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kgrittenburg

things don't look so bad now

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Except the Astros are going to have an extra $50 million of financial flexibility from where they will end the World Series payroll-wise compared to the Sox position with Kimbrel added...

While our pitching is unlikely to improve on 2020 numbers, they somehow have a better farm system and the home field advantage bringing Verlander back into the fold for his last seasons.  Knowing them, they'll probably take a shot at Syndergaard, Kershaw or Bauer, too.

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55 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Except the Astros are going to have an extra $50 million of financial flexibility from where they will end the World Series payroll-wise compared to the Sox position with Kimbrel added...

While our pitching is unlikely to improve on 2020 numbers, they somehow have a better farm system and the home field advantage bringing Verlander back into the fold for his last seasons.  Knowing them, they'll probably take a shot at Syndergaard, Kershaw or Bauer, too.

What poem is that from?

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2 hours ago, Sambuca said:

What poem is that from?

The one that says they’ve sustained their competitive window alive longer than any team the last decade not named the Dodgers…

They have been in the thick of it for seven seasons now…if it wasn’t for this play, the Royals wouldn’t have been in the 2015 World Series.  
 

The Dodgers are at nine, but this just MIGHT be their last year and they’re doing it with a $250+ million payroll.

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49 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

The one that says they’ve sustained their competitive window alive longer than any team the last decade not named the Dodgers…

They have been in the thick of it for seven seasons now…if it wasn’t for this play, the Royals wouldn’t have been in the 2015 World Series.  
 

The Dodgers are at nine, but this just MIGHT be their last year and they’re doing it with a $250+ million payroll.

Cheating helps.

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1 minute ago, Chimpton said:

Cheating helps.

We were talking about it the other day," Correa said. "It was me, Altuve, Yuli, Bregman. We've asked the same question. We said, 'Why? Why do we keep showing up and getting it done?' And we came to the conclusion that it's because we hold each other accountable. And what I mean by that is we expect everybody to be better than [the] previous year, and we expect everybody to show up in great shape. ... We make sure that they prepare every single day to help us win because we know that the four of us can't get it done by ourselves."

ESPN.com/Jeff Passan

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Honestly sox should just contract themselves. 

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17 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

We were talking about it the other day," Correa said. "It was me, Altuve, Yuli, Bregman. We've asked the same question. We said, 'Why? Why do we keep showing up and getting it done?' And we came to the conclusion that it's because we hold each other accountable. And what I mean by that is we expect everybody to be better than [the] previous year, and we expect everybody to show up in great shape. ... We make sure that they prepare every single day to help us win because we know that the four of us can't get it done by ourselves."

ESPN.com/Jeff Passan

Yes, but they did cheat, or was the whole sign stealing scandal my imagination?

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Just now, Chimpton said:

Yes, but they did cheat, or was the whole sign stealing scandal my imagination?

Unlike other teams, the Astros players say they work hard for their success. We will never try that.

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3 minutes ago, bmags said:

Unlike other teams, the Astros players say they work hard for their success. We will never try that.

Are those the same 'hard working' players who were happy to win a World Series by cheating?

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7 minutes ago, bmags said:

Honestly sox should just contract themselves. 

Good idea.  The Twins responded quite positively to such threats....they got a chip on their shoulders.  Anything is better than complacency in the AL Central.

Maybe it will take the Tigers going out and spending on C, SS and their starting rotation to set the tone and force a response from the Sox, instead of KW's usual bromide about the Tigers "just put themselves in a position to come closer to competing with the White Sox" bravado.

 

 

Edited by caulfield12
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6 hours ago, Sambuca said:

What poem is that from?

I think it was Keats.  “Proper Nouns To Infinity” by Keats

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2 hours ago, bmags said:

Unlike other teams, the Astros players say they work hard for their success. We will never try that.

Hey the Cubs don’t

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As much as I dislike the Astro's for taking cheating to another level, one has to give them credit for their defense.  Why they cheated is on them, and they probably could have made it to the WS without cheating but the fact is they didn't.

In the ALDS against our Sox their fielding was outstanding, they hit the cut-off man, took the extra base, stole 5 bases, threw out the only Sox player who tried to steal, and all around played almost flawless defensive baseball.  The Sox tendency to hit ground balls played right into their defensive strength as the infield gobbled up the routine plays and took away hit's heading for the hole.

Their pitchers don't look too bad either. I don't think I've ever heard of a team who had 18 hits without any of them going for extra bases, that's amazing.

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7 minutes ago, A-Train to 35th said:

As much as I dislike the Astro's for taking cheating to another level, one has to give them credit for their defense.  Why they cheated is on them, and they probably could have made it to the WS without cheating but the fact is they didn't.

In the ALDS against our Sox their fielding was outstanding, they hit the cut-off man, took the extra base, stole 5 bases, threw out the only Sox player who tried to steal, and all around played almost flawless defensive baseball.  The Sox tendency to hit ground balls played right into their defensive strength as the infield gobbled up the routine plays and took away hit's heading for the hole.

Their pitchers don't look too bad either. I don't think I've ever heard of a team who had 18 hits without any of them going for extra bases, that's amazing.

This organization has never taken defense seriously as part of the equation.   Fundamentals are not taught.  This is why for years the Twins beat us with lesser talent.  We have pitchers that dont know how to hold runners.  We have OF's who blow through their cuts allowing the trailer to advance and keep a big inning moving.  We dont run the bases that well.  And defense, good grief.  Watch our LF who can barely catch a ball on routine fly balls.   Sometimes its like watching a freshman baseball team who beats up on other freshman bad teams thinking that is the same as the varsity.  Then they move up to varsity and get their ass handed to them.  Beating other teams in the playoffs requires execution.  Until we can put a complete game together for a few games in a row we are looking at first round exits until some other bad team in the AL Central takes the crown from us and does the same thing.  

Edited by southsideirish71
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14 minutes ago, southsideirish71 said:

This organization has never taken defense seriously as part of the equation.   Fundamentals are not taught.  This is why for years the Twins beat us with lesser talent.  We have pitchers that dont know how to hold runners.  We have OF's who blow through their cuts allowing the trailer to advance and keep a big inning moving.  We dont run the bases that well.  And defense, good grief.  Watch our LF who can barely catch a ball on routine fly balls.   Sometimes its like watching a freshman baseball team who beats up on other freshman bad teams thinking that is the same as the varsity.  Then they move up to varsity and get their ass handed to them.  Beating other teams in the playoffs requires execution.  Until we can put a complete game together for a few games in a row we are looking at first round exits until some other bad team in the AL Central takes the crown from us and does the same thing.  

If I was manager, and would have them do field work and fundamentals until they can't physically run or throw the ball any more. They don't seem to want to defend, so drill it into them. Make them practice it from dusk to dawn. 

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41 minutes ago, ron883 said:

If I was manager, and would have them do field work and fundamentals until they can't physically run or throw the ball any more. They don't seem to want to defend, so drill it into them. Make them practice it from dusk to dawn. 

La Russa doesn’t give a rats ass about anything beyond unwritten rules for the entire season, from the first day of spring training until after the final game when all he cried about beanballs and other crap that the game has moved on from.

The team regressed year over year on defense, base-running and other fundamentals. Every Reinsdorf paid media hack and Tony’s Stans here and elsewhere have the same spiel, the team would always be prepared to play under Tony, Tony would usher in a new era.

It was all complete and utter bullshit, and this will continue until they bring in a competent manager and staff who aren’t here to kiss veteran ass and whine about bullshit, but instead lead their team to kick opponents asses, with a focus of how to take advantage of the things like shifting, fundamentals, smart approaches in the batters box, and smart baseball which successful teams excel at daily.

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1 hour ago, ron883 said:

If I was manager, and would have them do field work and fundamentals until they can't physically run or throw the ball any more. They don't seem to want to defend, so drill it into them. Make them practice it from dusk to dawn. 

 

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5 hours ago, ron883 said:

If I was manager, and would have them do field work and fundamentals until they can't physically run or throw the ball any more. They don't seem to want to defend, so drill it into them. Make them practice it from dusk to dawn. 

Nobody wants hard-ass authoritarian guys like Showalter, Scioscia or even Bochy around their teams anymore…it’s not laid back enough for the modern player.  Girardi is one of the last, although he's had to become more relaxed over the years.

Gabe Kapler is pretty much the ideal…someone really into psychology, fitness, advanced metrics.  Maddon kind of started that trend.

Edited by caulfield12
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19 hours ago, southsideirish71 said:

This organization has never taken defense seriously as part of the equation.   Fundamentals are not taught.  This is why for years the Twins beat us with lesser talent.  We have pitchers that dont know how to hold runners.  We have OF's who blow through their cuts allowing the trailer to advance and keep a big inning moving.  We dont run the bases that well.  And defense, good grief.  Watch our LF who can barely catch a ball on routine fly balls.   Sometimes its like watching a freshman baseball team who beats up on other freshman bad teams thinking that is the same as the varsity.  Then they move up to varsity and get their ass handed to them.  Beating other teams in the playoffs requires execution.  Until we can put a complete game together for a few games in a row we are looking at first round exits until some other bad team in the AL Central takes the crown from us and does the same thing.  

Agree, too many games were filled with embarrassing errors that are directly related to fundamentals.  Someone brought up that opening series against the Angels and it was a microcosm of the errors.  It was painful to watch, and while they improved slightly after that series too many games were lost by not paying fundamental defense such as you mentioned.

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18 hours ago, South Side Hit Men said:

La Russa doesn’t give a rats ass about anything beyond unwritten rules for the entire season, from the first day of spring training until after the final game when all he cried about beanballs and other crap that the game has moved on from.

The team regressed year over year on defense, base-running and other fundamentals. Every Reinsdorf paid media hack and Tony’s Stans here and elsewhere have the same spiel, the team would always be prepared to play under Tony, Tony would usher in a new era.

It was all complete and utter bullshit, and this will continue until they bring in a competent manager and staff who aren’t here to kiss veteran ass and whine about bullshit, but instead lead their team to kick opponents asses, with a focus of how to take advantage of the things like shifting, fundamentals, smart approaches in the batters box, and smart baseball which successful teams excel at daily.

Can't agree that it's Tony's fault, he came into a situation where his first priority was gaining the players respect, and that took time away from teaching fundamental baseball. After he had a year to watch the same mistakes we've witnessed year after year let's see what happens in spring training this year. To say that's it's Tony's fault because our outfield was basically a bunch of retreads after the injuries to Robert and Engel is not fair.  To say he's responsible for all the mistakes made in the field in my opinion has to do more with the players who were signed by the GM than his managerial ability.  Your opening comment is off the chart ridiculous.

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13 minutes ago, A-Train to 35th said:

Can't agree that it's Tony's fault, he came into a situation where his first priority was gaining the players respect, and that took time away from teaching fundamental baseball. After he had a year to watch the same mistakes we've witnessed year after year let's see what happens in spring training this year. To say that's it's Tony's fault because our outfield was basically a bunch of retreads after the injuries to Robert and Engel is not fair.  To say he's responsible for all the mistakes made in the field in my opinion has to do more with the players who were signed by the GM than his managerial ability.  Your opening comment is off the chart ridiculous.

Then how did Ventura, widely-perceived as the second worst Sox manager in the entire JR Era, manage it so well in 2012? 

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