Offseason Thread

[bmags]

8 hours ago, maloney.adam said:

 

It's a pretty good idea, doesn't solve the RHH stuff but checks everything else. K's more than you'd like as he gets older but walks 10+%, plays everywhere, and doesn't hit the ball on the ground.

[Chicago White Sox]

33 minutes ago, maloney.adam said:

 

Josh Nelson playing insider sure is fun.  Anyways, I’m not against Chris Taylor by any means, but I’d definitely prefer Conforto.

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

If Chris Taylor is somehow going to get paid well because of a few good post-season games it's safe to say I have zero interest in him.

Gonna be 32, is a fine piece but not a star by any means.

[caulfield12]

Kike got 1/$8 from Boston and is a year younger and a better defender...Taylor seems closer to 2/$20-22 million, $24 if the spending went up again after CBA is reached.

[Balta1701]

8 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Kike got 1/$8 from Boston and is a year younger and a better defender...Taylor seems closer to 2/$20-22 million, $24 if the spending went up again after CBA is reached.

That just seems so low to me. Mentally I had him pegged for Zobrist money.

[Balta1701]

26 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Josh Nelson playing insider sure is fun.  Anyways, I’m not against Chris Taylor by any means, but I’d definitely prefer Conforto.

Obviously it doesn’t solve the RH balance problem, but it makes me shut up about depth if he’s in a 10th man role.

[Chicago White Sox]

8 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Kike got 1/$8 from Boston and is a year younger and a better defender...Taylor seems closer to 2/$20-22 million, $24 if the spending went up again after CBA is reached.

Didn’t Kike get 2/$14M?  Taylor has a stronger record that him regardless.  Honestly, I could see someone going to 3/$40M or so.

[Chicago White Sox]

1 minute ago, Balta1701 said:

Obviously it doesn’t solve the RH balance problem, but it makes me shut up about depth if he’s in a 10th man role.

If we sign Taylor, he’s going to be an everyday guy.  He may rotate around a ton, but he wouldn’t be a depth piece per se.

[Bob Sacamano]

16 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Obviously it doesn’t solve the RH balance problem, but it makes me shut up about depth if he’s in a 10th man role.

Honestly, I’m thinking Romy can be this kind of guy with his versatility. If you sign Taylor, he’s likely your 2B.

[Lillian]

Conforto's career stats, vs. RHP:  AVG .265   OBP .371   SLG .502   OPS .873

Platoon him with Engel and have Adam also be Conforto's late inning defensive replacement, if you're worried about his defense.

The Sox are not going to make Eloy a DH, this early in his career. We may disagree, but it isn't happening.

Gavin needs to split time with Abreu, between first base and DH. Grandal can catch against opposing RHP, and rest on days against LHP. That should give him enough rest, without having to play him at first base, unless Sheets proves not to be effective vs LHP, in which case Grandal DH's vs. LHP, batting from the right side.

Vaughn might net a very good pitching prospect, if not, it seems like he may have to wait for Jose to retire. A.V. would be a very capable corner outfielder, if he weren't so slow. Being RH and short are really considerable obstacles to being a first baseman, especially with other guys in front of him at that spot.

La Russa seems to love Leury, so my guess is that they bring him back, in which case Tony will play him regularly. most likely at second base, which isn't a bad idea. However, someone else will have to be that versatile utility man, if Garcia continues to be a regular.  I'd personally prefer to see what they have in Romy Gonzales at second, and keep Garcia as a bench player. I don't see Tony limiting Leury's use, that way. Perhaps he would, if there were enough better players in the corner outfield spots and second base. We'll see.

It would be great if Keuchel, Kimbrel and perhaps someone like Burger, could net another really promising and Major League ready, starting pitcher, as no one in the Sox farm system looks to be ready. No ideas regarding who that might be. In any case, as we've noted, the Sox will likely limit Keuchel's innings, in order to avoid the exercise of his 2023 option. Therefore, acquiring another starter seems essential, especially the way pitchers seem to lack durability in this era.

 

[bmags]

18 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Didn’t Kike get 2/$14M?  Taylor has a stronger record that him regardless.  Honestly, I could see someone going to 3/$40M or so.

That is a good bench mark.

[zisk]

I'd rather sign Yan Gomes than anyone else. We're thin at catcher. Between Vaughn, Eloy, Burger, Sheets and Engel We can get by on the corners.

Of course if Robert gets hurt again, it could get ugly real quick.

[Chicago White Sox]

19 minutes ago, Lillian said:

Conforto's career stats, vs. RHP:  AVG .265   OBP .371   SLG .502   OPS .873

Platoon him with Engel and have Adam also be Conforto's late inning defensive replacement, if you're worried about his defense.

The Sox are not going to make Eloy a DH, this early in his career. We may disagree, but it isn't happening.

Gavin needs to split time with Abreu, between first base and DH. Grandal can catch against opposing RHP, and rest on days against LHP. That should give him enough rest, without having to play him at first base, unless Sheets proves not to be effective vs LHP, in which case Grandal DH's vs. LHP, batting from the right side.

Vaughn might net a very good pitching prospect, if not, it seems like he may have to wait for Jose to retire. A.V. would be a very capable corner outfielder, if he weren't so slow. Being RH and short are really considerable obstacles to being a first baseman, especially with other guys in front of him at that spot.

La Russa seems to love Leury, so my guess is that they bring him back, in which case Tony will play him regularly. most likely at second base, which isn't a bad idea. However, someone else will have to be that versatile utility man, if Garcia continues to be a regular.  I'd personally prefer to see what they have in Romy Gonzales at second, and keep Garcia as a bench player. I don't see Tony limiting Leury's use, that way. Perhaps he would, if there were enough better players in the corner outfield spots and second base. We'll see.

It would be great if Keuchel, Kimbrel and perhaps someone like Burger, could net another really promising and Major League ready, starting pitcher, as no one in the Sox farm system looks to be ready. No ideas regarding who that might be. In any case, as we've noted, the Sox will likely limit Keuchel's innings, in order to avoid the exercise of his 2023 option. Therefore, acquiring another starter seems essential, especially the way pitchers seem to lack durability in this era.

 

Grandal is better against LHP than RHP and should be in the lineup every day.  He’s that important to our offense.

[kleedawg]

13 minutes ago, zisk said:

I'd rather sign Yan Gomes than anyone else. We're thin at catcher. Between Vaughn, Eloy, Burger, Sheets and Engel We can get by on the corners.

Of course if Robert gets hurt again, it could get ugly real quick.

Gomes or roberto perez (if cleveland doesn't pick up option). would be good. Also, if our corner of spot does become a serious issue I'd rather trade for an Rf at the dealine then sign conforto. consider Kris Bryant, Starling Marte, joey Gallo, Jorge Soler, Eddie Rosaro, & Joc Pederson where all available at the deadline and none seemed to be an exorbitant cost in prospects.

[Balta1701]

43 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

If we sign Taylor, he’s going to be an everyday guy.  He may rotate around a ton, but he wouldn’t be a depth piece per se.

That's what I meant - play him like the Dodgers do, have other guys who are "the normal starting RF and 2b when Taylor plays somewhere else", and when someone gets hurt, Taylor is the guy who takes over.

[SCCWS]

2 hours ago, southsider2k5 said:

If you watched games you would have seen that the stuff is there, but he was hit like batters knew what was coming in the last month of the season.  To me that screams tipping.  That is something that can be fixed.  I would be a lot more worried if his velocity was down, or his off speed stuff wasn't there.

I will say that opponents can spot tipping and take advantage of it. However for the last month means 3-4 teams spotted it.  If  multiple teams spotted Cease tipping and the White Sox brain-trust didn't see it ,  we shouldn't be trusting those brains for too much. 

[SCCWS]

1 hour ago, caulfield12 said:

Kike got 1/$8 from Boston and is a year younger and a better defender...Taylor seems closer to 2/$20-22 million, $24 if the spending went up again after CBA is reached.

Actually Kike got 2/$14 from Boston. 

[southsider2k5]

1 hour ago, SCCWS said:

I will say that opponents can spot tipping and take advantage of it. However for the last month means 3-4 teams spotted it.  If  multiple teams spotted Cease tipping and the White Sox brain-trust didn't see it ,  we shouldn't be trusting those brains for too much. 

Kopech, not Cease

[caulfield12]

3 hours ago, SCCWS said:

Actually Kike got 2/$14 from Boston. 

Okay…so the question is whether to give Taylor 3 years vs. 2, and how much they have to overpay ($28-30 million for 2) to aboid that third year or make it a realistic option based on year 2 performance.

And have no doubt he would be starting at 2B Opening Day.

The problem is where we get the payroll space for that kind of move….or Conforto/S.Marte or some of the secondary options in RF.

[maloney.adam]

26 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Okay…so the question is whether to give Taylor 3 years vs. 2, and how much they have to overpay ($28-30 million for 2) to aboid that third year or make it a realistic option based on year 2 performance.

And have no doubt he would be starting at 2B Opening Day.

The problem is where we get the payroll space for that kind of move….or Conforto/S.Marte or some of the secondary options in RF.

Do you think Kimbrel is coming back? How about Rodon and Hernandez? Will they include Keuchel in a trade?

Edited October 23, 2021 by maloney.adam

[Ozzie’s Cuban Cigar]

7 hours ago, bmags said:

It's a pretty good idea, doesn't solve the RHH stuff but checks everything else. K's more than you'd like as he gets older but walks 10+%, plays everywhere, and doesn't hit the ball in the air.

Um except for his 3 HRs seemed to get pretty airborne

[bmags]

1 minute ago, Ozzie’s Cuban Cigar said:

Um except for his 3 HRs seemed to get pretty airborne

Lol yeah I meant doesn’t hit the ball in the ground. He only has a 36% gb rate and I think Sox were like 55% as a team.

[caulfield12]

1 hour ago, maloney.adam said:

Do you think Kimbrel is coming back? How about Rodon and Hernandez? Will they include Keuchel in a trade?

I don't think they will commit to any $10+ million contracts until the Kimbrel and Rodon situations are resolved...and the potential Kimbrel may take months to materialize, or drag into the regular season.  They're unlikely to give a high enough enough subsidy or include a good enough prospect to make offloading Keuchel logical.  It likely also drags into the regular season, hoping he can re-establish himself, but that makes it just as likely the Sox would keep him or have to worry about hitting his incentives to lock in yet another season at a price the White Sox cannot afford when they're in the hear of their window.

[Chicago White Sox]

5 hours ago, caulfield12 said:

I don't think they will commit to any $10+ million contracts until the Kimbrel and Rodon situations are resolved...and the potential Kimbrel may take months to materialize, or drag into the regular season.  They're unlikely to give a high enough enough subsidy or include a good enough prospect to make offloading Keuchel logical.  It likely also drags into the regular season, hoping he can re-establish himself, but that makes it just as likely the Sox would keep him or have to worry about hitting his incentives to lock in yet another season at a price the White Sox cannot afford when they're in the hear of their window.

My god man…stop being a Balta echo chamber.  The Sox aren’t picking up Kimbrel’s option and carrying him into the season.

[caulfield12]

1 hour ago, Chicago White Sox said:

My god man…stop being a Balta echo chamber.  The Sox aren’t picking up Kimbrel’s option and carrying him into the season.

Can I cut and paste this quote for later in the offseason when they still haven’t offloaded him or signed any player to more than a $12.5 million/year contract due to “payroll concerns/flexibility” or hints they will make their needed changes in-season or at the All-Star Break?

Hahn really had a good situation with Hernandez at $6 million before that became untenable.

Because we have never succeeded under Hahn in FA in the position player market (unless you count international/Cuban free agents only)…so why would or should we suddenly expect that to change or improve?

Edited October 23, 2021 by caulfield12