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3 minutes ago, Quin said:

How much cash do you need included to accept it?

In a normal situation, for those two players, I would be willing to take a ton on.  I am not sure what it would take to not screw up the salary cap though.  Maybe the Abreu contract dropping off after this year would make it work?  Not sure.

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4 minutes ago, Lillian said:

Is there a quality starter, with a "bad contract," whom some team would be willing to deal?

Not that I’m aware of, but the Reds might be willing to move Mahnle for a huge discount if you take on a big portion of Moose’s contract and if you like Paddack there may be a path to acquisition if you take on half of Hosmer’s.  Again, I’m not sure Jerry would ever go for that, but I know either one would make Caulfield very happy.

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21 minutes ago, CWSpalehoseCWS said:

Yeah, I’d agree. They’d have to empty the farm to get him and I don’t know if that would be worth it.

I know it wouldn’t be worth it.

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So this is a trade that actually works according to BaseballTradeValues:

  • CWS get: RHP Chris Paddack, Ryan Weathers, 1B Eric Hosmer, & $30M cash
  • SDP get: Gavin Sheets

This is basically the Mets trade with Sheets instead of Dom Smith and Weathers instead of Pagan.  The Sox would be on the hook for ~$7.5M of Hosmer’s salary each year for the next four seasons.  Our cut of Hosmer’s salary along with Paddack & Weathers’ salaries would roughly be the same amount of money that Manaea will make this year.

Obviously BBTV is not overly accurate, so which side says no to theoretical deal?

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38 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

We don’t have the ammo to trade for a stud.

Sure we do, but probably not willing to trade those guys.

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14 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

So this is a trade that actually works according to BaseballTradeValues:

  • CWS get: RHP Chris Paddack, Ryan Weathers, 1B Eric Hosmer, & $30M cash
  • SDP get: Gavin Sheets

This is basically the Mets trade with Sheets instead of Dom Smith and Weathers instead of Pagan.  The Sox would be on the hook for ~$7.5M of Hosmer’s salary each year for the next four seasons.  Our cut of Hosmer’s salary along with Paddack & Weathers’ salaries would roughly be the same amount of money that Manaea will make this year.

Obviously BBTV is not overly accurate, so which side says no to theoretical deal?

Unless our coaching staff can teach Hosmer how to lift the ball, I'm gonna hate watching him play no matter how much he's getting paid. He's basically Leury Garcia at first base. 

Also, how does the $30 million work in terms of CBT? 

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Posted (edited)
37 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

Not that I’m aware of, but the Reds might be willing to move Mahnle for a huge discount if you take on a big portion of Moose’s contract and if you like Paddack there may be a path to acquisition if you take on half of Hosmer’s.  Again, I’m not sure Jerry would ever go for that, but I know either one would make Caulfield very happy.

Mahle and Moustakas would be intriguing. Moose would be the DH and Sheets could go to Charlotte, affording the Sox an extra year of control.  What would the Reds take, besides the salary relief? I would guess that they view Mahle as a big piece of their future, with two more years of control and haven't they talked about extending him?

Edited by Lillian

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FA - I'd go Cueto. We just need 5 good innings.

Pirates aren't going to trade Quintana. They just signed him this offseason.

Anyone hear anything about Lambert or Stiever?

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35 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

So this is a trade that actually works according to BaseballTradeValues:

  • CWS get: RHP Chris Paddack, Ryan Weathers, 1B Eric Hosmer, & $30M cash
  • SDP get: Gavin Sheets

This is basically the Mets trade with Sheets instead of Dom Smith and Weathers instead of Pagan.  The Sox would be on the hook for ~$7.5M of Hosmer’s salary each year for the next four seasons.  Our cut of Hosmer’s salary along with Paddack & Weathers’ salaries would roughly be the same amount of money that Manaea will make this year.

Obviously BBTV is not overly accurate, so which side says no to theoretical deal?

Jerry would never, but I would say just eat Hosmer's contract and cut him. You're basically doing $30M for two starters + Sheets for two starters under team control.

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22 minutes ago, chw42 said:

Unless our coaching staff can teach Hosmer how to lift the ball, I'm gonna hate watching him play no matter how much he's getting paid. He's basically Leury Garcia at first base. 

Also, how does the $30 million work in terms of CBT? 

I’m assuming the $30M sticks with the Padres, so the cash impact and luxury impact would be the same for the Sox (that’s how Spotrac is treating the Arenado deal).

And to be clear, I wouldn’t give a ton of playing time to Hosmer.  I’d basically let him DH a couples times a week against tough RHP.  If he can’t be successful in that role or we couldn’t find someone absorb a portion of his deal with us, I’d simply release him.  To me, this type of move is all about buying major league ready pitching depth and spreading the cost over a four year period.

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29 minutes ago, Lillian said:

Mahle and Moustakas would be intriguing. Moose would be the DH and Sheets could go to Charlotte, affording the Sox an extra year of control.  What would the Reds take, besides the salary relief? I would guess that they view Mahle as a big piece of their future, with two more years of control and haven't they talked about extending him?

You’d still have to give up a couple good prospects and/or Sheets I’d imagine.

The real challenge here is Moose’s contract is massive and would add considerable payroll, which I don’t see happening.

Also, what’s happening to Vaughn in your plan?

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11 minutes ago, Quin said:

Jerry would never, but I would say just eat Hosmer's contract and cut him. You're basically doing $30M for two starters + Sheets for two starters under team control.

Probably makes the most sense, but I’d probably keep him around for a couple months in case he shows enough to be moved for some salary relief.  If not, you’re giving ~3% of your CBT space to acquire two controllable arms that can give you innings right now.  It all comes down to how much my scouts & Katz like the two young arms.  Financially I think it could work this year and be minimally disruptive moving forward even if released.

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52 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

So this is a trade that actually works according to BaseballTradeValues:

  • CWS get: RHP Chris Paddack, Ryan Weathers, 1B Eric Hosmer, & $30M cash
  • SDP get: Gavin Sheets

This is basically the Mets trade with Sheets instead of Dom Smith and Weathers instead of Pagan.  The Sox would be on the hook for ~$7.5M of Hosmer’s salary each year for the next four seasons.  Our cut of Hosmer’s salary along with Paddack & Weathers’ salaries would roughly be the same amount of money that Manaea will make this year.

Obviously BBTV is not overly accurate, so which side says no to theoretical deal?

I'd totally do this and just shove Hosmer on the bench.

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3 minutes ago, KrankinSox said:

What would it take to get Paddack?

I feel like they would shop him for outfield help right? 

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1 minute ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said:

I'd totally do this and just shove Hosmer on the bench.

Then he's gonna b**** and moan and be a clubhouse cancer like he is in San Diego right now. No thanks. 

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so why are the Padres so hell bent on shopping Paddock? I know they have a ton of pitching but the guy is 26 years old

 

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1 minute ago, quickman said:

so why are the Padres so hell bent on shopping Paddock? I know they have a ton of pitching but the guy is 26 years old

 

Paddack is actually very similar to Giolito. Except his change up isn't as good and he doesn't have a slider like Lucas' to keep hitters more honest. But before last year, Giolito was basically a 2 pitch pitcher as well. 

One redeeming quality of Paddack is that he still had good peripherals and his velocity actually went up a bit last year. Add on the fact that the Sox developed a very similar pitcher and I think he has room to grow in the org. 

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3 minutes ago, chw42 said:

Paddack is actually very similar to Giolito. Except his change up isn't as good and he doesn't have a slider like Lucas' to keep hitters more honest. But before last year, Giolito was basically a 2 pitch pitcher as well. 

One redeeming quality of Paddack is that he still had good peripherals and his velocity actually went up a bit last year. Add on the fact that the Sox developed a very similar pitcher and I think he has room to grow in the org. 

Seeing what padres pitchers have done post-leaving makes taking a flyer on Paddack intriguing however I see him going to TB for Meadows.

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10 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

You’d still have to give up a couple good prospects and/or Sheets I’d imagine.

The real challenge here is Moose’s contract is massive and would add considerable payroll, which I don’t see happening.

Also, what’s happening to Vaughn in your plan?

I'm already in favor of having Vaughn start the year at Charlotte. Unless someone gets hurt, there aren't enough at bats for him, on this roster. He should not see any time in the outfield and between Abreu and Sheets at first base, I don't see enough playing time. Sheets really has to be in the lineup vs RHP. You know me, I just don't like having so many RH bats. Without Sheets, and the way Moncada has been struggling to hit for power, the lineup would have just one left handed power bat. That simply doesn't work, for a serious contender.  

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1 minute ago, bmags said:

Seeing what padres pitchers have done post-leaving makes taking a flyer on Paddack intriguing however I see him going to TB for Meadows.

That trade makes a lot of sense for both sides, but didn't Meadows get hurt yesterday? 

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Hosmer’s stats vs RHP since joining San Diego:

  • 2018: 124 wRC+ | 10.3% BB rate | 22.5% K rate | .167 ISO | 25.5% HR/FB
  • 2019: 103 wRC+ | 5.8% BB rate | 26.1% K rate | .184 ISO | 25.0% HR/FB
  • 2020: 161 wRC+ | 6.8% BB rate | 18.4% K rate | .266 ISO | 26.9% HR/FB
  • 2021: 109 wRC+  | 10.6% BB rate | 17.7% K rate | .128 ISO | 11.7% HR/FB

ISO, HR/FB, & Hard Hit (not shown) rates way down from his recent norms, but the K & BB rates were good and he was still 9% above league average against RHP.  He’s a strict platoon guy, but I’d probably gamble $30M on him as role player if it gets me two young arms that can help me win now.  Just got to be willing to eat the contract if it doesn’t work out.

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20 minutes ago, chw42 said:

That trade makes a lot of sense for both sides, but didn't Meadows get hurt yesterday? 

ha, did not see that. But it sounds like meadows!

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