knightni Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 From a Mariners Baseball Blog: (http://ussmariner.blogspot.com/) Freddy Garcia and Ben Davis for Jeremy Reed, Miguel Olivo, and Michael Morse. Congratulations Bill Bavasi. Seriously, let me say this again. Congratulations Bill Bavasi. This is probably one of the best player-for-prospect hauls any team has gotten since the Bartolo Colon to Montreal trade. Since the White Sox farm system is essentially based in North Carolina (their Double-A team is the only one not within an hour of my house), I've seen all these guys extensively, and this is basically the heart of the Sox system. Reed is a healthy version of Chris Snelling with a few more walks and a few less singles. Prospectus was a bit nuts when they called him the 2nd best prospect in the game this spring, but he's legit top 20. He's got line drive power and a very compact swing, makes great contact, and knows the strike zone. His swing won't let him develop much more home run power, but his offensive game is tailored for the top of the order. In his prime, he should hit .290/.380/.450, which is a quality player. He's got a great chance to be the next Rusty Greer. Defensively, he's a corner outfielder. The M's might dream that he can fill the need in center, but he just doesn't have the range to be an asset there. He can play right or left well, and center in an emergency, but they should still be searching for a permanent CF. Miguel Olivo is a league average catcher right now. He has a bit of a long swing and won't ever win a batting title, but he has above average power and runs well to boot. He's hitting .270/.316/.496, making him not only our best catcher, but probably our fourth best hitter. He's only in his second year, meaning he's making peanuts for the next two, maybe three years. He's not the catcher of the future-he's the catcher of the present. At 25 years old, he still could turn into a Jason Varitek type player. Michael Morse is a decent hitting prospect with line drive power and a nice swing. He's also abysmal defensively. I watched him probably 30 times last year in Winston-Salem, and he's the worst defensive SS I've ever seen. He doesn't have the footwork or instincts to play third, either. He should probably end up in left field or at first base, and there were a few nights I thought he should DH. But the swing was always there, and he's had a breakout offensive season at Double-A. There are attitude problems involved, though, as he was just suspended for 2 weeks for violating a team rule. He's never been the hardest worker, and motivation can be a problem. He's definitely not a choir boy, but he can hit. Seriously, this trade is so much better than what the Royals got for Beltran it isn't funny. Reed is now our top prospect, Olivo our best catcher, and Morse is about as interesting a bat as you'll find in the system, even if he has nowhere to play. Making them pay Ben Davis' salary the rest of the year is icing on the cake. Seriously, just a fantastic trade for the Mariners. Great deal, Bill. Very well done :fyou :fyou :fyou :fyou :fyou :fyou Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JUGGERNAUT Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 The belief is that these golf buddies are so close that if there is any front line pitcher the SOX have a shot at signing long term it's this guy. The OZ impact may have Garcia as the SOX ace for years to come. As you say if you think of this as Bradford, Reed for Garcia, Davis, & cash it's a lot better to digest. But that ignores the improvement Olivo has made this year. You should look at it from what's a player worth today? Olivo is rated the 24th best part-time hitter in the AL. Reed is a AAA all-star power-hitting RF. And Morse was likely to be the future SS of the SOX. Ben Davis is one of the worst bench hitters in the AL this year. He's likely not to make the team next year. Garcia is the 4th best pitcher in the AL this year. With an NPERA of 2.82 he's not far from being the 3rd best. In 2003, 2002 he finished in the top 25 in the AL. So arguably Garcia is at his best. When you look at it from that perspective, the SOX probably gave up less than Garcia's presently worth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 Ya wanna keep your name? I dunno yet.. I don't wanna turn into the next young gun/notown/Wsox143.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted June 28, 2004 Share Posted June 28, 2004 Oh ya, I should add, Garcia is an ace and who knows, but I think its safe to say another deal is coming up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted June 28, 2004 Share Posted June 28, 2004 Jas is right, Olivo only plays partially and he is not one of the main reasons we are 1 game out at this point, I do hate to see him go though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HighHeat45 Posted June 28, 2004 Share Posted June 28, 2004 I dont know if this was posted, i havent read every single post but ben davis batting average so far .091 He better go strait to the minors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted June 28, 2004 Share Posted June 28, 2004 KW you better sign Garcia to an extension. If you don't you gave up a f***ing ton for a rent-a-player. We'll have the same chance as we would have if we didn't trade for him. Trading Olivo et. al. didn't help our chaces in the off season free agent derby for his services. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greasywheels121 Posted June 28, 2004 Share Posted June 28, 2004 Jas is right, Olivo only plays partially and he is not one of the main reasons we are 1 game out at this point, I do hate to see him go though. Agreed. The more this trade sinks in, the more I'm liking it. We needed a SP, and KW got the best available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast Posted June 28, 2004 Share Posted June 28, 2004 I like this trade, I mean I really LOVE this trade. We have so many options now! We can sign Magglio to an extension, and Kenny Williams said that they would re-sign so they could have a future for these guys in the Chicago White Sox organization. Whoa, a big loss in Olivo. Yeah, just think if we didn't have him, you would be b****ing for a catcher. He'll be a career .250 hitter. Also, besides Rex, who of you has seen Reed play? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted June 28, 2004 Share Posted June 28, 2004 The belief is that these golf buddies are so close that if there is any front line pitcher the SOX have a shot at signing long term it's this guy. The OZ impact may have Garcia as the SOX ace for years to come. As you say if you think of this as Bradford, Reed for Garcia, Davis, & cash it's a lot better to digest. But that ignores the improvement Olivo has made this year. You should look at it from what's a player worth today? Olivo is rated the 24th best part-time hitter in the AL. Reed is a AAA all-star power-hitting RF. And Morse was likely to be the future SS of the SOX. Ben Davis is one of the worst bench hitters in the AL this year. He's likely not to make the team next year. Garcia is the 4th best pitcher in the AL this year. With an NPERA of 2.82 he's not far from being the 3rd best. In 2003, 2002 he finished in the top 25 in the AL. So arguably Garcia is at his best. When you look at it from that perspective, the SOX probably gave up less than Garcia's presently worth. Guys, I'd say you throw Morse out of this. He may be able to make it, but it won't be as a middle infielder and I still think his swing has some major flaws. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queen Prawn Posted June 28, 2004 Share Posted June 28, 2004 Seriously, this trade is so much better than what the Royals got for Beltran it isn't funny. Reed is now our top prospect, Olivo our best catcher, and Morse is about as interesting a bat as you'll find in the system, even if he has nowhere to play. Making them pay Ben Davis' salary the rest of the year is icing on the cake. I thought Seattle was sending us cash? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wise Master Buehrle Posted June 28, 2004 Share Posted June 28, 2004 Davis is making 1.4 million. We'd better be getting the cash to pay that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast Posted June 28, 2004 Share Posted June 28, 2004 I thought Seattle was sending us cash? Seattle is sending us cash, he doesn't know what he's talking about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammerhead johnson Posted June 28, 2004 Share Posted June 28, 2004 A)And he was the minor league player of the year too... just like Jon Rauch. B)Why when talking about Reed does everyone talk about what he did last year? Why not this year in AAA? Why not about how he looked LOST in Spring Training? C)Just because you are a good minor leaguer doesn't mean you will be a good major leaguer. *I am sad to see Olivo go, but never got attached to Reed so maybe I am wrong... but going to Spring Training made me more excited for Sweeney than Reed. You said that you were never impressed with Reed. What, did you just start following the Sox this year? Because that would explain it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aboz56 Posted June 28, 2004 Share Posted June 28, 2004 I like this trade, I mean I really LOVE this trade. We have so many options now! We can sign Magglio to an extension, and Kenny Williams said that they would re-sign so they could have a future for these guys in the Chicago White Sox organization. Whoa, a big loss in Olivo. Yeah, just think if we didn't have him, you would be b****ing for a catcher. He'll be a career .250 hitter. Also, besides Rex, who of you has seen Reed play? I have and he is a future stud and a stand up guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HighHeat45 Posted June 28, 2004 Share Posted June 28, 2004 Reed is a AAA all-star power-hitting RF. I thought he had Very little power Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted June 28, 2004 Share Posted June 28, 2004 :fyou :fyou :fyou :fyou :fyou :fyou He's right though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted June 28, 2004 Share Posted June 28, 2004 Reed>Borchard Reed>Borchard Reed>Borchard Reed>Borchard Reed>Borchard Reed>Borchard Reed>Borchard Reed>Borchard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast Posted June 28, 2004 Share Posted June 28, 2004 I have and he is a future stud and a stand up guy. He'll never live up to be the .400 hitter he was. Excuse me, he's hitting .279? He'll be a .300/10 hitter. Yeah thats nice, but Magglio will do better than that. Garcia and Ordonez will be back next year, and thats a guarantee. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted June 28, 2004 Share Posted June 28, 2004 Does Davis bat a right or left handed stick?? He's a switch hitter, although its been suggested he give up batting LH. He used to be a stud prospect. Maybe hitting in a bandbox rather than a national park will help him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gene Honda Civic Posted June 28, 2004 Share Posted June 28, 2004 :fyou :fyou :fyou :fyou :fyou :fyou Don't be mad, it's the truth.. His analysis of MO is a little off. He doesn't note the considerable power he has shown this season. And I think his Defense has been overrated here, especially this season. But overall, this trade is a loss for the sox, unless they can do two things: Sign Garcia long-term, or win a WS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2HH Posted June 28, 2004 Share Posted June 28, 2004 I thought he had Very little power Reed doesn't have power...this is yet again, a case of people repeating stuff they've "heard". Fact is, Reed batted 400 last season, and whats he at this year...now that people have figured out how to pitch to him in the MINORS...what, .280 or something?! Oh yeah, and he has almost NO power. Just checked, Reed is batting .273 with 8HR in 264AB...yeah, tons and tons of power and contact. The only thing in this trade I'll miss is Olivo, and even then...he platooned as the Sox #9 (AKA WORST hitter on the team) batter with Alomar AND Burke. -y2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HighHeat45 Posted June 28, 2004 Share Posted June 28, 2004 Reed>Borchard Reed>Borchard Reed>Borchard Reed>Borchard Reed>Borchard Reed>Borchard Reed>Borchard Reed>Borchard Im assuming your new name will be JBorchardFan And you probably should switch reeds pic in your sig with Borchards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beast Posted June 28, 2004 Share Posted June 28, 2004 To add another comment. Olivo will never be an Allstar. (Not from me, but from a brilliant mind of galliance) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammerhead johnson Posted June 28, 2004 Share Posted June 28, 2004 And Morse was likely to be the future SS of the SOX. That article says that he is brutal defensively. There's no way in hell that he was our future SS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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