the course, have seen this in the sport ever since I can remember.
 

He played through countless injuries because he always worried there was a kid and his family that had travelled to Pittsburgh and might see only one game in person that season...so that he had a responsibility to give his all and not disappoint any of his young fans.

As if a strange language and a new culture were not challenges enough, Clemente also met racism and discrimination in their crudest forms. He quickly became an active defender of his rights and the rights of others. In one of his first games as a professional, he protested angrily when fans yelled racial insults at one of his teammates.

He became a union leader in the incipient Major League Baseball Players Association and defended players’ rights to demand better working conditions and benefits.

Clemente’s relationship with the press was marked by racial tension. Some members of the press were rude or scornful simply because he was black and Latino. Some made fun of his heavy Latin accent, quoting him with phonetic spelling rather than merely reporting what Clemente said.

"The farther away you writers stay, the better I like it. You know why? Because you’re trying to create a bad image of me… you do it because I’m black and Puerto Rican, but I’m proud to be Puerto Rican."
—Roberto Clemente, 1969

"He was just learning to handle the language, and writers who couldn’t speak three words of Spanish tried to make him look silly."
—Bill Mazeroski
Pirates teammate (1956-72) and Hall of Fame second baseman

http://www.robertoclemente.si.edu/english/virtual_story_growing_05.htm

 

Edited by caulfield12

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Yoan gets in his own head a lot, especially at the plate.  He's definitely not a "short memory" kind of player.

I think he probably works as hard as others in the weight room and on drills and so on, but he isn't always "mentally on" the way some others are.

I think Yoan is probably going to be an every-other-year or sporadic kind of All-Star instead of a perennial All-Star, and in most years maybe the 3rd or 4th best player on the team, and 3rd or 4th best hitter on the team in most years, rather than a top-2 player with Robert and a top-2 hitter with Eloy.

If Yoan takes another step mentally he can get to that next level.

Also, re: Stone, he sees things none of the fans see.  He also sees it with a pair of eyes that reporters, etc. who are around a lot cannot see.

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3 minutes ago, Big Hurtin said:

Sounds like Stone has reached the DGAF portion if his White Sox broadcasting career.  This could get interesting.  For me, I like when people bring their honest opinions, whether I agree with them or not.  I hate the "taking the company line" speak, as it's so transparent.

He doesn't say it on the telecast,  only Twitter. So I give him no credit. 

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2 minutes ago, ptatc said:

I disagree with this take in general. I have no personal knowledge of this situation but in general if players in any sport are dogging it in games they are doing it moreso in the offseason and that is where those types of injuries come from.

AFAIK Yoan never reported to camp out of shape unlike some other players who don’t get the “lazy“ label slapped on to them.

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5 minutes ago, Big Hurtin said:

Sounds like Stone has reached the DGAF portion if his White Sox broadcasting career.  This could get interesting.  For me, I like when people bring their honest opinions, whether I agree with them or not.  I hate the "taking the company line" speak, as it's so transparent.

Stone's criticism has always been pretty sharp, going back to his TV days with Cubs.  Eventually there was an issue with a shitty pitcher who couldn't take it and the Tribune Co. didn't have his back.  I don't think he's really changed at all, except that with twitter he is much more visible now.

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I say let the man continue to make music videos showing off his singing talent. I enjoy them. 

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1 minute ago, YourWhatHurts said:

Yoan gets in his own head a lot, especially at the plate.  He's definitely not a "short memory" kind of player.

I think he probably works as hard as others in the weight room and on drills and so on, but he isn't always "mentally on" the way some others are.

I think Yoan is probably going to be an every-other-year or sporadic kind of All-Star instead of a perennial All-Star, and in most years maybe the 3rd or 4th best player on the team, and 3rd or 4th best hitter on the team in most years, rather than a top-2 player with Robert and a top-2 hitter with Eloy.

If Yoan takes another step mentally he can get to that next level.

Also, re: Stone, he sees things none of the fans see.  He also sees it with a pair of eyes that reporters, etc. who are around a lot cannot see.

3B is so loaded.  Jose Ramirez, Devers, Matt Chapman, Urshela, Bregman, etc.   That’s just the AL.

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2 minutes ago, Dick Allen said:

He doesn't say it on the telecast,  only Twitter. So I give him no credit. 

These are two very different segments of the same fanbase.  The average viewer isn't some twitter fiend.  People following him on twitter are looking for a different product than the people just tuning into the game on TV.

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2 minutes ago, GermanSoxFan said:

AFAIK Yoan never reported to camp out of shape unlike some other players who don’t get the “lazy“ label slapped on to them.

Yes, Moncada has always been in great shape. However, that is not necessarily an indication of his drive to be a great baseball player. Perhaps he just likes taking care of his body. 

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2 minutes ago, Lillian said:

Yes, Moncada has always been in great shape. However, that is not necessarily an indication of his drive to be a great baseball player. Perhaps he just likes taking care of his body. 

Luis Robert?  Because he is in even better shape, arguably...

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1 minute ago, caulfield12 said:

Luis Robert?  Because he is in even better shape, arguably...

I'm sorry, but I don't understand the point.

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Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, Lillian said:

I'm sorry, but I don't understand the point.

Nobody questions his commitment to be a great player...but I have seen a number arguing his body is not ideally suited for preventing injuries because of his football player frame and lack of fat somehow contributing to his getting hurt more frequently.  An interesting theory, but pretty dubious.

Edited by caulfield12

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Posted (edited)

 

1 hour ago, Greydawgfan1 said:

I think the idea he isn’t interested in baseball is literally the worst take in Sox history 

You got yourself muted, I guess?

Moncada makes the game look easy. Might be why he gets this criticism. Stone mad at him watching that double yesterday lol

Edited by Look at Ray Ray Run
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Just now, harkness99 said:

he might not hustle.. but not the greatest concern i have...

 

Agreed.  My greatest concern with Yoan Moncada is that Lamb is still on the team 

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The worst criticism a sports media personality can levy against a pro athlete is that he isn't trying. Stone just did that.

I am tired of Stone and Bennetti for a variety of reasons, this being the latest, but I don't want to get into that, beyond responding to this outrageous comment.

Perhaps Stone needs to take off another week to visit his dogs, or perhaps, he should consider retirement.

 

 

 

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Compared to Jose Abreu most players are going to be seen as not working hard.

He also doesn't play with the emotion of Tim Anderson, but few do.

Yoan is a great talent who plays terrific defense (except on popups) no matter what he's doing at the plate.  He can also carry the club at times offensively.  I have little to no problems with his play.

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Keep doing what you’re doing, Yoan.  And please leave Twitter, Steve.  

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I don’t get the criticism on the pop up play. It’s up to the outfielder to take control of that situation.

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Yoan is a swagger guy.  When the ball isn't in play, he's moving with a certain air of superiority, like he's too cool for the game.  Rarely can I think of a time where he doesn't try hard when the ball is in play on defense.  I do think he takes the occasional AB pretty lightly, but never at a critical time.

FWIW, I'm a huge UGA fan and if Yoan's swagger on the field pisses you off, get ready to also get pissed off at Justin Fields.  He walks up to the line of scrimmage with the same "who gives a shit" swagger and can definitely give off the same "he doesn't care" vibe as Yoan.  Divas, some would say.  I think Fields will be great but after watching him at UGA and following him at tOSU, he carries himself much like Yoan. 

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, fathom said:

I’m fine with him dogging it to avoid injury 

Anybody that watches Yoan knows he enjoys playing the game.  He doesn't bust ass all the time because he's Robbie Cano 2.0 and his body just won't let him.  Is what it is.  He's a fucking 5 WAR 3B people need to just let the idea go that he's going to be a 8-9 WAR superstar.  That's still a helluva player to have on your squad.

Steve Stone is a fucking joke.  He should be reprimanded for running his mouth on Twitter.  This isn't the first or the last time he'll do it.  It doesn't help anything.  In fact it actively hurts the team's image. I feel that Stone is starting to think he's bigger than the team, frankly.  Jason has been feeding his ego too long.  He needs a reality check he's a fucking long retired player that doesn't have a legacy as a player on the South Side to run his mouth off like he does.

Edited by chitownsportsfan
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I'm going  to listen a bit more coming from Stone than I would most announcers or media types. I think you also need to consider you can't see thoughts and emotions with 100% clarity. I've coached players that look like they care but really didn't and players that don't show emotion but really care. 

I'm thinking right now of a freshman who played horrible on day one and showed almost no emotion, like she didn't care. Coincidentally later I was having dinner at a different course and she was on the putting green at 8 pm. The pro told me she had been hitting balls since 4 o'clock. You don't always see the commitment and passion. 

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