LostInBoston Posted February 16, 2004 Share Posted February 16, 2004 Link Perhaps some national exposure will force JR into a corner... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upnorthsox Posted February 16, 2004 Share Posted February 16, 2004 Not likely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JimH Posted February 16, 2004 Share Posted February 16, 2004 Excellent article. Sums up what a lot of White Sox fans seem to be feeling these days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 16, 2004 Share Posted February 16, 2004 Who is this guy Jay Mariotti? I guess he doesn't check his facts because Bill Melton wasn't at the Q and A session that has become so legendary. Plus to call a game at Wrigley more accessible than Comiskey? Is this guy ignorant or what? Wrigley is a perpetual gridlock at gametime. What garbage. I know it is cool to knock JR, but the guy could at least make some attempt to know what he is talking about Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesox61382 Posted February 16, 2004 Share Posted February 16, 2004 I really don't like Rosenthal. While this article is nothing new for Sox fans and pretty accurate, he tends to be extremely negative, especially towards the Sox. Even when the Sox are doing well it seems that Rosenthal has something negative to say. He is the sportingnews version of Jay Mariotti IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queen Prawn Posted February 16, 2004 Share Posted February 16, 2004 I really don't like Rosenthal. While this article is nothing new for Sox fans and pretty accurate, he tends to be extremely negative, especially towards the Sox. Even when the Sox are doing well it seems that Rosenthal has something negative to say. He is the sportingnews version of Jay Mariotti IMO. I gotta agree with this post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JimH Posted February 16, 2004 Share Posted February 16, 2004 Who is this guy Jay Mariotti? I guess he doesn't check his facts because Bill Melton wasn't at the Q and A session that has become so legendary. Plus to call a game at Wrigley more accessible than Comiskey? Is this guy ignorant or what? Wrigley is a perpetual gridlock at gametime. What garbage. I know it is cool to knock JR, but the guy could at least make some attempt to know what he is talking about What he was saying about Bill Melton intervening was at the fantasy camp which I guess was in Arizona. He wasn't referring to Melton being at the Sox Fest Friday night thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted February 16, 2004 Share Posted February 16, 2004 I'm not a big Rosenthal fan and while I think this is a solid piece, I still can't blame JR/Kenny for not giving Gordon or Colon the money they got. I also think the Sox are going to surprise some people. I blame JR for a lot of things, I think the biggest flaw is his public image. I don't blame him for not being willing to lose 15 mill a season (heck, whats has that gotten the Dodgers lately) but I do think he gets himself into this with all the pr nightmares the Sox have. Stop telling the fans to come, simply market things well and when a team has a shot, go out and make the move (I think they did that last year and I still don't know how this team didn't make the playoffs, let alone get to the series - Thank You Jerry Manuel and others). And Rosenthal better realize a lot of those bad contracts will be coming off the books and next year the Sox will have some room to add some players, the problem is they may lose Ordonez, something I fear, especially if they get nothing for him, since I don't think they will offer him arbitration. What the Sox need to do is make Ordonez a player that will go above and beyond their resources. He is one of the 5 best right fielders in the game and deserves to be paid fairly. Now his demands right now (Well the reported ones) aren't fair, but keep working and get a 3-4 year deal in place. Koch, he's probably gone, same with Jose after the season as well as a few others possibly. Of course then you have the issue of re-upping with Elo, which could be difficult if he duplicates next year. All I know is the Sox are going to have to win this year, or this team is going to be completely blown up and will be starting over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greasywheels121 Posted February 16, 2004 Share Posted February 16, 2004 Though not all his facts are straight, he gets the point out to the masses. Great article. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSF Posted February 16, 2004 Share Posted February 16, 2004 Colon's strikeouts have gone down and his walks up. And Gordon is a curveball away from the 60 day DL. The only player the Sox lost who I wish they could've kept was Graffy, and he wanted a starting job, so you can't fault him for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnB Posted February 16, 2004 Share Posted February 16, 2004 Pretty good article, maybe this national exposure might help us out, not bloody likely, but hey.......maybe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitesox61382 Posted February 16, 2004 Share Posted February 16, 2004 The one issue I have with JR is that you need to take a chance every now and than to come out ahead. I am sure that he became wealthy by taking a chance here and there. Unfortunately the Sox are in an endless cycle in which JR says he will spend money if the fans support the Sox, and the fans say they will support this team if they are winning. Unless the Sox get a huge boost from the minor league system this is a cycle that will be hard to end, however, I saw a window of oppurtinity this year. With the Central being so weak I think the Sox could have put themselves over the top by adding 1 more starter(say a Maddux for example). The payroll would be around 70M(give or take a mil), but the Sox would be clear favorites to win the Central and that should help bring the fans back to some degree, especially if the Sox make the playoffs. I saw this offseason as a chance to end this dreadful cycle that the Sox are in, but instead JR stood still and might not get another golden oppurtinity. Thats my only beef with JR. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upnorthsox Posted February 16, 2004 Share Posted February 16, 2004 Colon's strikeouts have gone down and his walks up. And Gordon is a curveball away from the 60 day DL. The only player the Sox lost who I wish they could've kept was Graffy, and he wanted a starting job, so you can't fault him for that. Right, we're a much better team now! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
haroldbainesknees Posted February 17, 2004 Share Posted February 17, 2004 I agree 100% with this article. While Rosenthal's facts may be inaccurate, the premise of the article is right on target. I challenge any fellow sox fan to convince me that this team is committed to winning. Sadly, I think the worse thing to happen in the past two years is for mid level payroll teams to win the title. Reinsdorf now seems more concerned with pulling a one year hitch ala the Marlins and Angels than seriously acting like he wants the sox to contend annualy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WillieHarris2 Posted February 17, 2004 Share Posted February 17, 2004 I agree 100% with this article. While Rosenthal's facts may be inaccurate, the premise of the article is right on target. I challenge any fellow sox fan to convince me that this team is committed to winning. Sadly, I think the worse thing to happen in the past two years is for mid level payroll teams to win the title. Reinsdorf now seems more concerned with pulling a one year hitch ala the Marlins and Angels than seriously acting like he wants the sox to contend annualy. Agreed. I think its every teams goal to win a championship but the sox just wont make the right moves or spend the money to do it. They can say its there goal but will it ever be met? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 17, 2004 Share Posted February 17, 2004 I agree 100% with this article. While Rosenthal's facts may be inaccurate, the premise of the article is right on target. I challenge any fellow sox fan to convince me that this team is committed to winning. Sadly, I think the worse thing to happen in the past two years is for mid level payroll teams to win the title. Reinsdorf now seems more concerned with pulling a one year hitch ala the Marlins and Angels than seriously acting like he wants the sox to contend annualy. This guy is a national columnist. It is VITAL that his facts are correct. Remember the guy from the NY Times? If a writer doesn't have his integrity, he has nothing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Rector Posted February 17, 2004 Share Posted February 17, 2004 This article, by a guy who looks like he wears lipstick or something, is garbage. The Sox did not lose much other than Graffanino and Everett and the latter should be replaced quite well by Rowand playing full time. Alomar, Colon and Gordon are all on the decline and Sullivan is just another guy who did well in the NL, but couldn't make the transition to the AL with its DH rule well. Rosenthal writes, "The anger in Chicago is palpable. " From what I've seen and heard from the Sox fans I know, they are looking at the new season pretty much the same way that they normally do: hope for the best and have fun watching the Sox on TV and/or listening to them on the radio. The Sox have done a good job in the Rule V Draft and in signing folks to minor league contracts, so there should be a pretty spirited competition for pitching slots in Spring Training. As for the Cubs, they've done well in adding to their bullpen, but they've downgraded at catcher and face a situation that unless they can sign either Maddux or some other pitching talent, where their regular rotation might collapse under the exactions of Dusty Baker the pitcher torturer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baggio202 Posted February 17, 2004 Share Posted February 17, 2004 This article, by a guy who looks like he wears lipstick or something, is garbage. The Sox did not lose much other than Graffanino and Everett and the latter should be replaced quite well by Rowand playing full time. Alomar, Colon and Gordon are all on the decline and Sullivan is just another guy who did well in the NL, but couldn't make the transition to the AL with its DH rule well. Rosenthal writes, "The anger in Chicago is palpable. " From what I've seen and heard from the Sox fans I know, they are looking at the new season pretty much the same way that they normally do: hope for the best and have fun watching the Sox on TV and/or listening to them on the radio. The Sox have done a good job in the Rule V Draft and in signing folks to minor league contracts, so there should be a pretty spirited competition for pitching slots in Spring Training. As for the Cubs, they've done well in adding to their bullpen, but they've downgraded at catcher and face a situation that unless they can sign either Maddux or some other pitching talent, where their regular rotation might collapse under the exactions of Dusty Baker the pitcher torturer. "Sullivan is just another guy who did well in the NL, but couldn't make the transition to the AL with its DH rule well." ...his entire AL career has been a couple months with the sox...pitched 14 2/3 innings for us...only gave up 9 hits and had 13k's...his 3.77 era with us is lower than his career 3.91 era...he basically did for us what he has been doing in cincy for years Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted February 17, 2004 Share Posted February 17, 2004 Whether or not the loss of those 6 free agents will hurt the team is a moot point as far as I'm concerned, in relation to this article. Rosenthal is right on the money as far as Reinsdorf's image and the perception the fans have of him. Twenty plus years of his "marketing genious" and utter failure at producing a championship has left Sox fans fed up, to put it politely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upnorthsox Posted February 17, 2004 Share Posted February 17, 2004 This guy is a national columnist. It is VITAL that his facts are correct. Remember the guy from the NY Times? If a writer doesn't have his integrity, he has nothing. I'm not sure what "Facts" you're talking about, as to the impact of losing 7 FA's that's a matter of opinion not fact and one that's still hotly contested around here. As to ease of access, he does give his reasoning for why he thinks so and for someone like me coming from the north suburbs Wrigley actually is easier to access. Besides, he could've quoted JR on that who has repeatedly blamed traffic for lower attendance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmmmmbeeer Posted February 17, 2004 Share Posted February 17, 2004 Agreed. I think its every teams goal to win a championship but the sox just wont make the right moves or spend the money to do it. They can say its there goal but will it ever be met? That's where I disagree. I think that 2003 we had the right components on the field. The moves were made, especially at the trade deadline, to have a winner. If there were ever a white sox team that should've caught lightning in a bottle, that was the team. I don't know about you, but while watching the Sox play the way they did that month and a half after the ASB last season I thought they were BY FAR the best team in baseball at that point. They choked. The only move that wasn't made last season was to fire JM in May or June. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upnorthsox Posted February 17, 2004 Share Posted February 17, 2004 That's where I disagree. I think that 2003 we had the right components on the field. The moves were made, especially at the trade deadline, to have a winner. If there were ever a white sox team that should've caught lightning in a bottle, that was the team. I don't know about you, but while watching the Sox play the way they did that month and a half after the ASB last season I thought they were BY FAR the best team in baseball at that point. They choked. The only move that wasn't made last season was to fire JM in May or June. And I would differ with that, yes the tried to seize the opportunity last yr, so did KC, but that's not the same as a commitment to winning a championship. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Rector Posted February 17, 2004 Share Posted February 17, 2004 "Sullivan is just another guy who did well in the NL, but couldn't make the transition to the AL with its DH rule well." ...his entire AL career has been a couple months with the sox...pitched 14 2/3 innings for us...only gave up 9 hits and had 13k's...his 3.77 era with us is lower than his career 3.91 era...he basically did for us what he has been doing in cincy for years Sullivan's ERA when the trade was made was a bit under the 3.77 mark, so his performance worsened after moving over to the AL. In any event, the only reason why the Sox picked him up in the first place was in a trade to get rid of the worthless D'Angelo. When the Sox "lost" Sullivan, the team wasn't really losing anyone. KC fans will rue the day that their GM decided that picking up Sullivan would be a bright idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queen Prawn Posted February 17, 2004 Share Posted February 17, 2004 A bit is definitely a good adjective here - 3.62 according to bigleaguers.yahoo.com I gotta disagree here - I think KC got a decent deal when they picked up Sullivan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
upnorthsox Posted February 17, 2004 Share Posted February 17, 2004 Sullivan's ERA when the trade was made was a bit under the 3.77 mark, so his performance worsened after moving over to the AL. In any event, the only reason why the Sox picked him up in the first place was in a trade to get rid of the worthless D'Angelo. When the Sox "lost" Sullivan, the team wasn't really losing anyone. KC fans will rue the day that their GM decided that picking up Sullivan would be a bright idea. We traded Tim Hummel for Sullivan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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