Look at Ray Ray Run Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 9 hours ago, chw42 said: No way the players agree to a 180 mil ceiling, that's way too low. I bet they love the 100 mil floor. So many mediocre players are gonna get unreasonable contracts. You'd have to change the way young payers are paid dramatically - which should have happened already. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldsox Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 10 hours ago, southsider2k5 said: This your 1st CBA? Nope, but it goes both ways. Both sides are trying to screw the other side out of money. So, you still lead the league in cynicism. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 This would fuck over the richer teams. I doubt MLBPA agrees to this. Although, the teams with more money can just pay the tax. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 What about $80 mill/ $220? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirmin' for Yermin Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 A salary floor is absolutely needed 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirmin' for Yermin Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 I like a 100 million salary floor. It'll instantly make teams more competitive. make tanking much harder. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Look at Ray Ray Run Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 1 minute ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said: I like a 100 million salary floor. It'll instantly make teams more competitive. make tanking much harder. I'll say this, the 100 million dollar floor would add more money to the player pool right now with the 180 million dollar ceiling. You'd barely lose any money based on teams over 180 and you'd gain quite a bit with teams currently under 100. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 19 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said: THe luxury tax has basically been acting as a hard cap; almost no one wants to be over the tax threshold for multiple years as the tax scales. 98% of the teams won't go over it. They won't go over it multiple times without dropping down for a year. This will increase the competition in the league. But they will still have a few teams every year go over. There are currently 9 teams over 180 and 7 teams under 100. It will bring better competition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 27 minutes ago, oldsox said: Nope, but it goes both ways. Both sides are trying to screw the other side out of money. So, you still lead the league in cynicism. Won't anyone think of the billionaires???? *clutches pearls* 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrangeSox Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 (edited) The game would be so much better and tickets/concessions obviously cheaper if the owners got to pocket more money. Floor is good, luxury tax may be a good idea just not sure 180M is where it should start. Edited August 19, 2021 by StrangeSox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 Just now, StrangeSox said: The game would be so much better and tickets/concessions obviously cheaper if the owners got to pocket more money. Stay with me here....trickle down economics who says no? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said: Won't anyone think of the billionaires???? *clutches pearls* No just the millionaires. It's a union negotiation just like any other. It's amazing how many people think it's only the owners just to get something from the union. The union is trying to do the exact same thing. That's the essence of bargaining unit negotiations. Edited August 19, 2021 by ptatc 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NWINFan Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 I don't know about all the sides to these issues. I do know that if there is another prolonged work stoppage of any kind, there will be a strong backlash from fans. It took some time for the sport to recover after the 1994 farce. Both sides need to bargain in good faith although I realize that may seem like an odd concept to both sides, mostly by the owners. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Hurtin Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 11 hours ago, pcq said: 100 would put the Royals Guard and Bucs outta bizness. Relegate them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 11 minutes ago, ptatc said: No just the millionaires. It's a union negotiation just like any other. It's amazing how many people think it's only the owners just to get something from the union. The union is trying to do the exact same thing. That's the essence of bargaining unit negotiations. I understand it's a negotiation, but the owners have been winning it for a while, they control the money flow. It is what it is 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOFHurt35 Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 54 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said: You'd have to change the way young payers are paid dramatically - which should have happened already. It for sure will change the service time shenanigans. Teams would start using the Sox model and pay their players very early to get to that Salary Floor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 7 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said: I understand it's a negotiation, but the owners have been winning it for a while, they control the money flow. It is what it is I mainly want to tell the owners to f off but it does feel like as a fan the salary cap has, as a fan, made other leagues easier to follow, and I think baseball orgs have been interesting in how they respond to constraints added to the sport (draft budgets, etc). Much more fun as a fan when you know there is just a straight up budget you are working with that is the same as everyone rather than if the owner will be charitable with a few more million. Now, the weird thing is baseball has shown that teams can be competitive on a variety of budgets, and that has also made it interesting. But the creativity the lower budget teams have found have clearly hurt the player pool. The other thing I struggle with - everytime there is a huff and a puff about tanking teams not signing guys that are available in like Feb, when you follow-up in august so many of those guys are having awful seasons. Teams really have been pretty good at knowing when players have declined to a point of being worse than a young player. Overall, I don't want the owners song and dance and them to "win", but I do think a structure of player control only being 4 years with a 5th year option for maybe 1st round picks or certain money amount INTL guys, with a salary floor and cap is probably a more fun game to follow. It certainly would be a more fun start to FA. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iWiN4PreP Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 Some Facts: - Both sides are trying to win, but there's a good side (the players) and a bad side (the owners). Get with the good side. -Minor leaguers are the most criminally abused workers. Any sort of discussion needs to start with revamping the minor league system. -I would think a Salary floor is a big DUH with what we've seen. Teams tanking so hard and putting sub 50 mil payrolls out there. Even a team like the Rays who succeed and have a payroll at 44 mil need to be better. Their fans deserve better, even if their organization is run well. They don't deserve to keep losing their stars and home grown talent. Pony up the money, losers! -Salary cap? I'd imagine this is the owners way of forcing top salaries down. IDK if a cap is really needed. But 180 is way too low. Go for 220. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 43 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said: Won't anyone think of the billionaires???? *clutches pearls* Watch it, you might get accused of being cynical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThirdGen Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 I am surprised the owners offered the floor in their first proposal. While just about everyone knows it is needed, I figured the owners would hold out on that to grab something else back from the players in exchange. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 37 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said: I understand it's a negotiation, but the owners have been winning it for a while, they control the money flow. It is what it is The MLB union is by far the strongest in all of sports. And of course they control the money flow, they OWN the team. Doesn't mean that the players aren't trying to screw the owners over every chance they get. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 18 minutes ago, iWiN4PreP said: Some Facts: - Both sides are trying to win, but there's a good side (the players) and a bad side (the owners). Get with the good side. -Minor leaguers are the most criminally abused workers. Any sort of discussion needs to start with revamping the minor league system. -I would think a Salary floor is a big DUH with what we've seen. Teams tanking so hard and putting sub 50 mil payrolls out there. Even a team like the Rays who succeed and have a payroll at 44 mil need to be better. Their fans deserve better, even if their organization is run well. They don't deserve to keep losing their stars and home grown talent. Pony up the money, losers! -Salary cap? I'd imagine this is the owners way of forcing top salaries down. IDK if a cap is really needed. But 180 is way too low. Go for 220. This is a non-issue for the CBA as the minor leagues are not part of the union, thus they really aren't going to sacrifice any part of their union for non-members. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptatc Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 17 minutes ago, ThirdGen said: I am surprised the owners offered the floor in their first proposal. While just about everyone knows it is needed, I figured the owners would hold out on that to grab something else back from the players in exchange. Me too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poppysox Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 25 minutes ago, ThirdGen said: I am surprised the owners offered the floor in their first proposal. While just about everyone knows it is needed, I figured the owners would hold out on that to grab something else back from the players in exchange. Maybe some owners would like to avoid a strike if at all possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sox80 Posted August 19, 2021 Share Posted August 19, 2021 11 hours ago, Green Line said: Its a good plan. The players' salaries are way too high to begin with. The revenue is also high . Would owners lower ticket prices? Probably not Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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