Maggs makes his position known

[southsideirish]

OK then trade his ass right now. Listen I am not fourteen and in love with this guy. If he wants to wait until after the season then we take a risk. Trade him and get some top prospects and one starting pitcher.

I think Steff hit the nail on the head here. You can't really trade him now as his trade value is not at it's peak. If you can hold out until the trade deadline and Maggs is having a good year then his price will be much higher and we will have more teams after him, most likely. You will get the most for him at that time.

 

I also don't believe he will be cautious out there. When you are cautious and worried about getting hurt then you do get hurt. He is going to go balls out this year to put up the best numbers he can as that is how he will get a big contract. I would really doubt that Maggs plays it cautious.

 

His stock will be much higher at the trading deadline with more teams looking to add another big bat to the lineup. By that time we may also know if someone else is ready to assume his position (Reed?). That way we can trade him away for the pitching we need. I wouldn't be opposed to that Seattle trade if it is true, other than that I think we should wait until the deadline.

[SoxFanForever]

The only thing I am worried about is if Maggs were to have a slump or god forbid get injured. That would surely screw things up for us :puke

[Wong & Owens]

The guy is GG caliber LF'er.

 

Good speed for a #5 hitter

 

A clutch run-producer.

 

Hit very well in the playoffs, which many players including Tejada, Chavez, Nomar did not.

 

Has only began adjusting to two-seamers.

 

If anything, HE will fare better having seen enough MLB pitchers not the other way around.

 

At 4-5 Mill or whatever it is he is making he is definately a solid bargain....when you consider how much extra attention he brings to his team AND the kind of Asian following he has.

1) He's a very good fielder, I'll give you that.

 

2) But if they move him to #6 or #3, now his speed may be below-average. My point is, who cares where he bats in the lineup? He has OK speed, nothing special.

 

3) I think you can't call a player an overall clutch producer or choker based on one season. Is Adam Kennedy a "clutch run-producer?" Time will tell if Chop Suey keeps it up.

 

4) Er, he hit .281 for the playoffs. Good, sure, but very well? That's arguable, especially after he went 2 for 15 over the last 4 WS games.

 

5) Or, he may not be able to adjust.

 

6) I disagree. I think after having a whole season to disect how he hits, what his tendencies are, and where his trouble spots are, the pitchers will have an easier time adjusting. I think pitchers always have that advantage. It's part-and-parcel of why pitching always beats hitting when it comes down to it--Pitchers have the upper hand, and more options to choose from.

 

7) $6 million. And I would say he's worth that. My point had nothing to do with his ability to draw Asian fans.

 

I just think he's been way over-hyped, what with the "Godzilla" (he hit 16 HR's) label and all. He is a pretty damned good player, but hopefully he's not enough to keep the Yanks from a solid 3rd-place finish in the East this year.

[BrandoFan]

6) I disagree. I think after having a whole season to disect how he hits, what his tendencies are, and where his trouble spots are, the pitchers will have an easier time adjusting. I think pitchers always have that advantage. It's part-and-parcel of why pitching always beats hitting when it comes down to it--Pitchers have the upper hand, and more options to choose from.

 

I think in a first-time pitcher-hitter encounter, pitcher has an upper hand almost always.

 

They've had so much tape on him from the pitcher friend-lier perspective while Matsui did not have a SINGLE catcher's view shot of a single ML pitcher. Takes time to get used to release points, movement, velocity-- he's been going up against inferior pitching all his life. Not an easy task to adapt.

 

There was a stretch where he couldn't handle even a mediocre sinker.

 

Later he adjusted and had himself a good rookie season. Sweet compact swing.

 

Next year, I am expecting 850+ OPS and 115 RBI. Good D and solid speed and the extra money he brings in because of his name/Asian following? Icings on the cake.

 

You're right about the last few WS games....but without Matsui, they wouldn't be IN the World Series to begin with-- remember how close it came to Boston elimination? Matsui not only came through against Pedro, but also made an AWESOME baserunning jump that plated the tying run-- most middle-of-the-line-up sluggers are stopped at third on that play IMO. Drove in 12 runs in 60+ postseason at bats. Not bad for a rookie.

 

Of course of you expected Godzilla, then maybe he is overrated. I guess.

[quickman]

I think Steff hit the nail on the head here. You can't really trade him now as his trade value is not at it's peak. If you can hold out until the trade deadline and Maggs is having a good year then his price will be much higher and we will have more teams after him, most likely. You will get the most for him at that time.

 

I also don't believe he will be cautious out there. When you are cautious and worried about getting hurt then you do get hurt. He is going to go balls out this year to put up the best numbers he can as that is how he will get a big contract. I would really doubt that Maggs plays it cautious.

 

His stock will be much higher at the trading deadline with more teams looking to add another big bat to the lineup. By that time we may also know if someone else is ready to assume his position (Reed?). That way we can trade him away for the pitching we need. I wouldn't be opposed to that Seattle trade if it is true, other than that I think we should wait until the deadline.

Well rex thinks his trade value is better now than later. My point is the Whitesox should not pay this guy 14 million per. He is a nice player, solid player, real good player, but he is not worth 14 million. So get something for him either now or later. He is as good as gone to me this year. I am not investing my heart with this guy.

[Steff]

I am not investing my heart with this guy.

Jim will be happy to hear about this..

[elrockinMT]

MT, you caught me cause I honestly can not answer this question. Will we be in the hunt.. and if we are.. will it be because of Maggs..? Or will it be because Loaiza is kicking ass again? Our struggles with offense HUGE last year. They couldn't hit their way out of a wet paper bag most days. Will Aaron come on strong? Will Crede knock the cover off the ball consistantly? Will Frank tear it up again.. all year long? Not to mention Lee having another stellar year? Will those guys be able to keep producing IF Maggs is traded for pitching..? Or maybe we can trade him for a so-so RF'er to just hold his own out there? I guess it all depends on where we are in June/July. So many questions.... 

I would have to say that is the point exactly. We don't know anything about how the team and individuals in particular will perform other than we know that come opening day we are ALL even (0-0). I just think we should make the effort to keep stars like Maggs, the Big Hurt, Lee and Konerko. But, I also know that KW made an impression with failing to say Konerko and Thomas wouldn't be traded. He did say Valentin, Lee and Maggs weren't going anywhere, but not those two.

[upnorthsox]

I think Steff hit the nail on the head here. You can't really trade him now as his trade value is not at it's peak. If you can hold out until the trade deadline and Maggs is having a good year then his price will be much higher and we will have more teams after him, most likely. You will get the most for him at that time.

 

I also don't believe he will be cautious out there. When you are cautious and worried about getting hurt then you do get hurt. He is going to go balls out this year to put up the best numbers he can as that is how he will get a big contract. I would really doubt that Maggs plays it cautious.

 

His stock will be much higher at the trading deadline with more teams looking to add another big bat to the lineup. By that time we may also know if someone else is ready to assume his position (Reed?). That way we can trade him away for the pitching we need. I wouldn't be opposed to that Seattle trade if it is true, other than that I think we should wait until the deadline.

I don't believe that to be true and I believe history backs me up on this. A good example is Ray Durham, we got next to nothing for him even though he was a consistent performer having a good yr. Another example of the dangers of waiting is El Duque, I'm sure people in NY were b****ing that they coulda got more for him than Osuna if they had just waited til the deadline but guess what, they'd have gotten nothing. Zip ziltch. You could point to a guy like Ponson but he's more the exception than the rule, he had little trade value going into the season and it was only the fact that he was in a career yr that he brought what he did. In retrospect ELo should've been on the trade block too as his value will never be as high as it was in July, but then that brings up another aspect of waiting, in doing so you don't know what your own situation will be at the deadline and while making a trade may be in the long term interests of the team the here and now says making a trade would be a flipp'n disaster. Even with all the negativity this off season about the Sox, the fallout from having traded a Colon and an ELo at the deadline last yr while we were in a deadlock for the division would've been unbelievable, I know that would've been the final straw for me.

 

As to Maggs, he's a consistently good performer, in good current health, who you expect to have a good season, and he has trade demand now. Waiting only brings the possibilities of poor performance, injury, lower return because he'd only be available to the team for 2 months, and huge possible fan backlash for trading someone while in a division race.

[southsider2k5]

One of the potential prospects in the LA/Maggs rumors has been handed the 5th spot in the rotation, by the Dodgers, going into Spring Training.

 

http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb...4news&fext=.jsp

[southsideirish]

I don't believe that to be true and I believe history backs me up on this. A good example is Ray Durham, we got next to nothing for him even though he was a consistent performer having a good yr. Another example of the dangers of waiting is El Duque, I'm sure people in NY were b****ing that they coulda got more for him than Osuna if they had just waited til the deadline but guess what, they'd have gotten nothing. Zip ziltch. You could point to a guy like Ponson but he's more the exception than the rule, he had little trade value going into the season and it was only the fact that he was in a career yr that he brought what he did. In retrospect ELo should've been on the trade block too as his value will never be as high as it was in July, but then that brings up another aspect of waiting, in doing so you don't know what your own situation will be at the deadline and while making a trade may be in the long term interests of the team the here and now says making a trade would be a flipp'n disaster. Even with all the negativity this off season about the Sox, the fallout from having traded a Colon and an ELo at the deadline last yr while we were in a deadlock for the division would've been unbelievable, I know that would've been the final straw for me.

 

As to Maggs, he's a consistently good performer, in good current health, who you expect to have a good season, and he has trade demand now. Waiting only brings the possibilities of poor performance, injury, lower return because he'd only be available to the team for 2 months, and huge possible fan backlash for trading someone while in a division race.

I understand your point, but there are many that can go the other way as well. How much better off were the Rangers trading Carl Everett in the middle of the year as opposed to the beginning? I wouldn't compare Ray Durham and El Duque to Maggs, but that is just me. The only way Maggs' value goes down is if he gets injured. Even if he is having a bad year his value doesn't go down much if at all and we ask for the same thing we are asking now. If he does have a better year than before then his value is really high and we can ask for more. The only thing we fear in a situation like this is an injury and Maggs has never suffered a severe injury, so I think our odds are pretty good.

[WillieHarris2]

I think if Maggs is going to be traded then just trade him now. From what everyone has been saying he's probably not going to take the Sox's offer at the end of the year, so why would trading him now hurt anything. I think the deal would be nice because one of the prospects in the La deal has already been handed the 5th spot in the rotation and its his to lose. So heres my take, trade Maggs now because hes probably not going to do us anygood after this season.

[upnorthsox]

I understand your point, but there are many that can go the other way as well. How much better off were the Rangers trading Carl Everett in the middle of the year as opposed to the beginning? I wouldn't compare Ray Durham and El Duque to Maggs, but that is just me. The only way Maggs' value goes down is if he gets injured. Even if he is having a bad year his value doesn't go down much if at all and we ask for the same thing we are asking now. If he does have a better year than before then his value is really high and we can ask for more. The only thing we fear in a situation like this is an injury and Maggs has never suffered a severe injury, so I think our odds are pretty good.

Carl Everett? Thanks for another good example of what can happen by waiting, we could get stuck picking up a good portion of the $6 mil that'd be remaining on Magg's just to move him. Everett's value didn't rise during the season, in fact if the Rangers had said they'd pay his entire $9 mil salary for the yr(which is what they ended up doing) before the season started they'd have gotten more than what they got from us.

 

I never compared Ray and El Duque to Maggs, but since you mentioned it, who was the last player of Magg's stature(no pitchers) to be traded at the deadline and what did they get for him?

 

And who's your trading partner? The same guys as now? But of course they'd all rather wait til the trade deadline to pay more for Magg's yet only have him available for 2 months, and of course they're going to give up a starting pitcher to get him.

 

So all we have to do is sit back and hope that Maggs doesn't get hurt, doesn't go Konerko, and that we fall hopelessly out of contention, so that some team with extra pitching, loads of good prospects, and tons of cash can swoop in and pay more for a 2 month rental than they would've for the entire yr. Sounds like a plan to me?

[C.Rector]

I don't believe that to be true and I believe history backs me up on this.

This is true. Its either we trade the greedy pig GIDP'er Ordonez now or we just forget about it.

[BrandoFan]

This is true.  Its either we trade the greedy pig GIDP'er Ordonez now or we just forget about it.

Ok, fine.

 

I'll take 140 RBI OR a 1100 OPS.

 

Seeing as I am in a particularly forgiving mood.

 

ESPN actually says Maggs has recently inquired about a 4 year, 60 Mill el raiso.

 

The balls.

[YASNY]

Ok, fine.

 

I'll take 140 RBI OR a 1100 OPS. 

 

Seeing as I am in a particularly forgiving mood.

 

ESPN actually says Maggs has recently inquired about a 4 year, 60 Mill el raiso.

 

The balls.

If he is asking for that, and the Sox have offered a 4/48 ... Seems like they should be able to come to an agreement somewhere in the middle.

[BrandoFan]

If he is asking for that, and the Sox have offered a 4/48 ... Seems like they should be able to come to an agreement somewhere in the middle.

Hitters who deserve to take up 20 % of the payroll:

 

-Bonds

-A-Rod

-Pujols

-Sosa (of 1998-2001)

-Griffey (of 1997-1998)

-Thomas (of 1993-1994)

-Vlad Guerrero (sans bulging disc)

-Larry Walker (circa 1997)

-I-Rod (circa 2000)

-Piazza (late 90s)

-Sheffield (ditto)

-Garciappara (first 3 years in the league)

-Big Mac (1997-1999)

-Edmonds (as a Cardinal...and injury free)

 

Maggs making 13.5 Mill (meeting Sox midway) only makes sense of he has the kind of season I delineated above OR if the Sox payroll swells to 70+ Mill.